The GDOT and their ugly roads (Atlanta, Columbus: parking, business, drive)

[SavannahLife]

Well they have done a great job cutting down trees so we can see all the new ugly billboards and get blinded by sun.

[JMatl]

Originally Posted by SavannahLife

Well they have done a great job cutting down trees so we can see all the new ugly billboards and get blinded by sun.

They sure have, and it's sickening. The Billboard industry and their buddies in the Legislature saw to it.

[SavannahLife]

JMatl, sure did. Guy the wrote the law owns a sign company. Not surprising for politicians unfortunately.

From our corner of GA down in Sav.. It would be nice if GDOT focused on better stuff, like adding a lane on I-16 and I-95 near Savannah. Instead of weird projects like removing I-16 ramps. Probably a similar situation up north? It seems they choose odd ways sometimes to spend large money on big projects instead of common sense things like upgrading interstates. Perhaps politics at work again though right?

[JMatl]

Originally Posted by SavannahLife

JMatl, sure did. Guy the wrote the law owns a sign company. Not surprising for politicians unfortunately.

From our corner of GA down in Sav.. It would be nice if GDOT focused on better stuff, like adding a lane on I-16 and I-95 near Savannah. Instead of weird projects like removing I-16 ramps. Probably a similar situation up north? It seems they choose odd ways sometimes to spend large money on big projects instead of common sense things like upgrading interstates. Perhaps politics at work again though right?

Business as usual here, but I still love and have faith in Georgia (somewhat, anyway).

I'm very embarrassed to say that I am totally unfamiliar with Savannah, despite having many friends from there and that have moved back there. I need to remedy that, big time.

As far as GDOT up here, it seems everything new is a public/private partnership deal with tolls, and all freeway related of course. Hardly any mention of rail at all from the State level, but interest seems to be increasing in Atlanta/Fulton/DeKalb/Clayton.

[Born 2 Roll]

Originally Posted by JMatl

As far as GDOT up here, it seems everything new is a public/private partnership deal with tolls, and all freeway related of course. Hardly any mention of rail at all from the State level, but interest seems to be increasing in Atlanta/Fulton/DeKalb/Clayton.

I fully agree with, understand and share your discouragement and frustration that the State of Georgia seems to pay little (if any) attention to modes of transportation other than automobiles....That's despite the obvious critical importance of alternative modes of transportation in a large major metro region with road infrastructure that is as severely limited as the road infrastructure is in Metro Atlanta.

But the investment in toll lanes and freeway improvements funded with P3's (Public-Private Partnerships) is somewhat understandable as the radial freeway corridors in question receiving these P3-funded improvements (I-75/I-575 Northwest; I-75 South; I-85 Northeast, etc) appear to be headed towards total gridlock at peak hours, particularly as the economy continues to recover and moves back towards near-full employment.

The P3-funded toll lanes are not so much to expand freeway capacity as much as they are to provide 1 or 2 uncongested traffic lanes along freeway corridors that may otherwise be completely gridlocked at times during peak hours.

Unless they are riding on a bus or in an emergency vehicle, in most cases motorists will only be able to use the lanes during peak hours if they are willing to pay exorbitant variable toll rates that may likely rise as high as $1.00 per mile at times to attempt to keep the lanes uncongested and flowing during peak hours.

The pending P3-funded reconstruction of the I-285/GA 400 interchange is understandable because the long-delayed start of the project is about 25 years overdue and should have been completed no later than the opening of the GA 400 Extension through North Atlanta and Buckhead.

The tolls lanes are basically a way to provide 1 or 2 uncongested lanes along freeway corridors that will often be gridlocked during peak hours while the state moves around to eventually funding transit operations at a much higher level throughout the Atlanta region (and hopefully the entire state) in the future.

Until the state eventually figures out how to properly execute transit (in terms of negotiating usage of existing freight rail corridors for passenger rail operations with freight rail companies; learning how to properly fund transit; recognizing the severely pressing need to fund transit expansion in a large metro region with a severely limited surface road network that virtually cannot be expanded, etc), providing 1 or 2 uncongested lanes along gridlocked freeway corridors isn't necessarily the worst thing at this point of growing desperation.

[SavannahLife]

It is often discounted that public transit costs much less per passenger than cars, in terms of tax money needed to support infrastructure. (Expanding and maintaining roads costs more as a solution to rush hour traffic, than does increasing mass transit ridership.) The trick is of course building said mass transit ridership. Though I think ATL is starting to get on board with modern planning, including transit. Meanwhile down here in Savannah they're looking in to resurrecting the street car. (Maybe worthwhile, although I think just adding more bus routes may more effective short term) And Amtrak to Charleston and Jax are pretty cheap and convenient, as quick or quicker than a car even. Haven't traveled by rail yet but that's a to-do item some weekend!
JM come visit, bring friends. I like GA. ATL is fun as a foodie paradise and the capital of the south. I need to get up there more we've only been a couple times. Savannah though is a good weekend trip. Beach. Boat. Squares. History. Wildlife Refuges. Food. Drink. Drink Outside! The Ferry and shuttle are free, thanks GDOT! Now that's a good thing they've done!

