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I’ve read some articles stating gender isn’t as simple as XX or XY. OK, then how about a test and counseling prior to administering any medications and surgical procedures before making a permanent life altering procedure that cannot be reversed entirely? Some young people may be just confused or have other issues unrelated to the XX XY variations. Recently there have been cases of people who had gender reassignment surgery and went on to regret their decision with some even looking into filing a lawsuit against the professionals who helped them to get the procedure they asked for. At the very least there should be a standard procedure medical professionals should follow before going to hormone replacement and surgery procedures to ensure this is what the patient truly wants or if their issue is psychological
I think it should be up to the patient and their doctor. I am pretty sure there are standards that are required to be met before hormone replacement and surgeries.
I am not sure it should be a requirement, but there should be a discussion of variations, possible regret later, etc., and make sure the person understands that reversing it, would be an expensive and long process that might not go as smoothly as one would like. Also, with the possible lawsuits, they should have an agreement that is signed that says a person was refusing counseling and genetic testing. On variations, far too many people do not realize that it is not cut and dried with just two possibilities, so that needs to be explained for darn sure.
What a person truly wants is often "psychological" in nature, which makes it "real" to them. Ruling out other issues would always be a good idea, but forcing people, I am just not sure about that, as there is so much overstep on our freedoms already.
I’ve read some articles stating gender isn’t as simple as XX or XY. OK, then how about a test and counseling prior to administering any medications and surgical procedures before making a permanent life altering procedure that cannot be reversed entirely? Some young people may be just confused or have other issues unrelated to the XX XY variations. Recently there have been cases of people who had gender reassignment surgery and went on to regret their decision with some even looking into filing a lawsuit against the professionals who helped them to get the procedure they asked for. At the very least there should be a standard procedure medical professionals should follow before going to hormone replacement and surgery procedures to ensure this is what the patient truly wants or if their issue is psychological
No. It is not as simple as XX or XY and even genetically, there are other possible combinations that may present, all of which are aberrations. These abnormalities are usually discovered during adolescence or when the individual attempts to start a family.
Before proceeding with your question, I am curious about your interest in the subject. Do you have a child who is requesting gender reassignment surgery?
Do you worry that anyone is forcing or suggesting that you, or someone you love, obtain this procedure? Are you in some way an advocate for the transgender community? If so, please explain.
I ask because as for myself, I very rarely think about gender reassignment surgery. I am a heterosexual cis-gendered married woman with two adult, heterosexual cis-gendered children. No one in my immediate family has wanted or obtained this medically complicated and expensive procedure.
I have an acquaintance who obtained gender reassignment surgery over thirty years ago. She is very happy. productive, and well adjusted.
Personally, I have not read about the recent cases where people regret having this procedure. I do not doubt that it may have happened, but I have not read about these lawsuits. Do you have links?
As with any elective procedure, it is possible that there is an individual who regrets the procedure.
Possible, but not probable. Prospective candidates for gender reassignment surgery are subjected to rigorous screening, including psychiatric evaluations. That information is available on the web sites of hospitals that perform this rare procedure. If you are interested, you should use GOOGLE.
One reason why it is rare, is the cost involved. Many insurance companies will not pay for this.
What I do not understand is your last sentence "there should be a standard procedure medical professionals follow...to ensure that this is what the patient truly wants or if their issue is psychological"
You use the term "psychological" as though it is synonymous with whimsical, trivial, or fatuous. It is not.
If you are sincerely worried that "men are being turned into women" without a stringent protocol, you can relax. They are not.
What is more interesting to me, is why this is such a concern of yours - unless it personally involves you or a loved one.
I think that this procedure fundamentally makes you feel uncomfortable - almost to the point of anger. I am going to go out on a limb and guess that you think that gender reassignment surgery should be made illegal as elective termination of pregnancy has.
I sence moral outrage rather than sincere concern for transgender people.
No. It is not as simple as XX or XY and even genetically, there are other possible combinations that may present, all of which are aberrations. These abnormalities are usually discovered during adolescence or when the individual attempts to start a family.
Before proceeding with your question, I am curious about your interest in the subject. Do you have a child who is requesting gender reassignment surgery?
Do you worry that anyone is forcing or suggesting that you, or someone you love, obtain this procedure? Are you in some way an advocate for the transgender community? If so, please explain.
I ask because as for myself, I very rarely think about gender reassignment surgery. I am a heterosexual cis-gendered married woman with two adult, heterosexual cis-gendered children. No one in my immediate family has wanted or obtained this medically complicated and expensive procedure.
I have an acquaintance who obtained gender reassignment surgery over thirty years ago. She is very happy. productive, and well adjusted.
Personally, I have not read about the recent cases where people regret having this procedure. I do not doubt that it may have happened, but I have not read about these lawsuits. Do you have links?
As with any elective procedure, it is possible that there is an individual who regrets the procedure.
Possible, but not probable. Prospective candidates for gender reassignment surgery are subjected to rigorous screening, including psychiatric evaluations. That information is available on the web sites of hospitals that perform this rare procedure. If you are interested, you should use GOOGLE.
One reason why it is rare, is the cost involved. Many insurance companies will not pay for this.
What I do not understand is your last sentence "there should be a standard procedure medical professionals follow...to ensure that this is what the patient truly wants or if their issue is psychological"
You use the term "psychological" as though it is synonymous with whimsical, trivial, or fatuous. It is not.
If you are sincerely worried that "men are being turned into women" without a stringent protocol, you can relax. They are not.
What is more interesting to me, is why this is such a concern of yours - unless it personally involves you or a loved one.
