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Old 10-14-2010, 08:44 AM
Location: 39 20' 59"N / 75 30' 53"W
16,077 posts, read 28,552,612 times
Reputation: 18189


Originally Posted by samston View Post
OK, look at it this way. why do adults, and not children:

- Commit acts of domestic violence
- Kill
- Rape
- Commit assaults

Bullying to some degree is pervasive in the human sphere. To assume that bullies only exist in childhood is a patent fallacy.
Of course its a fallacy. Do you think adult bullies didn't show the same behaviors as kids or adolescense? Its a progression.

Thats not to say all bullies will commit crimes as adults, but you have to admit the chances will be higher in domestic violence and assaults category.

Last edited by virgode; 10-14-2010 at 09:46 AM..
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Old 10-14-2010, 12:15 PM
Location: So. of Rosarito, Baja, Mexico
6,987 posts, read 21,925,882 times
Reputation: 7007
Has been a veeeeeery long time since I was in High school. Never was "bullyed" but did see some what I would call "Intimidation" via of some of the tactics used by some students.

There were three black males that would walk down the hall forcing many to walk around them out of the way. The method was if you did not walk around them they would intentially bump your shoulder in passing so hard that would spin you around. I saw this happen quite a few times and they were aggressive in many respects.

Well I'm no big person but figured that enough was enough so when they came towards me I knew what was supposed to happen and I braced myself and hit one persons shoulder real hard that spun him completely around surprising him. He came into my face and tried to look intimidating and I stood my ground and said "what are you going to do about it"? He hesitated and smiled and after that they never did the bumping/spinning around of anyone again.

So you see a person has to stand up for what is right and not allow further "intimidation".
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Old 10-15-2010, 07:29 AM
4,379 posts, read 5,382,704 times
Reputation: 1612
Originally Posted by Francois View Post
Who has said it only exists in childhood? The term is generally used with children because when it's an adult doing the same thing, you can either have them arrested (sexual intimidation, for example) or you just call them something else, that starts with a and ends with -ole. Tons of people in high-pressure business situations (especially sales or financial trading) use bullying all the time, but the difference is, when it's adults on adults, there is usually a way to turn and walk away (unless it's your boss doing the bullying, which most of us have probably experienced in same way), while in school, kids are trapped and have literally nowhere to turn. And, kids haven't developed the self-awareness that they arer not defined by what the bullies do, while in school, social "rank" trumps all else, and the kids at the bottom of the social order know they are "scum" in the only scale that matters--societal approval. Once you're grown, you can choose people to hang around with or work with who don't treat you like that, but they do exist in many parts of the business world and in fact are recruited in many "big business" situations or in politics.

Bullies DO sometimes mature, and many times a bullied kid has run into a former bully in adulthood who was friendly and either apologized for or didn't (claim to) even remember making life miserable for the other, years before. The point is, bullies might forget what they did to others, but the ones it is done TO don't forget. Why would we allow such damaging behavior in those with shaky self-images (the bullies always smell fear and go for the easiest targets)?
It lends itself, again, to the management of bullying. I'm sure this is how any psychological professional would state as so.

Bullies need to be taught empathy, whilst victims need to be taught how not to be a victim and to manage the situation should it arise.
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Old 10-16-2010, 07:14 AM
74 posts, read 210,190 times
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Middle school bullying is inherently an American phenomenon... One perpetuated by the introduction of 1950s culture. (Look it up in Wikepedia for more info). I have many foreign friends and all agree that they form of bullying they see in this country is vastly difference from their experiences. My friends agree that although there will always be varieties of social success and failure in any peer group, the idea of marginalizing ONE or TWO members of a subgroup (ie a class) and branding them "pariahs" at this age is strictly American. Having said that, they also tell me that as American culture spreads, so does this notion.

Now before anyone starts pointing out the obvious--I think we can all agree that violence exists in most cultures as does mental intimidation etc. The pieces that are uniquely American have to do with 1) the overtness of the attack (intimidation vs. shunning) 2) The ages when it's first seen (middle school) 3) The association of the "nerd" with someone who is smart 4) The marginalization of only 1-2 students as designated punching bags.

What is troubling to me is that this stereotype is STILL perpetuated by childrens' media. I can tell you that my son came home the other day and asked me if he was a nerd because he was getting all the answers right in school. He is 6 and I did not know that he even knew that word. More reasons to monitor the TV, I suppose.
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Old 10-16-2010, 07:20 AM
Location: 500 miles from home
33,942 posts, read 22,520,724 times
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Did anyone watch 20/20 last night? It was a show on bullying (amongst other things). Two former middle school bullies said that they got by with it because no one tried to stop them. No parent; no adult; no teacher. And that the teacher's were in the best position to take them aside and make them stop. That they would openly bully people in the classroom and the teachers had to be aware of it.