[Born 2 Roll]

Originally Posted by SavannahLife

It is often discounted that public transit costs much less per passenger than cars, in terms of tax money needed to support infrastructure. (Expanding and maintaining roads costs more as a solution to rush hour traffic, than does increasing mass transit ridership.) The trick is of course building said mass transit ridership. Though I think ATL is starting to get on board with modern planning, including transit.

These are some excellent comments and some really good points.

One of the tricks to building mass transit ridership in the 21st Century is for large urban and large metropolitan transit agencies (like MARTA and GRTA Xpress) to include large-scale TODs (Transit Oriented Developments) as part of the high-capacity transit infrastructure on the real estate that a transit agency owns.

This is so that a large urban/metro transit agency like a MARTA or a GRTA Xpress will be able to generate much more transit usage from the large-scale transit-oriented real estate development at and around stations and along transit lines (turning those large Park & Ride lots around many stations into large revenue generators for a perennially cash-strapped transit system)....While also collecting much additional operating revenue from the profits generated off of large-scale TOD on transit-owned land and from the additional fare revenue generated by the additional ridership generated by the TOD along transit lines.

Another (secondary, yet still very important) trick to building mass transit ridership in the 21st Century is replacing the current flat-rate fare structure with a distance-based fare structure on large urban/metro systems like MARTA, GRTA Xpress, etc...

Replacing the current largely flat-rate fare structure (currently $2.50 per-trip on MARTA) with a distance-based fare structure of approximately $0.20-0.25 per-mile in 2015 dollars (with discounts to as low as $0.10/mile for disadvantaged and special groups; and rates as high as $0.50/mile for premium service like express buses, express trains and first-class/luxury-liner service) will help to generate increased usage of transit for shorter-distance trips.

Replacing the current flat-rate fare structure with a distance-based fare structure will help generate increased ridership by charging less for shorter-distance transit trips while generating more revenue to expand transit service in congested outlying areas (largely outside I-285 in Metro Atlanta) that are currently severely underserved by transit by charging more for longer-distance trips.

A distance-based fare structure would be a great improvement over the current flat-rate fare structure of $2.50 per-trip on MARTA which charges too much for immediate local transit trips and too little for longer-distance transit trips.

Another trick that can likely help to build transit ridership is to tie many more of the GRTA Xpress commuter bus routes into the ends of the MARTA heavy rail lines where possible.

Tying more GRTA Xpress commuter bus routes into the ends of MARTA heavy rail lines where possible (instead of having GRTA Xpress bus routes operate into Midtown and Downtown Atlanta areas that are already served by MARTA heavy rail service) will increase MARTA ridership by having GRTA Xpress commuter bus riders transfer onto MARTA trains when headed into the area of Atlanta inside I-285 (at MARTA end-HRT line stations like North Springs, Doraville, Indian Creek and College Park).

Tying more GRTA Xpress commuter bus routes into the ends of MARTA heavy rail lines where possible will also help to cut operating costs for the GRTA Xpress commuter bus system as most GRTA Xpress buses will only have to operate to just outside or just inside of I-285 instead of having to operate into Downtown and Midtown Atlanta.

No longer requiring most GRTA Xpress commuter buses to have to operate all the way to Midtown and Downtown Atlanta will mean that more resources can be put into increasing GRTA Xpress commuter bus service along the shortened stretches where the buses will continue to operate outside of the I-285 Perimeter (with shorter headways between GRTA Xpress buses because they won't have to operate past outlying MARTA HRT stations into and out of Midtown and Downtown Atlanta anymore).

[SavannahLife]

Very pleasing to engage indepth shop talk on planning here! ATL and Savannah have so much potential and a lot of it rides on transit, ooh no pun intended. Scheduling and managing freight as you mentioned Born 2 is important with the busy rail here. Planning of future developments in tandem with transit expansion, as well as considering toll structure, are also good ideas to improve transit, save money, and fund the infrastructure. I nominate you both to my new blue ribbon transit committee of Georgia C-D forum, hah.

Oh speaking of billboards a new digital one with video distracted me when I noticed it this morning on I-16 and almost drove off the road. Dang billboards.

[Rangerdude_Charlie]

Originally Posted by SavannahLife

JMatl, sure did. Guy the wrote the law owns a sign company. Not surprising for politicians unfortunately.

From our corner of GA down in Sav.. It would be nice if GDOT focused on better stuff, like adding a lane on I-16 and I-95 near Savannah. Instead of weird projects like removing I-16 ramps. Probably a similar situation up north? It seems they choose odd ways sometimes to spend large money on big projects instead of common sense things like upgrading interstates. Perhaps politics at work again though right?

I wish I could rep you some more for this post. Couldn't agree more.

[GaPlanner]

I really wish Atlanta/GDOT would improve some of Midtown's roads such as Piedmont Avenue along Piedmont Park. The potholes are horrendous... but then they pave streets like 8th Street so the new skyscrapers will have a little curb appeal although no one really uses the numbered streets except as shortcuts. Also the Peachtree Creek bridge on Buford Highway has no lines on it (super faded) where that sharp curve is!! I am always having to honk at people veering into my lane because they simply cannot see the lines. (end rant) lol.