Watch out California (heating, heat pump, climate, greenhouse)
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This retired NEBRASKA resident may be able to make LOCALLY grown Citrus available to a large percentage of the market currently going to CALIFORNIA growers.
California is and has been the LARGEST producer of much of the AG production in the USA. However WATER and unfair regulatory concerns are having a crippling effect on the producers in California. IF the ideas of this ALLIANCE, NEBRASKA retiree prove to be workable, in a few years MUCH of the Citrus market currently being supplied by warmer states like CA, TX and FL might be grown in COLDER states.
I love being able to have an Orange in December and I appreciate the part growers in warmer climates have had in making it possible for MILLIONS of us to enjoy this. BUT that may not be the ONLY option in the future.
That's actually pretty impressive, never considered utilizing geothermal with just a fan but they only need to raise the temp to growing temperatures. Interesting to say the least.
Last edited by thecoalman; 12-18-2019 at 03:43 AM..
Over time, those drain tile will develop molds and funk. Moisture in hot summer air in particular will condense out on the cold walls and trap pollens and dust. Unless he has a way to periodically clean them and kill off molds, he will have an unhealthy situation.
Also, looping with both input and output in the greenhouse would seem more efficient.
Over time, those drain tile will develop molds and funk. Moisture in hot summer air in particular will condense out on the cold walls and trap pollens and dust. Unless he has a way to periodically clean them and kill off molds, he will have an unhealthy situation.
Also, looping with both input and output in the greenhouse would seem more efficient.
Interesting update to an old idea.
harry what is the old idea you refer to? Yes Greenhouses have been around forever but using this type of heating/cooling is NOVEL I believe.
Pollens and dust should not be much of a problem. Dew points at low humidity would mean less condensation. FILTERING recirculated air should be doable. This Nebraska guy has been doing this for close to 25 years and I am sure he has worked out many of the problems. I would like to see a few of the AG universities in the Northern sates like Nebraska, Kansas, etc do research on this. It will take a few years.
Look in the old (1930s) Popular Mechanics issues online at Google books and you will see plans for a greenhouse that is sunken into the ground on the south side of a home to take advantage of the ground temps and thermal mass of the home. Do a search on Earthships and the greenhouse area of them takes advantage of the cavelike living space and thermal bank.
Thermal flywheel effects were studied in the 1970s (+-?) IIRC, a project was done in TN (Knoxville?) where giant vats of mud in a basement setting were used for thermal mass to heat and cool. The old Eastwood Mall in B'ham was primarily kept heated and cooled by convenient artesian wells. The place was huge.
What the fellow has built looks reasonable, and the protection his citrus has against greening and canker is an added plus. As you say, he undoubtedly has worked out many of the kinks.
What I noted was that the piping was 8 feet down. I don't know if you have ever used a backhoe, but that is at the extreme range of most of the buckets, and not possible in some soils. I did well to get 4' down in Alabama chert, and had to use mattock and pick-axe in some places. The depth of 8' is needed to get below frost line, which can reach 4' to 6' in Vermont. Those can be dangerous ditches until they are backfilled.
What was not covered in the video is that as the system is used, the intake area will transfer out all of the available heat and the soil become colder as the winter progresses. The 75' + pipes are a hedge against it all becoming too cold to be effective. The freeze front would slowly progress down the tubing in use. The reverse happens in summer.
I would be tempted to run a loop. During summer, airflow would go one way, first hitting the "hot" end and heating the soil before getting to the cold end where the AC effect would kick in. During the winter, I would reverse the flow, continuing to build coolth at the cool end, while extracting excess summer heat from the hot end. However, he may need the excess cold built up over winter to make the system work on the hottest summer days. Dunno.
The chicken houses around here use deep wells to provide cool water for summer cooling. Heating is not as much an issue in this climate and the birds themselves provide quite a bit of heat.
"1930
The first commercial greenhouse use of geothermal energy is undertaken in Boise, Idaho. The operation uses a 1000-foot well drilled in 1926. In Klamath Falls, Charlie Lieb develops the first downhole heat exchanger (DHE) to heat his house. Today, more than 500 DHEs are in use around the country."
Over time, those drain tile will develop molds and funk. Moisture in hot summer air in particular will condense out on the cold walls and trap pollens and dust. Unless he has a way to periodically clean them and kill off molds, he will have an unhealthy situation.
Isn't this an issue any greenhouse would have? I used to deliver coal to a greenhouse, they used it for evergreens that would then be used in Spring planting. It was always humid inside.
Quote:
Also, looping with both input and output in the greenhouse would seem more efficient.
Care to elaborate? I would presume he has the the fan centrally located and the duct outlets on either side of the greenhouse which is what would make sense to me.
The first commercial greenhouse use of geothermal energy is undertaken in Boise, Idaho. The operation uses a 1000-foot well drilled in 1926. In Klamath Falls, Charlie Lieb develops the first downhole heat exchanger (DHE) to heat his house. Today, more than 500 DHEs are in use around the country."
This requires a lot of energy, you have to pump water and if you were using it with heat pump you need to run the heat pump and/or you need some type heat exchanger. The system this guy has is almost passive, it doesn't require a whole of energy to run a fan. This wouldn't work for living conditions but certainly applicable to agriculture.
" This wouldn't work for living conditions but certainly applicable to agriculture."
You've never met my brother. 50 degrees in his house midwinter is a heatwave.
Bluntly, I don't trust the energy cost estimate. With a 7 amp draw and a cold overcast winter where it would need to run almost continuously, I get a cost closer to $70/mo. Still low, but more realistic. Greenhouses are miserable to heat to temps that approach Florida temps. I know firsthand and have the dead bromeliads and bananas to prove it.
Note that his low temp kicks it on at 50F. That means actual temps are likely closer to freezing. Orange trees and most citrus can handle that, while other subtropicals can't.
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50 degrees in his house midwinter is a heatwave.
