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Has society allowed the religious community to go to far? It plainly says in both government and religious text that the two should not ever blend. So why do we allow religions a choice to lobby?
I say that we should start treating those that are religious by the standards they wish to live by. If you are religious, then all sins become a crime but only to those that claim to be religious. Every sin in the bible, both new and old testament.
The reason I say this is because religious people often quote the bible where it tells what things are sins, but they seem to only do that on subjects they dont agree with. Technically, divorce should be illegal right? or does that no apply today.
I am just sick of you religious people using the bible for your own gain, but when it works against you, you claim that it doesnt mean exactly that. Make up your mind, either all of the bible is true and you should be legally obligated to uphold it if you are religious, or it is not true. There is no middle road, there is no more, this is correct and true but this is not when it comes to the bible.
Make up your freakin minds...
Yes...im still trying to figure out the reason why Secular Humanism which is a recognized Religion that nearly EVERY atheist embraces , is allowed to lobby and be the destructive force it is to our Youth both in school and in American Society thru its dogmas ...when this country was founded on Christian principles, morals, and values ... and how Government was to be limited in its effect on religion including the daily practice and public teaching of scientific creationism or intelligent design.
As for your last paragraph, instead of continuing with a misconception regarding The Bible, why not sign up for a course in the credibility for The Bible and Christianity so you can say youve really investigated it thoroughly. Many many have, and have found the evidences so compelling that they become Christians. Such was the case of the worlds foremost Law Professor who specialized in court evidence and is still considered THE best in his Field : Prof. Simon Greenleaf . He went thru it with a very fine toothed comb as an honest skeptic, and came out as a follower of Christ completely dedicating the remainder of his life to him. Would you be alright if it changed you too !?
Omaha you did some research? lol Unfortunately you are lacking the tools. Every business and every house who has people who work pay the same taxes as the church employees. We are talking property tax- we pay they don't. You once heard the words "separation of church and state" and now you want people to think you can actually use this phrase in a real argument. The state isn't interfering with the right to worship by taxing all buildings equally. In fact if you understood rather than just copied and pasted that phrase its more the OTHER WAY AROUND. By exempting churches the state is interfering and giving them a preference.
Stick to Jonah was eaten by a big whale and stop demonstrating why there is an inverse relationship between how zealous, and how educated you are.
Yes...im still trying to figure out the reason why Secular Humanism which is a recognized Religion that nearly EVERY atheist embraces , is allowed to lobby and be the destructive force it is to our Youth both in school and in American Society thru its dogmas ...when this country was founded on Christian principles, morals, and values ... and how Government was to be limited in its effect on religion including the daily practice and public teaching of scientific creationism or intelligent design.
As for your last paragraph, instead of continuing with a misconception regarding The Bible, why not sign up for a course in the credibility for The Bible and Christianity so you can say youve really investigated it thoroughly. Many many have, and have found the evidences so compelling that they become Christians. Such was the case of the worlds foremost Law Professor who specialized in court evidence and is still considered THE best in his Field : Prof. Simon Greenleaf . He went thru it with a very fine toothed comb as an honest skeptic, and came out as a follower of Christ completely dedicating the remainder of his life to him. Would you be alright if it changed you too !?
First off, People can lead good, happy and functional lives without Biblical influances. People who dont believe in a higher power do good things every day and live happy lives. If christians can lobby than so can they.
Also, I was once a Christian, I have taken so many bible study classes and that is the reason I am why I am. I am not saying there isnt any good in the bible, there are some great ideas, but no one should be forced to believe in them.
'First off, People can lead good, happy and functional lives without Biblical influances. People who dont believe in a higher power do good things every day and live happy lives. If christians can lobby than so can they.'
REPLY: Non Christian people can do good things and live morally...its just that they cant justify doing them apart from a Creator who instituted absolute moral laws. They may live happy lives but on their deathbed (should they have opportunity) they look back on their lives without having realized their ultimate purpose for living ; its been all for Self , and theyre left with a void in their heart still. We each have a God Shaped void that only he was meant to fill because we are fashioned in his image -- the Universes Creator. To miss his plan for your life which includes eternity, is the epitomie of regret.
'Also, I was once a Christian, I have taken so many bible study classes and that is the reason I am why I am. I am not saying there isnt any good in the bible, there are some great ideas, but no one should be forced to believe in them.
'
REPLY: Its a fact that you cant force anyone to believe in something ; we've been given free will to choose. Were you forced when you were growing up ? Did you have some bad experiences while you were a child or from going to church ? Many have which is why they go their own way. I can appreciate that, but, God is still there and he hasnt moved . He understands and hopes we will return to him and worship with others in a corporate atmosphere that is healthy and well balanced.
