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Here's some Southern old money. Well, probably not money, but impeccable lineage anyway. Thomas Jefferson's great, great, great, great, great, great grandchildren.
I was just wondering what yankees impressions of old moneyed southern upper crusters was? We all know the stereotypes about poor southern "rednecks" but what about the old moneyed people living in Charleston or along the Garden District in New Orleans.
You never hear yankees talk about them, they always talk about Appalachia or trailer trash or whatever, so I'd like to know your thoughts on that.
Do they consider them like the Boston "Brahmins" or the old money of the Hamptons? Or is it another class altogether. What about Texas oil millionaires/billionaires?
It's another class all together. People standing around saying, "Why, I do declare that I'm going to do [yada yada]."
Putting women on the highest of old money pedestals. It wouldn't surprise me if some of these women's muscles have atrophied from non-use. They're simply bed-ridden now at the ripe old age of 40.
Don't get me wrong, women can be placed on pedestals anywhere in the world, but in the south, they can really go all out! Give those Southern Belles your all!
Very true (and perfectly phrased). Belle Meade exists as a reaction against the clueless glitz of the rich white trash in the Country Music Industry. My impression is that Belle Meade, while home to many 'Real People' is also rife with fake old families, who build repressed Colonialesque mansions (https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com...38c530bea4.jpg) mimicking the Depression Era Phoney Coloney mansions of previous generations of fake old money.
The Southern understanding of the word 'Yankee' is dependent upon context (as is all language in the South). Southerners who know things (as opposed to those who know NOTHING that hasn't been fed to them by Cable TV) can distinguish between the use of the word 'Yankee', to describe Old Stock Northerners of hardy Founding Stock (Pre-revolutionary families), and 'Yankee' as a slur word, to describe crass, aggressive, ruthless New York Megalopolis/Detroit Megalopolis/Chicago Megalopolis immigrant-descended guttersnipes.
So, while we can switch between 'Yankee', in the context of "Those lovely people we met in Upstate New York. I felt so at home. And you know, their last name is Robinette, just like OUR Robinettes! I've told you before, that the girls I went to school with from Southampton and Darien were OK, too. And Maine people are totally fine -true Yankees in the best sense - except for their seriously good-lookin' underclass, who are a real problem. But those came down out of Quebec.", and 'Yankee', in the context of "It was awful. Mother, we went to a place called 'The Boardy Barn' (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2466_V1LF2o), and those people were the nastiest bunch o' Yankees you ever saw. If you crossed a chainsaw with a seagull, that's what the girls sounded like. People like that aren't supposed to be out here! We should have just stayed in Southampton with you and Daddy."
... or "He's some slimehead Yankee who came down out of New York, trainin' at Morgan Stanley. He tried to sell Babette on a bunch of (insert stupid investments here), and she's put the word out on him, at Temple, where he's getting the cold shoulder, bigtime. Bitsi's put out the word at Saint Andrew's. I don't know if he's a nebbish or a gonif, but he thinks we dumb Southerners are easy marks for his mishegoss. I rented him our old penthouse, in the ----, and he was all charm and smiles, and like "Will you be my new best friend?", until the second the lease was signed, and then he was like, "What are YOU hangin' around smilin' for? I've already conned you. You can go die, now". Typical New Yorker. They're so in for the Short Con - and like you have to con somebody, to rent a damn apartment, down here, anyway. He could have been his regular nasty self, and I still would have rented him the place. I know his boss. I know how to end his career, if he trashes the place. I 'spect he'll be killing himself like so many Yankees do, down here. Somebody'll eat his lunch, in a big way."
But in the same way that the South's clueless classes are unable to distinguish between the good and bad contexts for the word 'Yankee' (or spell the word, or define the word, or find Maine on a map... or find 'North' on a map...), the clueless classes of the North would be unable to tell you what 'Old Money' or 'Old Family' even means. They probably would think, if forced to think, that "Old Money" means you drive a Ferrari and drink wine. ...or that you're old and have money.
So, I suspect that 'Yankees', in the bad sense of the word, are unaware that there are different classes of Southerners. They don't know a good Southern accent from a bad one. And they don't understand that wealth and social class do not necessarily correlate. In my experience, they hear a Southern accent, and they automatically think "Poor, stupid, and ignorant".
Yankees, in the good sense of the word, know history. They know things. They understand the history and implications of demographic/social trends in New England, and understand that those trends have counterparts in the South. They know about the Patroons of New York, and may know about the Sephardic Diaspora and the Norman Conquest. Because they have a wider understanding of the world, they are more able to understand what "Old Money Southern Upper Crust" means, and so would be more able to recognize members of that group.
I guess I qualify as a Northerner. What do I think of upper crust old southern money society? On any given day, that would probably be the last thing on my mind. In fact, until I came across this thread, I might have gone the entire rest of my life without thinking about it at all. But if I had to venture a guess, I'd say that people don't really have a bad impression of the old money South. One of those things that's there, but doesn't matter.
Times have changed. Class distinctions aren't what they used to be. They exist, to be sure, but it's not a topic most people have time to worry about.
this thread seems to be about 'old money" , the southern gentry was based on europe and the landed gentry in europe, it was based around land and ancestral homes. I dont think alot of the southern aristocracy, outside of the people with ancestral homes, have lasted the way something like the english has because it didnt have alot of their privileges the british nobility had , the english aristocracy get titles and used to get the right to be in the House of Lords.
