Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
There was a federal study of all this a couple of years ago that indicated solar thermal was a killer except the plants costs too much Asd I remember pv was an also ran. I would also note that solar thermal is being built. Boondogle? They are interesting assemblies.
LOL other than it costs too much. That's like saying "Other than that how was the play Mrs. Lincoln?"
PV an also ran? Your memory is really poor. Over 700 MW of pv were installed Q1 of 2013, more than the total STEG installed base. There is no STEG outside the Mojave Desert. It's a niche curiosity of a technology.
Well you started off bad and went down hill from there. The original OP question is anything but simple involving vast technical areas and even a bit of sociology. It was in no way a simple question.
Went to page one of this thread, where did you get vast technical areas and a bit of sociology that made this anything more than simple? Here is what I read:
"My main question is, if you buy an 1800 watt system (that's 1.8 kW, right?), what exactly does that mean? That it is constantly generating that much electricity? Or that much withing a certain time interval?
(I got ^ from here: NPower Solar Power Package — 1800 Watts | Battery Backup Packages| Northern Tool + Equipment)
I have been looking at my energy usage via the smart meter and if I understand it correctly, I am using just under 5 kWh in an hour when my air conditioning is running.
I want to start with a small kit to kind of understand the nuts and bolts of it, but I need a little more understanding of how it works to begin with. I am hoping to get a small one to charge a battery to run my pool pump at night. I'm not sure if that is a good starter project or not."
Maybe I read a different thread? Seems the OP wanted to run a pool pump and delve into solar energy a bit (obvious small install). If you read something different then perhaps you can point to the first post and correct me but that post seems pretty simple to me. Even hammers seem complex when you hear an engineer explain how it's made and how the physics of the darn thing come into play when all you want to do is drive nail.
What was truly amazing is that in about 3 replies it went some simple to an engineering expedition to rival the collosal efforts to build the Hoover Dam. Look at them yourself, graphs, all the "you shouldn't and "dont".
It became complex when the engineering contest started. Show me different.
Went to page one of this thread, where did you get vast technical areas and a bit of sociology that made this anything more than simple? Here is what I read:
"My main question is, if you buy an 1800 watt system (that's 1.8 kW, right?), what exactly does that mean? That it is constantly generating that much electricity? Or that much withing a certain time interval?
(I got ^ from here: NPower Solar Power Package — 1800 Watts | Battery Backup Packages| Northern Tool + Equipment)
I have been looking at my energy usage via the smart meter and if I understand it correctly, I am using just under 5 kWh in an hour when my air conditioning is running.
I want to start with a small kit to kind of understand the nuts and bolts of it, but I need a little more understanding of how it works to begin with. I am hoping to get a small one to charge a battery to run my pool pump at night. I'm not sure if that is a good starter project or not."
Maybe I read a different thread? Seems the OP wanted to run a pool pump and delve into solar energy a bit (obvious small install). If you read something different then perhaps you can point to the first post and correct me but that post seems pretty simple to me. Even hammers seem complex when you hear an engineer explain how it's made and how the physics of the darn thing come into play when all you want to do is drive nail.
What was truly amazing is that in about 3 replies it went some simple to an engineering expedition to rival the collosal efforts to build the Hoover Dam. Look at them yourself, graphs, all the "you shouldn't and "dont".
It became complex when the engineering contest started. Show me different.
She did not understand the basics well enough to ask her question. A lot of this discussion has been about helping her to understand he application a bit. What she had in mind was a trickle charged battery running a pump at night. That is of course not workable as a pump is a large load capable of draining a couple of hundred ampere hour batteries in minutes.
So you then get into the generic discussions of pv and its parameters and how you put together such a system.
The digression into costs of techniques to generate power was not really appropriate to the thread. i would note though that OP helped start that redirection.
LOL other than it costs too much. That's like saying "Other than that how was the play Mrs. Lincoln?"
PV an also ran? Your memory is really poor. Over 700 MW of pv were installed Q1 of 2013, more than the total STEG installed base. There is no STEG outside the Mojave Desert. It's a niche curiosity of a technology.
Costs numbers would indicate it somewhat less capital intensive than nuclear, offshore wind or some of the better varieties of clean coal. At this point the advantage of PV would appear over powering. One wonders why the installations in the Mojave.
With that I quit on this thread. It really is too heavy a digression..
She did not understand the basics well enough to ask her question. A lot of this discussion has been about helping her to understand he application a bit. What she had in mind was a trickle charged battery running a pump at night. That is of course not workable as a pump is a large load capable of draining a couple of hundred ampere hour batteries in minutes.
So you then get into the generic discussions of pv and its parameters and how you put together such a system.
The digression into costs of techniques to generate power was not really appropriate to the thread. i would note though that OP helped start that redirection.
Now I'm laughing. Sorry but that is isn't rocket science. It really is simple, what the OP wanted to do was simple and so was the question.
The answers were nothing short of a knowledge competition to see who knows more about solar energy than everyone else. Big dogs in a small yard. JMHO.
You know you suffer from a very high chutzpah level with little talent to go with that...Here is your first contribution.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mack Knife
We're all forgetting something. For many people, using solar energy like the OP wants to do is more about personal satisfaction than the economic savings. Lifestyle considerations have a lot to do with the choice to use solar energy for seemingly uneconomic benefits.
There is no benefit to the environment for gird tied solar energy systems and the economic benefits are mostly driven to the utility company, not the end user who installed the system and gets a discount on their electricity.
