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Need affordable home in best location, cheap real estate, leaving Scranton for liberally minded area with vast career opportunities, good graduate student location
Need Affordable Home (NAH), if you don't mind me asking, are you taking any other factors into consideration in your relocation besides just "how cheap it is?" It seems as if you post thread after thread in which you do nothing but look for dirt cheap real estate, regardless of the quality-of-life of the surrounding area. I don't want to sound pessimistic, but often times you'll find an abundance of cheap housing in an area because it's not a "desirable" place to live. As the quality-of-life in an area increases, generally, so does the cost-of-living. I speak from experience, as the cost-of-living in Scranton/Wilkes-Barre has gone up considerably since 1995 as our quality-of-life has continued to soar.
Please, only pursue a "dirt cheap" area if you foresee it as being "up-and-coming." In this sense, it may be wonderful to purchase a decent home for $50,000 and then reap a large reward when it appreciates greatly in value a decade down the line. In places like Oil City, where you seem to have your heart set on, you'll purchase a property now for $50,000 and resell it for perhaps $70,000 in a decade for a miniscule ROI. Meanwhile, over the same time period, my parents' home appreciated by nearly $100,000 here in Scranton from their purchase price in 1996 of $110,000 or so to around $200,000 today, even with minimal renovations. In other parts of the nation, housing appreciation has been even more phenomenal. I recently watched an episode of "What You Get For the Money" on HGTV, and I saw a female artist who purchased a home in Sedona, AZ in 2003 for around $230,000, and that same home is now worth nearly $700,000!
If I do decide to leave Scranton for a more Liberally-minded area with more career opportunities for graduate students, I'll be sure to scout around for an area that I see as having plenty of "potential." Here in Scranton, I think the real estate market is really going to take off before I can have a chance to "get in on the action," as I see more and more New Yorkers moving here on a daily basis. If I do end up being "priced out" of the area in the upcoming years, I'll certainly search for a similar "up-and-coming" area in the Northern half of the nation for my house-hunting.
I'm just trying to look out for your best interests. You seem to think Oil City is some sort of Nirvana simply because it's "cheap." You need to be fully aware of the ramifications of your decision should you decide to move here. I know of many New Yorkers who are moving to the nearby Pocono Mountains and are doing nothing now but kvetching, kicking themselves, and spouting negativity towards the natives over how they were "deceived" into moving here. If you sell your home, pack your bags, and move to an area sight unseen, you're just downright stupid! I have no sympathy for the New Yorkers moving here and whining that we don't have enough IKEAs or Duane-Reeds or IMAX Theaters. These brainiacs moved here solely because it was "cheap." Well, it's cheap for a reason! We're much less cosmopolitan than the Big Apple, and you should have expected that before moving here! DUH!
Perhaps he's like me, and has much of his work and play at home. Any area with a low cost of doing businerss, accerssibility to transportation, few natural disasters, and favorable energy prices has the potential to be "up and comming" if low cost land is available. If I had a corporation looking for a headquarters, a city like NYC or LA wouldn't even be on my list because it's built out and completely regulated. Having a suburban style factory/office complex surrounded by a less "cosmopolitan" city would be the preference for most median income employees. Who would choose a tiny, expensive apartment to raise a family? More creative or artistic types would be single, and more likely to go for a city lifestyle. Personally I think that after the economy collapses in the near future a new demand for domestic products and technology will emerge, and once people get over their love affair with real estate they will realize that true wealth comes from innovation, not selling yourself to foreign investors. In a normal world real estate should not appreciate past the rate of inflaion.
Good post and ive given it alot of thought. First id like to say the last time I chatted to you on AIM, it was a pleasure talking! I did PM you yesterday when you were online, did you ever get my PM? If you did, PM me back to let me know when we can chat on AIM when you have some free time.
