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Old 02-27-2017, 11:26 AM
 
Location: 32°19'03.7"N 106°43'55.9"W
9,375 posts, read 20,801,239 times
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Great article and sounds like a great book on the way from Tyler Cowen. The book is called The Complacent Class: The Self Defeating Quest for the American Dream.


Time Magazine piece: American Threat: We Need to Move More | Time.com


Some interesting excerpts:


"Americans traditionally have thought of themselves as the great movers, and indeed that was true in the nineteenth century and even through most of the twentieth. But since the 1980s, Americans have become much less restless in movements across the country, and more people are looking to simply settle down and entrench themselves.
Here is this change in a single number: The interstate migration rate has fallen 51 percent below its 1948–1971 average, and that number has been falling steadily since the mid-1980s. Or, if we look at the rate of moving between counties within a state, it fell 31 percent. The rate of moving within a county fell 38 percent. Those are pretty steep drops for a country that has not changed its fundamental economic or political systems."


And: "One big reason for the decline in residential moving stems from a decline in job switching. If people are less likely to change jobs, they are also, for obvious reasons, less likely to move. And if we look at job reallocation rates—a rough measure of turnover in the labor market—they have fallen more than a quarter since 1990."


Finally: "Another factor in the decline of American geographic mobility is the decline in American geographic diversity. That is, different parts of the country are no longer so dissimilar from each other in economic terms. Since the golden age of manufacturing in the postwar era, American regions have lost much of their distinct economic flavor, blurring into a mélange of more or less indistinguishable service sector offerings. Each region has its shopping malls, its hospitals, and its schools in what is now a nationally recognizable sameness. If you go to the suburbs of both Atlanta, Georgia, and Columbus, Ohio, you will find more or less the same blend of retail and services. It is unusual that a manufacturing job unique to one region of the country is a major reason for a cross-state change of residence."


"And here is a striking way to think about some of the underlying cultural shifts, given that mobility is often down the most for the less skilled workers. In such a setting, poverty and low incomes have flipped from being reasons to move to reasons not to move, a fundamental change from earlier American attitudes. Most troubling, the numbers also show that those who most need to move are, on average, the least likely to do it."
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Old 02-27-2017, 11:54 AM
 
Location: TN/NC
35,077 posts, read 31,302,097 times
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I've read about this, but honestly, it is not what I've seen in my personal experience at all.

Looking back to the 1700s and 1800s is basically irrelevant now. Much of the country was still mostly uninhabited by non-native people, even throughout a large part of the 1800s. There were no to few methods of rapid transport, roads were poor to nonexistent, etc. There were just so many variables that trying to making a comparison is meaningless.

I'm really surprised to hear about the slowdown in movement. It hasn't been true in my case or with the higher achieving folks I know.

I'm from an economically depressed area of Tennessee, 30, and probably half to two-thirds of the top quarter of my high school class were out of the area by age 25. Of those, some would have left anyway, but many graduated and were unable to find decent work here and had to move, even if it was just to Nashville or Charlotte.

I spun my wheels here for the better part of four years after college. I could only find call center work, moved to Iowa for a job, hated Iowa, moved back to Tennessee, lost my butt financially that year, then took a job in Indiana. I stayed in Indiana for three years, then moved back to my hometown when a good job opened up last summer. Luckily, I kept my Indiana salary. I've also lived in Virginia, South Carolina, and Massachusetts at various points in life. Had I stayed in this area, there is no way I could have gotten my current job. I moved out of economic necessity and to enhance skills, and many people I grew up with who do not work in medical or education around here had to do so as well, even if they were able to move back down the line.

With that said, I'm the only one in my immediate family (parents, aunt/uncles) who has lived more than fifty miles from here for more than six months. I have some extended family (great aunts/uncles, cousins) who moved from here or were simply born elsewhere, but no one has really voluntarily left.

I know many, many people, some of whom do not have much money but others do, who simply have no desire to experience the wider world. I'm far from some experienced world traveler, but I've driven most of the eastern half of the country, from Maine to Florida, Minnesota to Alabama, and have had many interesting experiences that staying here in BFE Kingsport would not provide. I think it's sad to watch people with means do no weekend traveling/road trips, and vacation in the same boring tourist area all the time. They're really missing out.

The unwillingness to switch jobs is something I don't see either. I work in IT, and in major markets people move around like a carousel. There is no employee or employer loyalty anymore.