Last edited by RVlover; 09-01-2009 at 07:39 PM..
Reason: added
Seems o me that most folks who start up threads like this just have a personal ax to grind with people of faith, for whatever reason, and, they ALWAYS bring up 'the separation of church and state'. First, that little term needs to be clarified. The Framers put that little clause in our Constitution to keep what happened in Europe and England from happening here. The Vatican calling the shots, and holding the reins of power, semi covertly, from the pulpit, altar, whatever. These days, many people are taking the intent of the separation to a far flung extreme, actually going as far as to say that atheism is the true intent. Not hardly. Our founders were merely taking a lesson from things like the Inquisition, and oh so many other power grabs by the church. This has NOTHING to do with whether or not kids can pray in school, or have a Bible study group as an extracurricular club. The lengths that anti religion groups have gone to in many things is as much a perversion of the intent of the first amendment as outright banning of a faith in favor of another. Face it folks, by not allowing kids ,who wish to, to bring their faith to school with them, in a private way, we are supporting atheism as, basically, a state sponsored belief. Sam with taking God out of the pledge, prayer before things like sessions of congress etc. Many people wish to see ALL reference to faith struck away. This is a dangerous idea, just as dangerous as allowing a large central church to dominate our government from behind a curtain. FREEDOM of religion means just that. We are free to worship , or not, as we see fit. There are just as many wacko atheists out there who wish to make power bids as there are 'churches'. I'm not a religious person, at all, but the promotion of a complete lack of faith , in all aspects of our governance, in our schools etc, smacks of a rank hypocracy, by uninformed and self righteous groups who want to read far more into the first amendment than is actually there. LMAO, and they call the religious groups self righteous.
'First off, People can lead good, happy and functional lives without Biblical influances. People who dont believe in a higher power do good things every day and live happy lives. If christians can lobby than so can they.'
REPLY: Non Christian people can do good things and live morally...its just that they cant justify doing them apart from a Creator who instituted absolute moral laws. They may live happy lives but on their deathbed (should they have opportunity) they look back on their lives without having realized their ultimate purpose for living ; its been all for Self , and theyre left with a void in their heart still. We each have a God Shaped void that only he was meant to fill because we are fashioned in his image -- the Universes Creator. To miss his plan for your life which includes eternity, is the epitomie of regret.
'Also, I was once a Christian, I have taken so many bible study classes and that is the reason I am why I am. I am not saying there isnt any good in the bible, there are some great ideas, but no one should be forced to believe in them.
'
REPLY: Its a fact that you cant force anyone to believe in something ; we've been given free will to choose. Were you forced when you were growing up ? Did you have some bad experiences while you were a child or from going to church ? Many have which is why they go their own way. I can appreciate that, but, God is still there and he hasnt moved . He understands and hopes we will return to him and worship with others in a corporate atmosphere that is healthy and well balanced.
You aksed for it...here is my story...I grew up as a Catholic, I was raised to fear and never question God or his will. We went to church around the holidays only. This went on till I was about 19 when I met a girl who was mormon, two years after meeting her we got married. I fallowed and studied the bible for the first time in my life for two years. That didnt last because my wife and I where just two different people. I never bought into her beliefs either. After about a year of no church or religious activity, my brother started asking me if I wanted to go to church with him at a church called life center, it is a four square gospal Christian church...my favorite of all churches. I did that for about 3 years and took a bible study class the whole time. At this same time I was taking a logic class and a few philosophy classes. Religion became a big thing to me, I studied it imensly and tried to fallow its every word. But the more I studdied it, the more I began to realize the falseness in it. Yes, some of its teachings are whole hearted and worth fallowing, but these are basic human priciples. To say that they are God inspiried is false. These basic human morals where established long before religion or the bible.
This bring us to current times, Where I believe that a person can live a just, good, and fulfilling life without religion. All one has to do is bring happiness to others, and bring happiness to one self. There is nothing more needed to be done. there is no claim or credit given needed to a god, we all act on out own, thus the credit for anything we do is ours and not some false deity.
Dont get me wrong, I would say half of the religious community are good people, the rest have it all wrong.
This county was not founded on religion of any kind, it was founded on freedome to choose for ones self. It was founded on the principle that a person could believe what they want without religious persicution, this means the church could not persicute them/us, and that the government could not persicute those that believed in a hirer power.