I most certainly am taking other factors. Crime is extremely important. I have seen my share of crime in West Palm Beach and read it on the news all the time. There was a shooting murder at one of the malls! Oil city has a crime index of 160 and zero murders, West Palm Beach's index is 900! Many big cities have moderate to high crime as well as other problems like traffic, pollution, urban sprawl and high costs of living. I have thought it over and id like to live in a town, small city or suburb thats an easy commute to a big city.
An area that isnt popular or desirable, yet safe and has potentional could see appreciation in the future. In the meanwhile I enjoy a nice big house cheap without the crime or other problems. Affordability is an issue for anyone that isnt rich. I do not want to live in a city where id be below poverty due to high costs of living. No one knows what could happen to Oil city, it may not appreciate much in my lifetime or it may start to appreciate big in a few years. I just want a house to live in, I am not a speculator nor do I have money to be speculating.
My dad however could speculate. He already has a house in West Palm Beach thats tripled in value in the last decade. He isnt selling his house anytime soon as he and mom bought it to live in. They will sell it in due time to downsize. However he wished he bought extra houses and lots before the year 2000, would of made big profit, one lot in particular went from $50k to $250k in the last 8 years. Its too late to speculate in already established areas where prices are too high already and have limited potentional as few people can afford to live there so the lack of demand mimizes appreciation or in some cases results in a "correction" where prices drop which is the case in Florida, California, New Jersey and other coastal states. An analogy is to buy stocks when they are low and sell high.
How much potentional does Scranton have left? Have prices "maxed out" or is there still alot of room for appreciation? There should be a high speed rail build by 2009 or 2010, but what if it never gets built? What if New Yorkers get tired of Scranton in a couple years and the investment my dad made in Scrantron goes nowhere? This is something me and dad will need to carefully research. Its probably best to buy vacent lots as they appreciate considerably more than houses plus vacant lots dont need insurance nor maintainence(repairs and heating in winter) and theres no worry of arson or vandalism. I also dont have to check often on vacent lots. I dont have the money to speculate but dad does and I can help him, he can keep the profits and perhaps give me a small percentage for the help.
Scranton crime has been rising every year and urban sprawl is becomming a problem. I could live a quiet life in Oil city while checking on Scranton and monitoring the investment for my dad while he just sits back in WPB and watches the investment soar. This is fine with me, ill be glad to help my dad and mom build up a bigger nest egg. Ill be building my own with money I put aside from my home business and money I earn by other means.
Those New Yorkers should have checked the area before they moved. There was no deceivement going on. Besides isnt that what they wanted since they got priced out of NY and instead live in Scranton and commute to NY?
I know Scranton has less theaters and shopping than NY but they can commute to NY for all their needs, including their jobs. Isnt that why a high speed rail may be built in 2009 or 2010?
If I move to Oil city or some other small city/town ill have the benefits of low costs of living and low crime and I can always commute to a big city for my shopping and entertainment needs. Many people commute 30, 60, 90, even 120 minutes each way to work. I wont have that problem and will only need to commute for big store shopping such as malls and supermarkets as well as entertainment like upscale restaurants, clubs, shows, concerts, etc which dont interest me much to begin with and I seldom attend. I would not benefit much by living directly in a big city because I seldom use the ammenities a big city has to offer. I prefer a laid back easygoing life.
Perhaps he's like me, and has much of his work and play at home. Any area with a low cost of doing businerss, accerssibility to transportation, few natural disasters, and favorable energy prices has the potential to be "up and comming" if low cost land is available.
I concur,everything is about the almighty dollar and it is so sad. I recommended oil city to nah because that seemed to fit his criteria perfectly,I know from experience oil city is not a bad place to live.Recently I have made few stops on this site because there are so many experts who seem to know the area,only problem is they are wrong. I would never recommend a place if it was a horrible area,no it's not miami,chicago,dallas or manhattan and thats a good thing to some but it's not in the middle of nowhere either it has everything you need and if you need more its not far from grove city or pittsburgh and its safe and affordable.And yes of course check it out,some will love it and some will hate it.I like it except the summer isn't long enough and I don't care for the snow.All you can do is check it out and check out other places too I'm sure you'll find what you're looking for.
