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Recent threads here have me weary of repeating facts that are routinely ignored by a certain segment of the complaining public, so I thought we ought to consolidate the facts in one spot to hopefully educate the naïve.
I recently read that Americans will fill landfills 100 ft deep covering 1000 sq miles over the next century. I can't find that reference again just now, so I used this EPA site https://archive.epa.gov/epawaste/non...ipal/web/html/ that shows we've stabilized over recent yrs (as population has stabilized) with Americans producing ~250,000,000 tons of trash a year. Using the conversion factor of 1 "gate ton" = 3.3 "gate cu yds" (from another EPA site), we can calculate that yearly trash production piled 100 ft deep will fill an area around 15.5 sq mi-- or about 1550 sq mi in a century. Allowing for compaction in the landfill, that comes very close to the 1000 sq miles reported elsewhere....Given that the US comprises 19 million sq mi, landfills will only take up 0.015% of our area over the next century.
Add in the fact hat landfills are now returned to useful duty when full as natural &/or recreational areas,
Conclusion: landfills don't pose a problem of space.
Landfill construction is highly regulated to prevent escape of toxic gases and toxin laden water. Sights are lined with poorly permeable clay and impermeable membranes. Rain water percolating thru the trash is collected and disposed of properly to prevent contamination of ground water...Owners of landfills have responsibility of maintain these safety measures for 30 yrs after the site is closed.
Conclusion: Potential environmental contamination by landfills has been adequately addressed and poses no inordinate risks.
As of 2015 only 16.6% of US was arable land. The rest is mountains, forests, lakes, rivers, highways, cities and villages, and land where nothing can grow. Statistically, right now, 300M people produce 3.5 lb trash a day, per U.S. produces 1/3 of global solid waste
U.S. buries >50% of waste in landfills –98.5% is industrial solid waste –1.5%.
In just one year that's a pile 400 feet deep (as tall as a 40-story building), and covers more than 1,000 acres of land.
In 100 years, assuming that the population doubles, that's 250 sqmile, 400 ft deep. To make it visual the base of this trash pyramid would be about 4.5 miles by 4.5 miles, and the pyramid would rise almost 3 miles high.
That's a lot of trash in just 100 years.
Now with population doubling every 100 years, we will build more highways, more houses, more cities, more stores, power and manufacturing plants.
We still would need to feed them somehow, so we need arable land and land to house everyone. .
Suddenly the 0.015% of your estimate doesn't look so great anymore...
Your site does not document any numbers. They've over-estimated trash production by a factor of 100 and they seemed to have guessed at a conversion factor, according to the EPA site: https://www2.illinois.gov/epa/topics...ages/2017.aspx
Quote:
Originally Posted by elnina
As of 2015 only 16.6% of US was arable land. The rest is mountains, forests, lakes, rivers, highways, cities and villages, and land where nothing can grow. Statistically, right now, 300M people produce 3.5 lb trash a day, per U.S. produces 1/3 of global solid waste
U.S. buries >50% of waste in landfills –98.5% is industrial solid waste –1.5%.
In just one year that's a pile 400 feet deep (as tall as a 40-story building), and covers more than 1,000 acres of land.
In 100 years, assuming that the population doubles, that's 250 sqmile, 400 ft deep. To make it visual the base of this trash pyramid would be about 4.5 miles by 4.5 miles, and the pyramid would rise almost 3 miles high.
That's a lot of trash in just 100 years.
Now with population doubling every 100 years, we will build more highways, more houses, more cities, more stores, power and manufacturing plants.
We still would need to feed them somehow, so we need arable land and land to house everyone. .
Suddenly the 0.015% of your estimate doesn't look so great anymore...
One falsehood to be dispensed with immediately: population only doubles over a given period (BTW- it was 40 yrs, not 1oo) over the first half of the logistic curve-- until it reaches the inflection point (reached ~1975 for humans). After that, growth slows down until it hits the carrying capacity (est. to be ~12B) and then ceases. That's the point at which birth rate equals death rate.
Now back to volume of trash-- you've stated "250 sq mi" & 400 ft high." That's the same as 100 ft deep and 1000 sq mi (400/4 & 250 x 4)....it seems we agree. Thanks for the verification.
Now, to be honest, 0.0015% of our area devoted to landfills doesn't sound like a big deal at all, BUT- some areas like the NE have little available land and a large population, so they may have to start shipping trash west to open spaces. That will cost them some moola BUT it will be an economic opportunity for the areas accepting the trash. Over-all: Even Steven.