I am still waiting for any evidance that god truley exists. The only proof you could give me would be meeting the big cheese himself. maybe a talking burning bush, but most drugs can account for all of the "sighting" of god that are in the bible. A bad drug trip could have induced many godly/heavenly sightings.
God(s) are simply a way to bring comfort to those who fear the unknown. There is nothing wrong with believing in a God, or the bible, as long as it is kept to yourself. Now, there are two reasons the bible and your beliefs should be kept to yourself.
1. Not everyone believes in the bible or your god.
2. Religion is something that people wrap around their lifestyle and not the other way around. So everyone believes something differant, everyones take on the bible and god are differant.
These two reasons alone should be enough to keep people from "sharing" their beliefs. If you really think it is your duty to convert everyone...here is what you should do...
Give everyone that you feel you need to save a bible(most churches give these away) ask them to read it and if they have any questions to ask you about them. After that your part is done, it is now all up to that person, dont ask them about it again, dont tell them that their way of living is wrong or false, just let them ponder the choice they have.
I personally dont think it matters if you believe or not, if you do and your right, good for you and I hope your ready for hell. If you dont believe, and you live a good life...welcome to heaven you did everything right. If you do or dont believe and you do wrong, satan will welcome you with open arms and have the presidential suite waiting for you, because you did exactly what you wanted him to do.
I grew out of fairy tales long ago, There is one that I am thinking about and that is the god Ninkasi, the goddess of brewing and beer. It is supposably one of the earliest referances to a god.
That is another thing that gets me, why is it that the Christian god is real but the greek gods and goddesses are not? dont the greek gods predate the Christian ones? DOnt they all have just as much proof?
Every religion thinks they are right, they cant all be right...so which one is right? are any of them right?
Has society allowed the religious community to go to far? It plainly says in both government and religious text that the two should not ever blend. So why do we allow religions a choice to lobby?
I say that we should start treating those that are religious by the standards they wish to live by. If you are religious, then all sins become a crime but only to those that claim to be religious. Every sin in the bible, both new and old testament.
The reason I say this is because religious people often quote the bible where it tells what things are sins, but they seem to only do that on subjects they dont agree with. Technically, divorce should be illegal right? or does that no apply today.
I am just sick of you religious people using the bible for your own gain, but when it works against you, you claim that it doesnt mean exactly that. Make up your mind, either all of the bible is true and you should be legally obligated to uphold it if you are religious, or it is not true. There is no middle road, there is no more, this is correct and true but this is not when it comes to the bible.
Make up your freakin minds...
Well, y'know, I think liberals go "way too far", but I also know that I'm stuck with them all around me. And although I don't try to be "pollitically correct" ~ MY big SIN here in the Portland area ~ I pretty much zip my lips, cast votes that don't match theirs most of the time, and go on my merry way. Very easy to do when one is a loner like me.
Everyone is a hypocrite to some degree,including you and myself.Some are more than others and some are downright liars that use people and think they are never wrong.There are good, bad and mislead people of all different religious affiliations.But the basic answer to your question is No.In fact it is the total opposite, liberalism has been allowed to go too far leading to a "downward spiral effect". It is quite apparent.
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First, that little term needs to be clarified. The Framers put that little clause in our Constitution to keep what happened in Europe and England from happening here. The Vatican calling the shots, and holding the reins of power, semi covertly, from the pulpit, altar, whatever. These days, many people are taking the intent of the separation to a far flung extreme, actually going as far as to say that atheism is the true intent. Not hardly. Our founders were merely taking a lesson from things like the Inquisition, and oh so many other power grabs by the church. This has NOTHING to do with whether or not kids can pray in school, or have a Bible study group as an extracurricular club. The lengths that anti religion groups have gone to in many things is as much a perversion of the intent of the first amendment as outright banning of a faith in favor of another. Face it folks, by not allowing kids ,who wish to, to bring their faith to school with them, in a private way, we are supporting atheism as, basically, a state sponsored belief. Sam with taking God out of the pledge, prayer before things like sessions of congress etc. Many people wish to see ALL reference to faith struck away. This is a dangerous idea, just as dangerous as allowing a large central church to dominate our government from behind a curtain. FREEDOM of religion means just that. We are free to worship , or not, as we see fit. There are just as many wacko atheists out there who wish to make power bids as there are 'churches'. I'm not a religious person, at all, but the promotion of a complete lack of faith , in all aspects of our governance, in our schools etc, smacks of a rank hypocracy, by uninformed and self righteous groups who want to read far more into the first amendment than is actually there. LMAO, and they call the religious groups self righteous.