Then they interviewed a psychologist who said that the teachers do not know what to do in this situation. If they intervene; then the parents of the bully will be mad and they worry that the principal will not back them up.

Very interesting show.

I think that bullying has moved up a notch like everything else.

I agree that Parents of bullies need to teach them empathy and Parents of victims need to teach them how to manage the situation and not be intimidated.

I have to say that my son is in high school and we only had one incident - back in third grade. I wrote a letter to the teacher and she did everything in her power to help my son. I am so thankful to her for helping us get through that.
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Old 10-16-2010, 10:51 AM
29 posts, read 66,960 times
Reputation: 43
"All that is necessary for the trumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." - Edmnd Burke

Where would the world be today if ......
-Rosa Parks didn't say "no"
-Women didn't demand to vote
-Martin Luther didn't declare equality
-The world didn't stand up to Hitler
-etc. etc. etc.
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Old 10-17-2010, 09:37 AM
Location: Brooklyn
40,050 posts, read 34,597,244 times
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Originally Posted by Ringo1 View Post
I agree that Parents of bullies need to teach them empathy...
For some reason, I think that's the least likely thing to happen. Parents of bullies don't have enough control over their kids in the first place. Or, alternatively, they're bullies themselves and the kids picked up the behavior from them.
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Old 10-17-2010, 03:53 PM
Location: The Midst of Insanity
3,219 posts, read 7,080,949 times
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Originally Posted by samston View Post
OK, look at it this way. why do adults, and not children:

- Commit acts of domestic violence
- Kill
- Rape
- Commit assaults

Bullying to some degree is pervasive in the human sphere. To assume that bullies only exist in childhood is a patent fallacy.
There are children who have committed great acts of violence, and even murder.

Kid Killers: Child Murderers are Rare, But on the Rise, Pushed By Violence in the Home - ABC News

Nathaniel Abraham killer at 11 charged with drug dealing*|*Zada News

Murder In The First Grade - 60 Minutes - CBS News
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Old 10-17-2010, 05:36 PM
2,016 posts, read 5,205,090 times
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Originally Posted by Austinitegirl View Post
OK - I know this topic is going to fan some flamers, but I think it's extremely relevant given the recent media highlight (and very sad/unfortuante results) of bullying.

There are several other threads that touch on the topic of bullying in some way or another, but my question is - Bullying - is it just a fact of life?

In other words, sure, it would be wonderful if we could live in a peaceful world of no bullying, no violence, no suicide, no bombs, make love not war, etc., but is bullying just intrinsic to human nature? Do humans (whether we want to admit it or not) have a sort of "pack mentality" with a very complicated hierarchy and pecking order, which ultimately means someone is selected (by the "pack") to be at the bottom of the social food chain, and is therefore bullied and harassed until they become the universal pariah?

Please don't misunderstand my question - I am not debating the wrongness or rightness of bullying, or ignoring its immense emotional and societal impact. I'm simply wanting to hear some intellectual/philosophical (hopefully friendly/polite) debate about whether or not this particular behavior is programmed into our DNA.

There has been so much recent press about how to stop bullying - it seems reasonable to me to analyze it's root cause.

Root cause is the parents who deny that their children are bullies. Being a parent for almost three decades and having a few still in school, rest assured that the kids who bully oftentimes (meaning most of the time) have parents who are bullies themselves, parents who verbally harass coaches, teachers, other parents if they don't get their way.

Private schools are not better than public schools when it comes to bullying, in fact, private schools, wanting to hold onto financial/monetary contributions from wealthy benefactor families (and grandparents) are turning a blind eye to the bullying problem. They figure it's better to lose a few good students (meaning the parents get so disgusted that they pull their bullied child out of that particular school) than to have the entire school collapse and fall off the earth. So much is swept under the rug, so much is spinned that the reality of what really happened is contorted and twisted into some unrecognizable amalgam of cr*p.

Most people don't want to sue, nor do they have the money, the knowledge, or the time to continually sue schools into complying with their own anti-bullying policies. However, until there is a national anti-bullying law in this country, schools are NOT taking a universal stance against bullying in this country and parents are forced to sue hodge-podge. Actually schools are taking a stance against bullying, they're just not actually ENFORCING the policy and enforcement is the critical step.
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Old 10-17-2010, 05:45 PM
2,016 posts, read 5,205,090 times
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Originally Posted by Sawdustmaker View Post
Why should a child have to walk through life defending him/herself against bullies who obviously come from trash?
Some might come from "trash", but a good number of them come from highly privileged, self-entitled, "better than everyone else" type families. These families are oftentimes found on school boards, PTA's, and other community type organizations. They are the so-called "movers and shakers" of the community and God help you if you call their precious darlings on their rotten behavior.
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