What I want to know is why people have to go to NYC for the high paying jobs. In today's nigh-tech world, it amazes me that companies continue to tolerate big city hassles when they could relocate somewhere with more freedom to innovate. High priced real estate just makes you more of a slave to the government and wealthy investors.
I personally think if you want something that is affordable, and close enough to a city where you can work.. go to Granite City, IL.
Its affordable.. not too bad as far as crime and so forth.. and its like a 20 minutes to Saint Louis, MO to work, or Fairview Heights, IL, or Collinsville,IL
The problem is East St. Louis, Illinois has a crime index of 2000! St. Louis, Missouri has 1200! I would not feel safe even visiting the city to shop or work! Granite City, IL has 400 crime but its adjutant(next to) some very bad crime areas! Ill pass.
The problem is East St. Louis, Illinois has a crime index of 2000! St. Louis, Missouri has 1200! I would not feel safe even visiting the city to shop or work! Granite City, IL has 400 crime but its adjutant(next to) some very bad crime areas! Ill pass.
Yeah, you don't want to work in East St. Louis. I am not going to lie about that one.
Saint Louis itself is not bad. (I have lived here my whole life) You have to take into consideration the size of St. Louis CITY. The actual city itself, is not that big.. so you don't have to work in the city, you can work inthe burbs right outside it.
Plus if you don't want to work in Saint Louis, go to Collinsville, or Fairview heights, those are both awesome cities with lots of places to work.
Just because a city has a high crime index, doesn't mean that you have to go there or drive through there to get to where you need to go. In all actuality, East St. Louis may look close to Granite City, or any other cities around there.. but its actually quite a ways away.
Im self employed so I wont be working for anyone but myself and at home. Being near a big city is good for shopping and entertainment but if the crime is high, I dont even want to drive there! Thanks for being honest about crime.
Regarding Granite City, IL. can I get a nice big house for $50k in a good neighboorhood?
As others have said, lot more to consider than house prices.
PA is a bit of a regulated state. More rules and regs than I like. Also know some smaller towns can be very nasty with petty rules. Some of those ones along the Ohio River can be rediculous. Like Pohatten Point had an ordance where nobody can keep a camper in town, not even in your own garage.
The way you are going about it is not all wrong. Find the areas based on a price you can afford and work from there. One big thing is what is happening to taxes? Lots of smaller cities / towns try to raise taxes, fees, etc as their tax bases shrink. What exactly is the situation in Oil City?
Lots of smaller towns using traffic tickets for revenue, what is Oil City's hassle factors. In general these days I don't like living in any urban area, including small towns. Nice to snuggle up next to an urban area but remain outside their control.
You get stupid stuff like emergency snow rules, can't work on your car on the street, can't park here or there, can't leave you car in the same spot on the street over so many hours, must do this or that, permit for this, piece of paper for that. Small town America is not a completely free from hassles zone. Small town cops and officials can be some of the worse going. They have little else to do.
In many cases, places like Oil City will not resemble the type hassles you encounter in a southern climate like Florida. Different lattitudes, different attitudes.
The money part is just the starting point. I would really want to understand a lot more about the locals and what is the type of hassles you must endure.
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It seems as if you post thread after thread in which you do nothing but look for dirt cheap real estate, regardless of the quality-of-life of the surrounding area. I don't want to sound pessimistic, but often times you'll find an abundance of cheap housing in an area because it's not a "desirable" place to live. 
As the quality-of-life in an area increases, generally, so does the cost-of-living. I speak from experience, as the cost-of-living in Scranton/Wilkes-Barre has gone up considerably since 1995 as our quality-of-life has continued to soar. 
It is a lot more than money
