Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Okay guys, I know there have been tons of threads on this, but I think my views on the whole Middle Class America must be completely wrong. I know there are several things that play into what makes a person Middle Class or not, but what I would like to know is what is your idea of Middle/Working Class.
My idea is an average family - 2 parents both make a decent income, but nothing crazy, that own a home, a car, live in a decent neighborhood, kids go to good schools (that you don't pay for), kids play little league, swim, gymnastics or what ever sport they like. After all of that you can still afford to go to a movie and dinner once or twice a month. I realize that this is pinpointing this down to what you can buy versus class, but I'm a firm believer that with wealth does not come class. Some of the most ill mannered people I know have money and some of the most well mannered people come from very humble means.
Am I wrong? Do I expect too much? Can you tell me?
Last edited by Reads2MUCH; 02-19-2009 at 11:49 AM..
I think the classes have to do with money and the ability to have those things mentioned (spouse, car, home, neighborhood, education...), but not necessarily. There are plenty of middle class single people who prefer living in their own way. "Class" has different meanings, as there are some low-class middle-class people, but in most cases it's financial.
There are economic standards. Or there were. They are changed often so there will still BE a middle class. What I see are people who were the upper middle class in mc mantions with debt that will swallow them and those who were the true middle sinking away faster. The idea of specific things and numbers as mentioned sounds like a wish list of my generation.
And there are values. I was raised firmly middle class. But my adult life has been at best marginally in the financial part and often clearly away from that. But in the values I learned that is my identity. Those who keep those values are the ones who keep the middle class alive. I suspect when the big bubble of stuff and credit and NOW! splits and falls, those who still have it will rediscover it. Those who don't will learn or not. But those values are what made us the nation we became and this is as important as economics to restore. Including the idea of buying what you want when you have the money. I have little money and not a lot of stuff, but when having to do a credit check they told me I dont' have enough credit. Didn't have the money to pay for it, didn't want the credit card.
To me these values are what ancor us and in the end what will save us.
I agree with you and this gives me another view point. I guess my problem with all this is that the days of a Firefighter dad being able to buy a home and have is wife stay home with the 2 kids are gone, because of the inflated price of everything. That is more where I was going in my thoughts. However, I definitely see your point of view. I'm just sad that what use to be a middle/working class person has now basically been pushed to the lower spectrum of things economically. Would you agree?
Miidle class has alweays prtetty much meant owning a home of your own and most times having a car.It pretty much means not having to skim on food also. it includes lower ;to upper.Now days the standard has chanegd alot to where lower middle class often live more like upper miidle class in the 50-60's but don't save near as much and often have alot more debt to income ratio.
I agree with you and this gives me another view point. I guess my problem with all this is that the days of a Firefighter dad being able to buy a home and have is wife stay home with the 2 kids are gone, because of the inflated price of everything. That is more where I was going in my thoughts. However, I definitely see your point of view. I'm just sad that what use to be a middle/working class person has now basically been pushed to the lower spectrum of things economically. Would you agree?
I agree with this. Once we went to a two parent working, kids raised by strangers lifestyle so people could have more materialism it began to spiral down.
So what's your definition of "a decent neighborhood"? Some people think a neighborhood is only "decent" if all the houses are 4,000 square feet and if all the neighbors are white. Others have different standards.
Oh boy - that isn't my standard at all, I don't want to live next to all anything. A decent neighborhood, is where you can let your kids out to ride a bike and not have to worry that they are going to get beat up for their bike, a place where you don't have to be your neighbors best friend, but if you were getting robbed, they'd be inclined to call the police. Things along those lines.
VERY basically, years ago in "Soc" class, it was explained that the Middle Class (at one time about 85% of all Americans) was that segment of society "too poor to quit working, but too rich to be angry". That was a long time ago, and that MAY not be too accurate, but it once explained why our society 'worked' as well as it did...Our 'comfortable, vested' middle class felt a 'stake' in society, and an ability to control their own destiny, lacking in most of the world. While others violently revolted every few years, our system had the 'peaceful transfer of power' at each election, and the loser became not the 'disgraced party', but the 'loyal opposition'.
Today, the middle class is under severe stress. Offshoring of jobs, illegal immigration, falling wages and benefits, and corporate downsizing, are pushing us away from a nation of middle-class 'owners', toward a disjointed society of the 'Filthy rich' and the 'angry poor', with no one in between.....the way MOST of the world lives.
More than just 'dollars-and-cents' wealth, it's the existence of a 'middle class' that allows a pleasant, equitable society, free from overt class hatred and strife. Our American middle class MOSTLY dates from just after World War II. THat was the huge postwar move to the suburbs, to home ownership, to car ownership, to work-place benefits, and the 'good life'. It bred our American sense of 'equality'. Whether our great-grandchildren will be able have a 'middle class' lifestyle is questionable..
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