I'll read the article but it isn't my experience at all.
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Old 02-27-2017, 02:11 PM
 
Location: Tampa
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This definitely caught me by surprise, and not just because I grew up in the shadow of a transient city (DC), live in another, and most of my social circle has fanned out across the globe.
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Old 02-27-2017, 02:19 PM
 
Location: Brooklyn, New York
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One other reason not discussed could be the fact that the overall population of the country is simply 'older' now. Older, more established, people move less than younger people.
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Old 02-27-2017, 02:31 PM
 
27,216 posts, read 43,923,184 times
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I have been arguing this since the recession and how it's not completely clear to some that jobs lost aren't coming back, in their original form or back to where they once were. You can either stay and adapt via skill set and/or decreased salary, or move where jobs you're qualified for are in abundance. Unfortunately many have chosen to stay put and in my opinion is a major reason this country has an increasing income inequality problem.
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Old 02-27-2017, 02:59 PM
 
93,342 posts, read 123,972,828 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kyle19125 View Post
I have been arguing this since the recession and how it's not completely clear to some that jobs lost aren't coming back, in their original form or back to where they once were. You can either stay and adapt via skill set and/or decreased salary, or move where jobs you're qualified for are in abundance. Unfortunately many have chosen to stay put and in my opinion is a major reason this country has an increasing income inequality problem.
Or why median household income took a dip or stagnated for quite a while until recently.
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Old 02-27-2017, 03:09 PM
 
Location: Ohio
15,700 posts, read 17,046,690 times
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The downside to moving is breaking up extended family and the support that family provides, and I don't mean financial support though that can be part of it, like helping one another with childcare, home projects, etc.


My grandparents lived right next door and it was wonderful for me to have them there, I learned so much from them, they were such an important part of my life growing up, especially my grandmother.


On the other hand, uncles and aunts lived far away and I barely knew them or my cousins. Once my parents died all contact petered out to nothing because we are all basically strangers.


I just think it is sad when those who do not want to move away from family have to because of work.
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Old 02-27-2017, 04:38 PM
 
Location: Midcoast Maine
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Moving is very expensive now! You need money to be able to relocate. Not many people are willing to get on a bus and head somewhere with not much more than the clothes on their back, which I did back in the early 80s. Society now has a generally high level of attachment to their "stuff"- and if you want to take your stuff with you, it costs big bucks to move it. Professional movers charge thousands to move the contents of a house across large distances. And poor people who don't have a lot might not be able to afford even a vehicle, or its upkeep, to do it themselves.

I want to move, though I don't know where yet, but I really don't know how I will be able to afford it. I've started to sell my things to fund it. I hope to be able to sell almost everything I own, but I have to pay rent in the meantime, so it will be tough to save up enough to go somewhere else.

There is also a growing section of society opting for the digital nomad lifestyle, traveling around and working online or running online businesses, no need to settle down in any one place in particular other than staying or camping wherever you can find good internet service. They are always moving, but have to have one official place of domicile where they get their drivers license and a mail forwarding service. So it looks like they're staying in one place but in reality, they're roaming all over the place! Many people have been living that way over the last 10 years or more. I think that is really changing things in a big way!

Last edited by citychik; 02-27-2017 at 04:59 PM..
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Old 02-27-2017, 04:48 PM
 
28,670 posts, read 18,788,917 times
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I think they're looking wrong at the events even as they acknowledge them. The third quarter of the 20th century was a high point of US economic power coinciding with great government-supported movement. I'll emphasize that the movement was government-supported: Millions of WWII and Korean War veterans provided with government free higher education and government easy entrance to home ownership, combined with government subsidies to planned housing near major industrial areas.

That government support slacked off tremendously in the 80s, and movement slacked with it.
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Old 02-28-2017, 04:40 AM
 
4,696 posts, read 5,822,831 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Annie53 View Post
The downside to moving is breaking up extended family and the support that family provides, and I don't mean financial support though that can be part of it, like helping one another with childcare, home projects, etc.


My grandparents lived right next door and it was wonderful for me to have them there, I learned so much from them, they were such an important part of my life growing up, especially my grandmother.


On the other hand, uncles and aunts lived far away and I barely knew them or my cousins. Once my parents died all contact petered out to nothing because we are all basically strangers.


I just think it is sad when those who do not want to move away from family have to because of work.
While I don't like not having family it defenetley gives me freedom to move. I was offered a job up here in WA and easily moved away from the city I lived in for 35 years. If I wanted to move somewhere else nothing would stop me. Anyway despite this slowdown in moving there still are booming states with lots of people moving to them and other states with little, no, or negative growth. So things haven't come to a complete standstill.
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