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Old 03-05-2015, 11:14 PM
 
Location: Scotland
8,024 posts, read 10,588,370 times
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Thing Finder: Nowhere in the world, though, have I ever encountered a more brutal, tribal and violent race of people than the Scots-Irish

History News Network | The Strange Origins of Thomas Sowell's Theory of Gangsta Rap Culture


Whites greatly overestimate the share of crimes committed by black people - The Washington Post

Whites Commit More Crimes Than Blacks, FBI Says on EthicsDaily.com



A certain amount of people think black people are 'naturally' more aggressive or volatile. But do you think these essays may hold sway, I mean there are undoubtedly more violence mostly black areas in say London or Manchester for instance - but the most violent city, and deadliest in the UK is Glasgow. A predominantly white city. And Liverpool and Belfast are also violent and mainly white. They also have a lot of Celtic in these cities. Clutching at straws here - but I think there may be something in it. You just need to look at Ukraine, Syria, Mexico, the Congo and North Korea to see every 'race' is as violent as the next. It just makes me think that we are all the same, as I always have thought. But in America as it is the dominant country, we all see the blacks marginalised - and sometimes violent which usually does quickly follow marginalization. And the ''republicans'' swearing the blacks are to blame for their problems - are we this bigoted and/or stupid? The far right again making waves in Europe - will we ever learn from history? I just thought we would'a got passed this s!*t by now - depressing really is.

''But those numbers count only those who were jailed for a crime. In 2003, more than twice as many whites as blacks were arrested and charged with a crime, according to the FBI's Uniform Crime Reports.''
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Old 03-05-2015, 11:27 PM
 
Location: Hong Kong / Vienna
4,557 posts, read 5,456,676 times
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I thought it's fairly obvious that the likelihood of violent/criminal behaviour isn't linked to skin colour, but rather social standing?
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Old 03-06-2015, 12:17 AM
 
277 posts, read 529,083 times
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^Also how community and governing work. Peckham in the 1990s had the largest Afro-Caribbean percentage in London, and was also the poorest area. It accordingly had the highest crime. -However next door was New Cross - the second highest Black population and just as poor - but also the second lowest crime rate, and a much more progressive local council.

After the murder of a schoolboy in 2001 there was a sea change in policy in Peckham, with the most notorious highrise estates bulldozed to be replaced by affordable social housing in rowhomes, community links forged between rival groups of Caribbeans and African newcomers, and the schools given better funding and teaching etc. The result a decade later is that crime has plummeted, the schools are outstanding, and the 'Black-on-Black' violence evaporated- all despite the area still being so poor. - On a larger scale things have turned round also for the Black community, now earning more than Whites (though Caribbean males are still behind), and among the new generation of Africans, the most likely to outperform at school, go on to university and land a high paying job after. This story is mirrored by the South Asian community, for example the largest ethnicity, the Bangladeshis, for over a century the poorest in London, and by the 1990s the second lowest on the rung (beating only the Portuguese), in one decade have now overtaken Whites. - In short social justice = dramatic fall in crime. London of the 1990s had the highest crime rates since medieval times. London a decade or two later now has a fraction of what it endured before despite higher levels of young men, homicide rates are now as low as the entire country of Sweden, or the entire region of East Asia, which has the lowest rates in the world - despite London being a single city and not an entire country or region.

Likewise some of the poorest urban areas in the world are also some of the safest, most admirably Islamic Cairo, where the density of the population is huge (every crime has a witness), and the community strong (every culprit will be known by someone). It's the kind of place geographers, urbanists and social scientists go to discover the secret of a functioning society. A new park that opened there was even loaded with controversy due to the worries crime might rise after it's forced imposition into the dense social fabric.

In short a combination of social justice and community are key, let alone purely income levels (which normally entails the lack of the first, and in Western countries the lack of the second too). Race doesn't come into it - unless of course income, inequality and social injustice correlate with the colour of your skin. But it's interesting to note the poorest areas of London during the 1990s, either Black focused (Peckham, Hackney), South Asian focused (Tower Hamlets, Southall) or White focused (Dagenham, Woolwich, Deptford, Dartford) all had huge crime spikes for their accordant inhabitants, regardless of skin colour, but all sharing the same social inequality/ injustice.

Last edited by smool; 03-06-2015 at 12:40 AM..
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Old 03-06-2015, 12:22 AM
 
Location: Scotland
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Quote:
Originally Posted by viribusunitis View Post
I thought it's fairly obvious that the likelihood of violent/criminal behaviour isn't linked to skin colour, but rather social standing?