I know there are alot of upper class virginians and maryland people who would love a downton abbey like culture and alot of upper class americans who would like a peerage or nobility system or something like that , but I think people would hate you if you were introduced as lord so and so, the duke of so and so, the queen of denial, lol
I do like downton abbey though and we owe alot to the John Montagu, the 4th Earl of Sandwich . for obvious reasons
Actually, did you know that New York City wanted to side with the Confederacy because of all the cotton traders that would come up from Mississippi to trade in the Big Apple?
"By the early 19th century, cotton had become the Delta’s premier crop, for which there was high international demand. Mills in New England and New York also demanded cotton for their industry, and New York City was closely tied to the cotton trade. Many southern planters traveled so frequently there for business that they had favorite hotels. From 1822 cotton-related exports comprised half of all exports from the port of New York City.[9]
In 1861 Democratic mayor Fernando Wood called for secession of New York City because of its close business ties to the South.[10] Eventually the city joined the state in supporting the war, but immigrants resented having to fight when the wealthy could buy their way out of military service..."
Very true (and perfectly phrased). Belle Meade exists as a reaction against the clueless glitz of the rich white trash in the Country Music Industry. My impression is that Belle Meade, while home to many 'Real People' is also rife with fake old families, who build repressed Colonialesque mansions (https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com...38c530bea4.jpg) mimicking the Depression Era Phoney Coloney mansions of previous generations of fake old money.
The Southern understanding of the word 'Yankee' is dependent upon context (as is all language in the South). Southerners who know things (as opposed to those who know NOTHING that hasn't been fed to them by Cable TV) can distinguish between the use of the word 'Yankee', to describe Old Stock Northerners of hardy Founding Stock (Pre-revolutionary families), and 'Yankee' as a slur word, to describe crass, aggressive, ruthless New York Megalopolis/Detroit Megalopolis/Chicago Megalopolis immigrant-descended guttersnipes.
So, while we can switch between 'Yankee', in the context of "Those lovely people we met in Upstate New York. I felt so at home. And you know, their last name is Robinette, just like OUR Robinettes! I've told you before, that the girls I went to school with from Southampton and Darien were OK, too. And Maine people are totally fine -true Yankees in the best sense - except for their seriously good-lookin' underclass, who are a real problem. But those came down out of Quebec.", and 'Yankee', in the context of "It was awful. Mother, we went to a place called 'The Boardy Barn' ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2466_V1LF2o), and those people were the nastiest bunch o' Yankees you ever saw. If you crossed a chainsaw with a seagull, that's what the girls sounded like. People like that aren't supposed to be out here! We should have just stayed in Southampton with you and Daddy."
... or "He's some slimehead Yankee who came down out of New York, trainin' at Morgan Stanley. He tried to sell Babette on a bunch of (insert stupid investments here), and she's put the word out on him, at Temple, where he's getting the cold shoulder, bigtime. Bitsi's put out the word at Saint Andrew's. I don't know if he's a nebbish or a gonif, but he thinks we dumb Southerners are easy marks for his mishegoss. I rented him our old penthouse, in the ----, and he was all charm and smiles, and like "Will you be my new best friend?", until the second the lease was signed, and then he was like, "What are YOU hangin' around smilin' for? I've already conned you. You can go die, now". Typical New Yorker. They're so in for the Short Con - and like you have to con somebody, to rent a damn apartment, down here, anyway. He could have been his regular nasty self, and I still would have rented him the place. I know his boss. I know how to end his career, if he trashes the place. I 'spect he'll be killing himself like so many Yankees do, down here. Somebody'll eat his lunch, in a big way."
But in the same way that the South's clueless classes are unable to distinguish between the good and bad contexts for the word 'Yankee' (or spell the word, or define the word, or find Maine on a map... or find 'North' on a map...), the clueless classes of the North would be unable to tell you what 'Old Money' or 'Old Family' even means. They probably would think, if forced to think, that "Old Money" means you drive a Ferrari and drink wine. ...or that you're old and have money.
So, I suspect that 'Yankees', in the bad sense of the word, are unaware that there are different classes of Southerners. They don't know a good Southern accent from a bad one. And they don't understand that wealth and social class do not necessarily correlate. In my experience, they hear a Southern accent, and they automatically think "Poor, stupid, and ignorant".
Yankees, in the good sense of the word, know history. They know things. They understand the history and implications of demographic/social trends in New England, and understand that those trends have counterparts in the South. They know about the Patroons of New York, and may know about the Sephardic Diaspora and the Norman Conquest. Because they have a wider understanding of the world, they are more able to understand what "Old Money Southern Upper Crust" means, and so would be more able to recognize members of that group.
In college I was driving back from my university in the Northeast with my friend (and roommate) back to my home state of Louisiana and we stopped in Nashville to visit another friend (and fellow college student) and stayed at his house.
He happened to live in a very ritzy neighborhood in Brentwood, all lots had at least five acres and there were many country music stars that lived in the same subdivision as he did.
All of the homes were gigantic and were more of the order of something you would see in Dallas (new money) than you would have expected to see in Nashville. No "Belle Meade" look but more like this:
That happens to be Sean Payton's (coach of the Saints) ex-wife's home. He bought that for her as part of the divorce settlement. He lives in a condo in New Orleans.
So I don't really agree that "new money" goes for Colonial in the Nashville area. More like brand new, modern, large, with large lots.
I don't know but down here in New Mexico we don't really have old money or new money lol
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