I think that this procedure fundamentally makes you feel uncomfortable - almost to the point of anger. I am going to go out on a limb and guess that you think that gender reassignment surgery should be made illegal as elective termination of pregnancy has.
I sence moral outrage rather than sincere concern for transgender people.
I’ve read some articles stating gender isn’t as simple as XX or XY. OK, then how about a test and counseling prior to administering any medications and surgical procedures before making a permanent life altering procedure that cannot be reversed entirely?
Maybe not genetic testing, but most people going for gender reassignment surgery have to live as their desired gender for at least a year, and see a doctor and a therapist before they are recommended for the procedure. It's not something anyone decides on Monday and gets done by Friday.
Maybe not genetic testing, but most people going for gender reassignment surgery have to live as their desired gender for at least a year, and see a doctor and a therapist before they are recommended for the procedure. It's not something anyone decides on Monday and gets done by Friday.
I was thinking along these same lines. I honestly don't know how genetic testing would factor into this at all, but I don't pretend to be an expert. From what I understand that isn't a factor. But I think of gender reassignment along the same lines of other decisions that should only be made by informed consent. The potential side-effects and pitfalls should be explained, and I think the requirement that someone live within the gender of reassignment helps ensure it isn't a fly-by-night decision. I have a hard time believing people would go through gender reassignment without being committed and sure after all of that.
The caveat to that would be kids. I'm really torn on that front but on balance I don't support hormone therapy or surgery for kids before 18 because people really are going through a lot at that time, and are changing rapidly. Even then I know some who should be allowed to transition will be prevented but on balance my belief is that people should be considered under the age of consent for such procedures (just as they are under the age of consent for so many other things) until they are at the very least 16 and more properly 18. I also recognize there is part of that that can be read as "nanny state" but I also want to make sure kids are making their own decisions and not echoing the decisions of their parents.
I was thinking along these same lines. I honestly don't know how genetic testing would factor into this at all, but I don't pretend to be an expert. From what I understand that isn't a factor. But I think of gender reassignment along the same lines of other decisions that should only be made by informed consent. The potential side-effects and pitfalls should be explained, and I think the requirement that someone live within the gender of reassignment helps ensure it isn't a fly-by-night decision. I have a hard time believing people would go through gender reassignment without being committed and sure after all of that.
The caveat to that would be kids. I'm really torn on that front but on balance I don't support hormone therapy or surgery for kids before 18 because people really are going through a lot at that time, and are changing rapidly. Even then I know some who should be allowed to transition will be prevented but on balance my belief is that people should be considered under the age of consent for such procedures (just as they are under the age of consent for so many other things) until they are at the very least 16 and more properly 18. I also recognize there is part of that that can be read as "nanny state" but I also want to make sure kids are making their own decisions and not echoing the decisions of their parents.
Apparently there are international standards of care for transgendered people in terms of treatment. Hopefully any reputable provider will follow them. I looked at the standards out of curiosity, but the handbook was quite long. At any rate, the one provider I looked at required an evaluation and referral from a mental health provider before taking people on for top surgery and two providers before taking people on for bottom surgery. They also prefer people live with their self-affirmed gender for at least a year before undergoing surgery.
In the story in the Daily Mail, the person went through a private provider and then the NHS in the UK. It seems like the first place he went was a private clinic that possibly offered hormones, so it had a vested interest in diagnosing him with gender dysphoria requiring hormones. I am not sure what genetic testing has to do with it though. Certainly psychiatrists are able to order labs to check for any underlying issues. Many women have trouble taking hormones due to a variety of negative side effects such as mood effects. I know I took one pill that made me unbelievably depressed to the point where I was crying and didn’t want to get out of bed. I imagine that those side effects can also happen for people getting gender affirming treatment.
I’ve read some articles stating gender isn’t as simple as XX or XY. OK, then how about a test and counseling prior to administering any medications and surgical procedures before making a permanent life altering procedure that cannot be reversed entirely? Some young people may be just confused or have other issues unrelated to the XX XY variations. Recently there have been cases of people who had gender reassignment surgery and went on to regret their decision with some even looking into filing a lawsuit against the professionals who helped them to get the procedure they asked for. At the very least there should be a standard procedure medical professionals should follow before going to hormone replacement and surgery procedures to ensure this is what the patient truly wants or if their issue is psychological
A standard procedure for professionals established by who? And, who will enforce these "standards" the federal (or state) government? Or will it be left up to private practitioners to decide what their own procedure is before operating?
I'm not in favor of requiring fully grown adults to do such things, they can make these decisions for themselves. If they want to get counseling first it should be from their own desire to do so, not because they won't able to have the surgery if they don't go. Would they even take the session seriously if they were mandated to go, or would they just show up, sit there and mark the box when it's over? I think the latter
Last edited by SerlingHitchcockJPeele; 06-29-2022 at 09:12 AM..
The caveat to that would be kids. I'm really torn on that front but on balance I don't support hormone therapy or surgery for kids before 18 because people really are going through a lot at that time, and are changing rapidly. Even then I know some who should be allowed to transition will be prevented but on balance my belief is that people should be considered under the age of consent for such procedures (just as they are under the age of consent for so many other things) until they are at the very least 16 and more properly 18. I also recognize there is part of that that can be read as "nanny state" but I also want to make sure kids are making their own decisions and not echoing the decisions of their parents.
The argument for allowing minors to go on blockers/hormones (but not for surgery) is to reduce/eliminate the effects of a puberty against how they identify (and thus can "pass" easier and/or need fewer surgeries to achieve that goal than if they weren't allowed to medically transition until later). Having said that I do think that hormones for minors should be a VERY vetted process (strong feelings about their gender identity for many years, parents are not trying to "push" the child, etc.).
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