You would think it was fairly obvious mate ...... and to people like us it seems to be. But that is not the impression I am getting. Is it just the media? Is it a fair majority/minorities opinion? I don't know but it is scandalous either way.
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Old 03-06-2015, 01:06 AM
 
161 posts, read 131,193 times
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It's a mix of cultural influences, socioeconomic factors, social perceptions reinforcing stereotyped behavior, and genetic factors interacting with the environment - a complicated interaction between nature and nurture. I don't completely deny that genetics is a factor, like some liberals, nor do I subscribe to the stormfront point of view that it is all genetics.

I would say there are some differences, after correcting for socio-economic stratification, culture and focused corrective community actions to tackle violence and crime in specific communities.
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Old 03-06-2015, 08:17 AM
 
Location: New Albany, Indiana (Greater Louisville)
10,777 posts, read 22,175,619 times
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In America many people of color are targeted by police at a young age - when people of all races do dumb things - and get a criminal record. America is a "One Strike and You're Out" society where even a minor crime on record prevents you from ever being able to get a good job. So many young Blacks and Hispanics have no shot at making it in the legit economy and turn to the underground economy to survive.

In the upper middle class White neighborhood I grew up in White kids would do nonsense all the time without getting a criminal record - things like bashing mailboxes, flashing passing cars, shooting bottle rockets at houses, etc. In my high school I sat next to a guy in one class who rolled marijuana joints to sell at school and he never got disciplined. Meanwhile the police are too busy finding a Black man smoking a joint in the poor neighborhoods too care.

It's easy to point and laugh at Blacks and Hispanics for having high homicide rates but it's hard when you live in a society that makes it 10X marker for you to make it.
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Old 03-06-2015, 08:26 AM
 
Location: Scotland
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We were terrible as kids but weren't demonised and systematically hounded. And my friends found it difficult so can only imagine the road blocks of a lot of poor minority communities.
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Old 03-06-2015, 08:45 AM
Status: "Tell your loved ones you love them." (set 8 days ago)
 
Location: Wonderland
54,474 posts, read 42,652,770 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paull805 View Post
Thing Finder: Nowhere in the world, though, have I ever encountered a more brutal, tribal and violent race of people than the Scots-Irish

History News Network | The Strange Origins of Thomas Sowell's Theory of Gangsta Rap Culture


Whites greatly overestimate the share of crimes committed by black people - The Washington Post

Whites Commit More Crimes Than Blacks, FBI Says on EthicsDaily.com



A certain amount of people think black people are 'naturally' more aggressive or volatile. But do you think these essays may hold sway, I mean there are undoubtedly more violence mostly black areas in say London or Manchester for instance - but the most violent city, and deadliest in the UK is Glasgow. A predominantly white city. And Liverpool and Belfast are also violent and mainly white. They also have a lot of Celtic in these cities. Clutching at straws here - but I think there may be something in it. You just need to look at Ukraine, Syria, Mexico, the Congo and North Korea to see every 'race' is as violent as the next. It just makes me think that we are all the same, as I always have thought. But in America as it is the dominant country, we all see the blacks marginalised - and sometimes violent which usually does quickly follow marginalization. And the ''republicans'' swearing the blacks are to blame for their problems - are we this bigoted and/or stupid? The far right again making waves in Europe - will we ever learn from history? I just thought we would'a got passed this s!*t by now - depressing really is.

''But those numbers count only those who were jailed for a crime. In 2003, more than twice as many whites as blacks were arrested and charged with a crime, according to the FBI's Uniform Crime Reports.''
But African Americans are only 13 percent of the population in the US. So it makes sense that more white people than black people would be arrested.

You can't look at just the NUMBER of people arrested or charged with a crime. You have to look at the PER CAPITA numbers by race/ethnicity.
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Old 03-06-2015, 08:53 AM
 
Location: Scotland
8,024 posts, read 10,588,370 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KathrynAragon View Post
But African Americans are only 13 percent of the population in the US. So it makes sense that more white people than black people would be arrested.

You can't look at just the NUMBER of people arrested or charged with a crime. You have to look at the PER CAPITA numbers by race/ethnicity.
Point is poor areas = crime no matter the colour. Any thought on the treatment of African Americans though?
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Old 03-06-2015, 09:17 AM
AFP
 
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Poverty levels play a huge role, with organized gangs having a huge influence in poor communities often times violent gang bangers are looked up to by the younger generation. Many individuals that I have spoken to casually don't believe they have many opportunities and see selling drugs or other illegal activities as their career and many aren't ashamed, they've been conditioned by the environments they are from and see it as their normal they are also aware of the risks. Some take responsiblity for the consequences of their choices, but there is a huge segment of people that are convinced they are being persecuted by larger society they are angry and believe a life of crime and the violence that goes with it is the only choice they have and act out.

Here are some incarceration rates by race in the USA in 2010 it doesn't break down violent crimes but nontheless I think it's relevant.

U.S. incarceration rates by race | Prison Policy Initiative
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