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Old 11-29-2009, 06:55 AM
 
Location: United States
2,497 posts, read 7,477,915 times
Reputation: 2270

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We were talking about this the other day actually. My idea is similar; a woman is allowed 1 abortion, she gets knocked up again she is forced to have the kid and the doctor ties her tubes.
I don't think abortion should be used as birth control.
Yeah the Vasectomy idea is good too. I had one a couple years ago because I don't want kids, best investment I ever made! Only took 15 minutes and was pretty much painless.
To me though it's about more than just whether a guy can pay support. That's just the money side of it. What about the emotional side? A man should be there for his child, he should be there as a FATHER, not just a sperm donor who pays weekly installments on a life he helped create. I know that I could never be that guy, I am too selfish, so I took the initiative to make sure there were no "accidents". A human life should never be an accident.
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Old 11-29-2009, 07:12 AM
 
Location: Victoria TX
42,554 posts, read 86,977,099 times
Reputation: 36644
Quote:
Originally Posted by brightdoglover View Post
Unfortunately, a population's size is determined by the number of fertile females, not males.
Imagine a desert island. In one scenario, you have one woman and nine men, with the woman willing to have sex with all nine. In nine months, how many kids would you have born?
Now you have nine woman and one man, again, all nine having sex with the one man. In nine months, how many kids can be born?
In a population that is more or less monogamous, a workable method of pest control consists of introducing a large number of sterile males into the population. Humans are more or less monogamous, and we are talking about pest control here, aren't we?
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Old 11-29-2009, 06:51 PM
 
2,994 posts, read 5,772,802 times
Reputation: 1822
Quote:
Originally Posted by leavingGA View Post
Here is my humble proposal for the fastest way to end welfare while still improving the lives of all children in the US.

Since it's okay by society rules for me to sleep around,........
Im afraid youve started out with a faulty premise ; it doesnt matter what OTHERS dictate , it matters ONLY what God dictates for how you live your life. It is GOD, not Society that you will have to give a personal account toward on how you chose to live your life and what you did with the life he allowed you to live. If you havent lived your life to his moral ideals which are meant for your protection and greatest responsible living .... then you should know he is the God of second chances who has his loving arm outstretched in your direction . If you are willing to take his hand , tell him youre sorry for messing up, trust the finished work of Christ on the cross as a substitionary death on your behalf, and ask him for his power for you to live correctly...then he will give you that power and a promise he shall never leave you --- both now in this life, and for eternity to come. Its really pretty easy to see which has the greatest benefits . Hope to see you on the other side one day.
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Old 11-29-2009, 06:57 PM
 
3,631 posts, read 10,234,990 times
Reputation: 2039
Quote:
Originally Posted by 007.5 View Post
Im afraid youve started out with a faulty premise ; it doesnt matter what OTHERS dictate , it matters ONLY what God dictates for how you live your life. It is GOD, not Society that you will have to give a personal account toward on how you chose to live your life and what you did with the life he allowed you to live. If you havent lived your life to his moral ideals which are meant for your protection and greatest responsible living .... then you should know he is the God of second chances who has his loving arm outstretched in your direction . If you are willing to take his hand , tell him youre sorry for messing up, trust the finished work of Christ on the cross as a substitionary death on your behalf, and ask him for his power for you to live correctly...then he will give you that power and a promise he shall never leave you --- both now in this life, and for eternity to come. Its really pretty easy to see which has the greatest benefits . Hope to see you on the other side one day.
Not for those of us that don't believe in god. Sorry!
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Old 11-29-2009, 07:17 PM
 
Location: I think my user name clarifies that.
8,292 posts, read 26,678,490 times
Reputation: 3925
Quote:
Originally Posted by leavingGA View Post
Here is my humble proposal for the fastest way to end welfare while still improving the lives of all children in the US.

Since it's okay by society rules for me to sleep around, maybe the men should get forced to get vascetomy if they get over $7K behind in child support or have more than one they refuse to pay for. Innocent children should not be forced into poverty because their dads leave them. PERIOD.

The rules should apply to ALL men regardless of race, education, socio-economics, work history, whatever. They get only one "chance" to screw up one kid by being lazy or whatever motivates men to cheat their OWN kids. But the main point is that there are standards of responsibility and the first option will make all the abortion debates moot. Women with kids have a hard time working and even more so with special needs kids. Women make less money anyway so it's time to make the men pay. Women who can't get pregnant won't have abortions, so that moral issue goes away too.