Most utility companies are under some mandate to generate a certain amount of their energy distribution and generation from solar. They are allowed to count the energy from grid tied systems into the mix. They get money for that. Then, they are still selling the user energy, just at a lesser total cost but that reduction is far less than the benefits they get from having you grid tied to them. The winner is the utility company, not the end user with a grid tied system.
The we have the environmental impacts. That grid tied system has zero impact on the environment as a benefit. The utility companies aren't generating less energy from fossil fuels because of grid tied systems, they just sell that energy to business customers instead and guess who pays for the reduced energy rates utility companies give to business customers? You, the grid tied consumer customer.
A grid tied system also reduces or can eliminate your ability to moderate energy usage from the utility company. In a typical home installation, the amount of energy that is harvested can equal the amount of draw for say the refrigerator, the TV and some other appliances, on a good harvest day. On those days where energy use is high and the utility companies are asking you to limit energy use they are not considering that you are grid tied and therefore probably contributing more than your use. Basically, it is a numbers game and the utility companies have figured out that they can charge you (or someone) for grid tied systems and in the end, they, not you are making money from the investment you made.
The alternative isn't pretty since non-grid tied systems are expensive and also have maintenance costs that go on for the life of the system but as a society, we have allowed the utility companies to run amok when it comes to rates, energy generations schemes and the loser is always the customer, grid tied or not.
Do you realize how incorrect that all is? Don't you understand any of this? Any energy acquired from grid tied solar decreases the energy derived from non-renewable sources...simple as that.
Solar installation certainly pay. The payback period is still too long in my mind but getting shorter.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mack Knife
Easier. Go down to Home Depot or some place like that and get one of those current draw meters like a "Kill-A-Watt".
There are different models and some can be used with higher draw appliances.
You plug them in, in between the source of electricity and appliance and it does everything for you even calculating the cost based on the price you pay for electricity from the utility. Royobi makes one too.
With these things you plug it in and wait a period of time and check it and all the information you need is there including conversions to watts, averages and even max and minimums. All without resorting to complex calculations. The one from Royobi even allows you to move the meter from appliance to appliance and it will cumulatively add up totals so you can even get a whole house picture of your electric energy consumption.
The problem with using an ammeter is that is gives you a snapshot in time only, not real use information.
One of those handy little gadgets will give you not only the current draw at the time but also cumulative over time so that you can figure on real world conditions.
Ammeters are great for checking things in real time and for other necessary work but for calculating the draw of appliances over time they are nearly worthless if the appliance doesn't run all the time or varies with load.
Buy it, plug it in and read it, it doesn't get easier.
More nonsense. Gadgetry run amok. What OP needs to do is read the nameplate on the motor.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mack Knife
Really? How are they getting electricity to the pump now? OP said they wanted to put in a battery and charge it with a PV. The pump is probably DC but that is likely plugged into something that is getting electric or why bother with an ammeter?
If the pump is connected to a converter of sorts, the kill-a-watt or similar goes in between. They already have the pool pump. They probably aren't charging a battery manually and dragging the charger or battery around to keep it maintained.
Wherever the pump get its source from, the device goes there. It doesn't have to be made out to be so difficult.
OP wants to charge a battery to run a pump powered by electric from a battery which is in turn maintained by a PV. One can always engineer something or just do it and be done with it.
NO OP does not want to charge a battery and use it to run a pump. She simply wants to run her pool pump off solar. And she can perfectly well do that with a simple array/inverter.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mack Knife
Oh please. There is no magic in setting up PVs and you don't need to be an engineer to do it either. You can get everything you need at a local store. You can get the knowledge from any one of several (probably thousands) of websites, just not the engineering ones.
Consider this thread. OP asked a simple question and the answer was simple too. Now, anyone go ahead and read this thread and stop when you get to engineering and see how incredibly convoluted, complicated and off topic it became.
Thousands of years ago engineers figured out a way to build the Pyramids. Then it took engineers thousands of years to figure out how they did it. To date, none of them could do it again.
I rest my case.
To the OP: Save yourself a lot of time and frustration. Visit Arizona Sun Wind and they have a primer there that will get you on the way to getting this done. They have a forum there and if you ask, someone will even make up a list of what you need and a step by step instruction on how to do it. It won't be hard, expensive or complicated if you explain what you want to do.
And you still have not figured out what the OP is up to even though she told you in plain language.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mack Knife
Went to page one of this thread, where did you get vast technical areas and a bit of sociology that made this anything more than simple? Here is what I read:
"My main question is, if you buy an 1800 watt system (that's 1.8 kW, right?), what exactly does that mean? That it is constantly generating that much electricity? Or that much withing a certain time interval?
(I got ^ from here: NPower Solar Power Package — 1800 Watts | Battery Backup Packages| Northern Tool + Equipment)
I have been looking at my energy usage via the smart meter and if I understand it correctly, I am using just under 5 kWh in an hour when my air conditioning is running.
I want to start with a small kit to kind of understand the nuts and bolts of it, but I need a little more understanding of how it works to begin with. I am hoping to get a small one to charge a battery to run my pool pump at night. I'm not sure if that is a good starter project or not."
Maybe I read a different thread? Seems the OP wanted to run a pool pump and delve into solar energy a bit (obvious small install). If you read something different then perhaps you can point to the first post and correct me but that post seems pretty simple to me. Even hammers seem complex when you hear an engineer explain how it's made and how the physics of the darn thing come into play when all you want to do is drive nail.
What was truly amazing is that in about 3 replies it went some simple to an engineering expedition to rival the collosal efforts to build the Hoover Dam. Look at them yourself, graphs, all the "you shouldn't and "dont".
It became complex when the engineering contest started. Show me different.
How would you know that? You still have not figured out what the lady was trying to do.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