One thing Americans do wrong with trash is that we send too much organic matter there: 67% of the landfill bound stuff is food, paper, wood and yard waste. It would make sense to compost that stuff and not bury it. Another possibility is "landfill mining." This would be easier and less costly if the organic matter were not present in the landfill. http://web.mit.edu/12.000/www/m2016/.../landfill.html
Your site does not document any numbers. They've over-estimated trash production by a factor of 100 and they seemed to have guessed at a conversion factor, according to the EPA site: https://www2.illinois.gov/epa/topics...ages/2017.aspx
One falsehood to be dispensed with immediately: population only doubles over a given period (BTW- it was 40 yrs, not 1oo) over the first half of the logistic curve-- until it reaches the inflection point (reached ~1975 for humans). After that, growth slows down until it hits the carrying capacity (est. to be ~12B) and then ceases. That's the point at which birth rate equals death rate.
Now back to volume of trash-- you've stated "250 sq mi" & 400 ft high." That's the same as 100 ft deep and 1000 sq mi (400/4 & 250 x 4)....it seems we agree. Thanks for the verification.
Now, to be honest, 0.0015% of our area devoted to landfills doesn't sound like a big deal at all, BUT- some areas like the NE have little available land and a large population, so they may have to start shipping trash west to open spaces. That will cost them some moola BUT it will be an economic opportunity for the areas accepting the trash. Over-all: Even Steven.
One thing Americans do wrong with trash is that we send too much organic matter there: 67% of the landfill bound stuff is food, paper, wood and yard waste. It would make sense to compost that stuff and not bury it.
Another possibility is "landfill mining." This would be easier and less costly if the organic matter were not present in the landfill. Mining Landfills
I would argue against this. If you take the organic matter out of the landfill GOOD methane production goes to nill. No good methane and people like us stop putting electric generators on landfills ......
there were a number of of old dumps back in the woods around the area where i grew up. we would dig in them and find antique milk bottles, colored glass items, even some plates and things. We took them to the local antique store and used the money to buy bubble gum and comic books (which did not end up in landfills because we burned our trash back then).
I would argue against this. If you take the organic matter out of the landfill GOOD methane production goes to nill. No good methane and people like us stop putting electric generators on landfills ......
If we compost it, we lose methane production, but gain the re-cycling of some of the minerals that are being depleted from our soils.
How much does the methane capture contribute to our energy production? Couldn't methane capture be accomplished in the composting facilities?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Coldjensens
I used to do landfill mining.
there were a number of of old dumps back in the woods around the area where i grew up. we would dig in them and find antique milk bottles, colored glass items, even some plates and things. We took them to the local antique store and used the money to buy bubble gum and comic books (which did not end up in landfills because we burned our trash back then).
Yea, another industry lost, like whale bone corset factories. How do kids earn a living nowadays, what with the child labor laws and no bottle deposits or paper routes?
Yea, another industry lost, like whale bone corset factories. How do kids earn a living nowadays, what with the child labor laws and no bottle deposits or paper routes?
Well, in addition to the antiques and bottle returns we used to buy and resell illegal fireworks, and make and sell flavored toothpicks. Some of my friend shoplifted pornographic magazines and sold them to other kids at a huge price. Also designer bluejeans. It is good that some of those funding sources went away.
Now they still find clever ways to bring in a little cash.
One of my sons bought outdated computers in bulk (lots of 3-5 of them) and upgraded them and then resold them. He made as much as $120 on an upgrade, so it kept him well stocked with comic books (actually more so computer games, pocket knives and bb guns). One computer he bought for about $250 turned out to have a $12,000 graphics program on it. He re-sold it for $800 after adding a few upgrades. Beats the snot out of a paper route.
Once he got his license he delivered pizza (illegally - you are supposed to be 18) and drove people around for money - sort of an early, informal, Uber.
The other son, played the trumpet for events at a Yacht club and VFW events, a wedding and some Church Easter or Christmas services. It was not often enough to amount to much, but likely equaled a paper route.
Sometimes they could build up game money or high level characters in certain games and then sell them to other people for real world money. One of them was always trying to win money in rocket league tournaments (some kind of online game of car soccer), I am not sure whether he actually ever won money.
I think some kids did pay him to be on their team though or at least gave him food or rides etc in echange for being on their team so they could win.
Daughters did babysitting, pet care and dog walking.
There are still things they can do for a little spending cash even if all the fast food jobs are now taken by older people and the other sources of funds have dried up.
One thing Americans do wrong with trash is that we send too much organic matter there: 67% of the landfill bound stuff is food, paper, wood and yard waste. It would make sense to compost that stuff and not bury it.
Another possibility is "landfill mining." This would be easier and less costly if the organic matter were not present in the landfill. Mining Landfills
Practically speaking, what is a landfill if not a very large compost heap with some stuff that can't break down?
I'm not disagreeing that we should both as individuals and as a society strive to reduce our garbage outputs.
But like OP, I see the landfill as a sort of "Worst solution except for all the others."
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Another possibility is "landfill mining." This would be easier and less costly if the organic matter were not present in the landfill. 
Yea, another industry lost, like whale bone corset factories. How do kids earn a living nowadays, what with the child labor laws and no bottle deposits or paper routes?