If ANY men who sow their wild oats can't keep making kids, then it benefits EVERY taxpayer in the long run.

lol...Don't worry I am not going to check on the answers but I think this the ONE solution everyone avoids....Yes, I even think the rule should apply to women. In modern age, no one woman needs more than 2 kids or 2 pregnancies. FYI, I only had 2 and my tubes are tied. I was married but marriage is not permanent either.
I got a vasectomy after my wife & I decided we were done having children. Not a big deal. We'll have our 26th Wedding Anniversary this week, and I've gotta tell you that 10 years of sex without any pregnancy concerns has been very nice!
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Old 11-29-2009, 10:37 PM
 
Location: SA
744 posts, read 1,209,866 times
Reputation: 573
I think the OP must have had a man walk out on her and her kid(s) but saying that forcing any surgery on a man will correct the problems of Abortion and Welfare is way of base. We need to correct to moral compass of each individual first to where it is not OK by society rules for someone to sleep around. It needs to start at home with good role models for kids to follow. As far as welfare there needs to be accountability there (only a strict allowance for aid) and we need to make sure that only legal Americans are getting aid. Right now I believe there are to many illegals having babies here to get someone in the family as American and thus begin to drain our resources and $. If a woman chooses to pick a loser to have a child with, she needs to own up to making a bad pick and be able to explain to the little one that some lessons in life are not cheap. As far as women getting paid less than men, that may be the case in some fields however Military men and women get the same (pay grade). You choose where you work so if you are getting less than you deserve go somewhere else where it has a payscale established for the position. We should not blame society rules when you are making bad choices personally.
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Old 11-29-2009, 11:06 PM
 
4,500 posts, read 12,344,990 times
Reputation: 2901
Quote:
Originally Posted by 007.5 View Post
Im afraid youve started out with a faulty premise ; it doesnt matter what OTHERS dictate , it matters ONLY what God dictates for how you live your life. It is GOD, not Society that you will have to give a personal account toward on how you chose to live your life and what you did with the life he allowed you to live. If you havent lived your life to his moral ideals which are meant for your protection and greatest responsible living .... then you should know he is the God of second chances who has his loving arm outstretched in your direction . If you are willing to take his hand , tell him youre sorry for messing up, trust the finished work of Christ on the cross as a substitionary death on your behalf, and ask him for his power for you to live correctly...then he will give you that power and a promise he shall never leave you --- both now in this life, and for eternity to come. Its really pretty easy to see which has the greatest benefits . Hope to see you on the other side one day.
That's given we'd accept, for the sake of argument that there is a God. Which, in questions raised by the OP, isn't a viable option, as the existence of a God can't be proven, and therefore should never be used in debates of this nature.

You may think you'll be judged by a higher power, but basing an objective debate on such a personal matter is stupid.
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Old 11-29-2009, 11:20 PM
 
Location: Illinois
4,751 posts, read 5,439,701 times
Reputation: 13001
Forcing people to do/not do something in regards to reproduction has disastrous consequences (Hello? China?) The real solution would be : 100% effective, safe, cheap (or free as needed), easily obtained birth control with no side effects. The only reason it has not been created already is because it would hold no profit for the pharmaceutical companies. And for those of you who say it already exists in other forms of birth control, not one of them fufills all the above.
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Old 11-29-2009, 11:27 PM
 
Location: southern california
61,288 posts, read 87,420,711 times
Reputation: 55562
how strange-- the same country that tried the germans in nuremberg in 1945, for essentially the same stuff--- would make such an OP.
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Old 11-29-2009, 11:28 PM
 
Location: Houston/Heights
2,637 posts, read 4,463,432 times
Reputation: 977
Quote:
Originally Posted by leavingGA View Post
Here is my humble proposal for the fastest way to end welfare while still improving the lives of all children in the US.

Since it's okay by society rules for me to sleep around, maybe the men should get forced to get vascetomy if they get over $7K behind in child support or have more than one they refuse to pay for. Innocent children should not be forced into poverty because their dads leave them. PERIOD.

The rules should apply to ALL men regardless of race, education, socio-economics, work history, whatever. They get only one "chance" to screw up one kid by being lazy or whatever motivates men to cheat their OWN kids. But the main point is that there are standards of responsibility and the first option will make all the abortion debates moot. Women with kids have a hard time working and even more so with special needs kids. Women make less money anyway so it's time to make the men pay. Women who can't get pregnant won't have abortions, so that moral issue goes away too.

If ANY men who sow their wild oats can't keep making kids, then it benefits EVERY taxpayer in the long run.

lol...Don't worry I am not going to check on the answers but I think this the ONE solution everyone avoids....Yes, I even think the rule should apply to women. In modern age, no one woman needs more than 2 kids or 2 pregnancies. FYI, I only had 2 and my tubes are tied. I was married but marriage is not permanent either.
the problem I have with vasectomys, is they create their own problems. the body continues to produce sperm. But since they now have no where to go, the body must absorb them. So Ones white blood cells then must fight the sperm cells, as they see them as invaders. we basically have a war with our selves.
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