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Old 06-29-2016, 10:21 AM
 
1,168 posts, read 1,229,678 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DCforever View Post
The US manufactures more product today than it did in 1975. Like many people you believe what you see out your back porch is representative of the rest of the world.
?? How do you come up with this?
It is a ridiculous statement .
You must be thinking value of products. What we produce is weapons, gasoline, and some cars. If you take inflation into account we are way, way, in the hole.

Last edited by Joe33; 06-29-2016 at 10:45 AM..
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Old 06-29-2016, 11:35 AM
509
 
6,321 posts, read 7,063,731 times
Reputation: 9455
Quote:
Originally Posted by DCforever View Post
Environmentalist / Ecologist is a distinction without a difference, but the Clean Air we enjoy is due to the Cap and Trade policy of pricing environmental compliance into business decisions.
definiton of ecologist: a person (scientist) who studies the natural relationships between the air, land, water, animals, plants, etc.

I suppose you were ok with the concept of calling garbage men....sanitary engineers.
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Old 06-29-2016, 01:07 PM
 
Location: Southern Oregon
3,040 posts, read 5,007,387 times
Reputation: 3422
Quote:
Originally Posted by DCforever View Post
I'm not really sure what your point is but when speaking of climate change and proposed mitigation strategies, the "zealots" seem to be guided by science. There has rarely been a greater scientific consensus than exists about the dangers of anthropogenic climate change. And there has rarely been less scientific support for those who oppose mitigation strategies.
Yes, there is a huge concern about climate change in todays world, however, warming will happen, all we can do is mitigate just how fast it is going to warm. Over the last century the climate has warmed by .7C, which is pretty fast on a geologic scale. This is nowhere near the temps seen 120,000 years ago when the climate was about 5C warmer than today and this was without any human intervention. Over the last 400,000 years there have been 3 cycles of this type of warming, so the only thing new about this time is just how fast it is warming. All we can do is to control just how fast it is going to happen, however, it is still going to get a lot warmer before it gets any cooler.
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Old 06-29-2016, 01:40 PM
 
1,168 posts, read 1,229,678 times
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To put it in a business perspective it is like this.


An Ecologist is an entrepreneur who studies how the environment works, comes up with a solution to the problems that are found and implements solutions to fix it as a whole.

Environmentalists target a specific problem and looks for profit potential. They discard everything that isn’t profitable

My Ecology professor said something similar to this many decades ago. His was about the phone company but some people dont even know what that is anymore.


You have 2 cable companies.
Cable company A is a small local cable company that was constituted by the people in a county or 2 to provide cable service. They represent the people of the county. They are the Ecologists.

Cable company B is constituted by investors to provide cable service in a county or 2.
They represent the investors. They are the Environmentalists.

Cable company A offers you a all inclusive wide assortment of channels with a pay per view option for certain movies. When you want a new program they get it for you. No charge. When they need to extend their cable they go before the county commissioners and float a bond which is directly voted for by the people then paid back by the property owners in the county.
You have a problem with the service and you give them a call. The tech comes out and fixes your problem.
Its all about staying in business. (The environment)


Cable company B offers you packages which don’t exactly contain what you want. You need to buy multiple packages to get the channels you want. All movies and sports are pay per view and they are constantly negotiating with the different channels to get paid on the back end to support the channels that pay and remove the channels that you want to see making you constantly buy new packages to get the channels that you want to see. They cant really explain why they cant provide you with the channels you want in one package because the whole process is complicated and you just wouldnt understand anyway.
When they need to extend the cable, they start having brown outs saying how the infrastructure is failing and they need a bailout by the State to pay for the upgrades. It really expensive. The people get scared that they cant watch their show and vote for politicians who will fix their cable.
If you have a problem you call customer support, get put on hold for 20 minutes. The guy from India finally answers and calls you an idiot because according to his computer your connection is fine. Just push the red button.
Its all about max profit. Because they represent the investors.

