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Old 12-06-2020, 11:24 PM
 
Location: Southwest Washington State
30,585 posts, read 25,144,036 times
Reputation: 50802

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boone1791 View Post
How do you "respect" someone who continues to believe and support a viewpoint that has been demonstrated to be utterly false?
You respect his or his humanity. And you remind yourself that you, yourself, are fallible.
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Old 12-07-2020, 04:32 AM
 
18,127 posts, read 25,272,176 times
Reputation: 16834
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boone1791 View Post
How do you "respect" someone who continues to believe and support a viewpoint that has been demonstrated to be utterly false?
With that way of thinking, people would still teach that the sun revolves around the Earth.
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Old 12-07-2020, 07:25 AM
 
Location: North Idaho
726 posts, read 328,770 times
Reputation: 953
Quote:
How do you "respect" someone who continues to believe and support a viewpoint that has been demonstrated to be utterly false?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dopo View Post
With that way of thinking, people would still teach that the sun revolves around the Earth.
I don't follow. That's one of those things that has been demonstrated to be false. Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts.
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Old 12-07-2020, 10:02 AM
 
18,127 posts, read 25,272,176 times
Reputation: 16834
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boone1791 View Post
I don't follow. That's one of those things that has been demonstrated to be false. Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts.
And at one point, it was considered a fact that "the sun revolves around the Earth"
and some troublemaker found out that that's not true and had to go against everybody's "common sense" to prove that he was right.
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Old 12-07-2020, 10:19 AM
 
Location: moved
13,646 posts, read 9,704,293 times
Reputation: 23473
The point evidently is that we can uncompromisingly refute a false claim, without regarding the claimant as being somehow subhuman or an outright enemy.
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Old 12-07-2020, 12:28 PM
 
Location: Taos NM
5,349 posts, read 5,126,476 times
Reputation: 6766
Quote:
Originally Posted by ohio_peasant View Post
The point evidently is that we can uncompromisingly refute a false claim, without regarding the claimant as being somehow subhuman or an outright enemy.
Exactly.

You can see the polarity that's reared it's head this year (although it's been around before 2020) with the far left calling everyone a "ist" - racist, sexist... and the far right is calling everyone a greedy pervert. And what's happened is they've shifted their moral failures from a individual person to a system, so instead of having racists, there's embedded systematic racism; instead of questionable individuals, you have an inner ring of communist pedophiles.

What this results in is instead of looking at claims and looking at evidence, people oversimplify and jump right to personal attacks on morals for totally unrelated items such as when should kids go to school.

https://reason.com/2020/12/06/chicag...cism-misogyny/

This breakdown results in both sides calling everyone who doesn't agree with them a terrible person, an "ist". And that completely shuts down conversation around sensitive issues.
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Old 12-07-2020, 03:10 PM
 
Location: California
37,131 posts, read 42,196,846 times
Reputation: 35012
Quote:
Originally Posted by silibran View Post
I don’t think we should lay so much blame on the media. News media, particularly, reports news. News often reflects current issues, controversies or debates. I believe the problem lies in human nature. We all have the capacity to hate or love. We choose between these two extremes every day. It is often much easier to hate than to love.
Oh where to start....

Our news media is a propaganda machine 24/7. It is NOT a neutral 'report the facts' institution. We need to lay much more blame on them, and people who don't get that need to learn fast. Ignorance is a dangerous thing.
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Old 12-07-2020, 07:11 PM
 
Location: Middle America
11,073 posts, read 7,142,399 times
Reputation: 16983
I avoid discussions of politics because they bring out the worst in people (not because I'm trying to avoid offending). The foaming-at-the-mouth types get offended by a change of the wind, so nothing could help them anyway. It's a waste of time worrying about them.

The confrontation that results is also of ridiculous proportions, which I don't need in my life. People can keep their garbage and nonsense for themselves.
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Old 12-07-2020, 07:11 PM
 
4,023 posts, read 1,441,572 times
Reputation: 3543
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dopo View Post
Polarization occurs when the news media ignores the 90% of topics that we all agree on
and concentrate on the 10% we disagree on

On top of that, they make sure to only talk to people that are extremely passionate about those topics and act as if anybody that disagrees with them is "the enemy"
This. The news focuses on the negative. Add to this social media and we have a social time bomb.
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Old 12-08-2020, 10:28 AM
 
Location: Southwest Washington State
30,585 posts, read 25,144,036 times
Reputation: 50802
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dopo View Post
And at one point, it was considered a fact that "the sun revolves around the Earth"
and some troublemaker found out that that's not true and had to go against everybody's "common sense" to prove that he was right.
Actual facts don’t lie, of course. But many times in our lifetimes we have believed what we were taught as facts, only to find out later that the “facts” were not true. Our teaching of history has changed because certain facts have proved to have been interpreted through cultural bias.

One of the disturbing things about the pandemic is the constantly mutating of “facts” about it. Supposition has been reported as probable facts right from the start. It is pretty easy for those with an agenda to spin these “facts” in different ways. I think in a way that we have received too much info, too quickly. It is hard to absorb, and much of it proves untrue.

IMO, people tend to believe things that make sense to them, that reinforce beliefs and that don’t require adjustment of attitudes. This is a human behavior. All of us do this. But when people continue to disbelieve what is demonstrably true, they are dupes. They are still our human brothers and sisters, even though they are deluded. Being deluded does not rob them of their humanity.

IMO, strong extreme language coming from either “side” of an issue provokes similar extreme language from the other side. Violent behavior from one side provokes violent behavior from the other.
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