Last edited by Joe33; 06-29-2016 at 01:49 PM..
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Old 06-29-2016, 01:59 PM
 
Location: DC
6,848 posts, read 8,005,837 times
Reputation: 3572
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe33 View Post
?? How do you come up with this?
I read the government reports.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe33 View Post
It is a ridiculous statement .
Maybe but it's true
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe33 View Post
You must be thinking value of products. What we produce is weapons, gasoline, and some cars. If you take inflation into account we are way, way, in the hole.
No we aren't though we produce a much greater mix of high valued items today than in the past. Low value added consumer good are where we have stop a lot of manufacturing. Think airplanes, earth moving and construction equipment, electrical generation equipment, basic infrastructure equipment, etc.
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Old 06-29-2016, 02:03 PM
 
Location: DC
6,848 posts, read 8,005,837 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 509 View Post
definiton of ecologist: a person (scientist) who studies the natural relationships between the air, land, water, animals, plants, etc.

I suppose you were ok with the concept of calling garbage men....sanitary engineers.
Again a distinction without a difference.

definition of environmentalist: a person (scientist) who studies the natural relationships between the air, land, water, animals, plants, etc. (works both ways)
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Old 06-29-2016, 02:13 PM
 
Location: DC
6,848 posts, read 8,005,837 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Terryj View Post
Yes, there is a huge concern about climate change in todays world, however, warming will happen, all we can do is mitigate just how fast it is going to warm. Over the last century the climate has warmed by .7C, which is pretty fast on a geologic scale. This is nowhere near the temps seen 120,000 years ago when the climate was about 5C warmer than today and this was without any human intervention. Over the last 400,000 years there have been 3 cycles of this type of warming, so the only thing new about this time is just how fast it is warming. All we can do is to control just how fast it is going to happen, however, it is still going to get a lot warmer before it gets any cooler.
We had fires and floods back then too. Things that occur naturally are not necessarily desirable. We try to minimize fires in occupied areas, whether natural or man made.

What we will eventually be able to control is a subject that hasn't even begun to be discussed, but I don't believe that the climatic temperature swings we have seen in the past are necessarily immutable.
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Old 06-30-2016, 07:42 PM
 
Location: Berwick, Penna.
16,216 posts, read 11,357,232 times
Reputation: 20833
It's not the reality of climate change that's subject to argument; the climate has been changing since the beginnings of recorded history, Coal deposits are found in many cold climates and considerable evidence exists that the Sahara Desert wasn't nearly so dry in Roman times, but that the dry-up preceded, and considerably, the heavy consumption of fossil fuel.
The "Little Ice Age" which paralleled the worst years of the Dark Ages, also dreaws little attention.

But the arguments for "global warming" are almost invariably linked to academics who tend to take a jaded view of the grit and sweat of life in the private, commercialized sector. And the prospect of secure, cushy employment as environmental bureaucrats, with the potential for imposing their dogma on a sector of society they have been conditioned to resent, is what has them licking their chops in anticipation.
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Old 07-01-2016, 04:24 AM
 
Location: DC
6,848 posts, read 8,005,837 times
Reputation: 3572
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2nd trick op View Post
It's not the reality of climate change that's subject to argument; the climate has been changing since the beginnings of recorded history, Coal deposits are found in many cold climates and considerable evidence exists that the Sahara Desert wasn't nearly so dry in Roman times, but that the dry-up preceded, and considerably, the heavy consumption of fossil fuel.
The "Little Ice Age" which paralleled the worst years of the Dark Ages, also dreaws little attention.

But the arguments for "global warming" are almost invariably linked to academics who tend to take a jaded view of the grit and sweat of life in the private, commercialized sector. And the prospect of secure, cushy employment as environmental bureaucrats, with the potential for imposing their dogma on a sector of society they have been conditioned to resent, is what has them licking their chops in anticipation.
LOL, the scientist of the world are out to trick us? Really? That's funny.
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Old 07-01-2016, 07:07 AM
 
1,168 posts, read 1,229,678 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DCforever View Post
LOL, the scientist of the world are out to trick us? Really? That's funny.
Its human nature. Its called greed.

If you are dumb enough to believe that the average person wont try to trick you for their own benefit, You will be in for a rude awakening.
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