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China has the edge on us when it comes to high-speed rail that runs on electricity. They have 26,000 miles of it and we have zero. They don`t need a lecture from us.
How much of that electricity is generated from renewables, how much from coal?
In many aspects they are much advanced than the US.
The poll is a joke.
China has also launched major efforts on improving its climate adaption and resilience, including a national strategy increasing protections of wetlands and animal species, and growing the proportion of grasslands and forested areas. The government has invested heavily in electric vehicles.
China is recognized as the undisputable global leader in renewable energy expansion, adding new projects to the grid almost as fast as the rest of the world combined in 2022.
China is building renewables at such a staggering rate [that] it is said to outperform the targets they have set themselves.
The country spent $546 billion in 2022 on investments that included solar and wind energy, electric vehicles and batteries. That is nearly four times the amount of U.S. investments, which totaled $141 billion.
The European Union was second to China with $180 billion in clean energy investments.
How much of that electricity is generated from renewables, how much from coal?
We`ve had an 80 year head start on China but they do have the world`s largest hydroelectric plant. By the year 2035, China will no longer produce or sell internal combustion powered vehicles. https://www.usgs.gov/special-topics/...electric-plant
No, China should not be held to the same standards as the US. They match the US on emissions now, but for total emissions since industrialization, the US has produced magnitudes more. China didn't get us to 400 or whatever ppm CO2. We have to account and make up for that past emissions being part of our current wealth / infrastructure.
And they are still a developing country. The impetus is on the developed countries, who aren't still trying to eliminate poverty on mass scales to curtail their use.
Nonsense. If climate change is the massive threat some claim it is, then the largest polluter on the planet shouldn't get a pass.
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Originally Posted by Phil P
China has such a heavy focus on renewable production because they don't have the options the US does. They don't have the fossil fuel potential we do, and face an existential threat to existence if their suppliers cut off the tap. They know energy dependence is a problem, as is the smog, and they are taking efforts to get rid of both.
China has the fourth largest coal reserves in the world. They also consume over 50% of all the coal used worldwide. They are also adding coal fired generation much faster than renewables. If they were at all concerned about the environment, they would build gas fired power stations, and buy gas from the Russians, but they're not. So they keep building coal plants on a massive scale, while the propaganda ministry spews out stories about "green" energy.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil P
China can be understood fairly well knowing that foreign powers have essentially raped the country over multiple times in the 19th and 20th century, and they are determined not to have that happen again. That's never happened to the US. Yet somehow we whine and complain from our perch of priviledge that we should cut some of our excess.
China has the edge on us when it comes to high-speed rail that runs on electricity. They have 26,000 miles of it and we have zero. They don`t need a lecture from us.
Good for them. If high speed rail made economic sense, we would have it, but it doesn't. In fact, it doesn't make economic sense in China either, as China Rail now has debt of almost $900 billion US dollars. https://www.eurasiantimes.com/a-whop...peed-railways/
Quote:
Originally Posted by jbgusa
How much of that electricity is generated from renewables, how much from coal?
Given the fact that China has started construction on 50GW of coal fired generation in the past year, and has approved another 106GW to be built, I'd bet on coal. https://www.reuters.com/world/asia-p...ch-2023-02-27/
Good for them. If high speed rail made economic sense, we would have it, but it doesn't. In fact, it doesn't make economic sense in China either, as China Rail now has debt of almost $900 billion US dollars. https://www.eurasiantimes.com/a-whop...peed-railways/
Given the fact that China has started construction on 50GW of coal fired generation in the past year, and has approved another 106GW to be built, I'd bet on coal. https://www.reuters.com/world/asia-p...ch-2023-02-27/
Do you think that our highways are paid for by the paltry gas tax we pay at the pump? It doesn`t come close. What would it cost China to build a few million miles of 4 or 6 lane highways?
Nonsense. If climate change is the massive threat some claim it is, then the largest polluter on the planet shouldn't get a pass.
China has the fourth largest coal reserves in the world. They also consume over 50% of all the coal used worldwide. They are also adding coal fired generation much faster than renewables. If they were at all concerned about the environment, they would build gas fired power stations, and buy gas from the Russians, but they're not. So they keep building coal plants on a massive scale, while the propaganda ministry spews out stories about "green" energy.
Huh?
Which is half the CO2 per person still... The point is who put all the historical CO2 in the atmosphere? Not china - while they have a lot now, it's the developed that put the bulk of the historical CO2 up there. As other's have stated, China has it's own security and viability at stake with energy independence so they have their own motives to get off oil - regardless of the environmental aspects.
Do you think that our highways are paid for by the paltry gas tax we pay at the pump? It doesn`t come close. What would it cost China to build a few million miles of 4 or 6 lane highways?
Paltry? Granted the federal fuel tax isn't much, but my state is almost 50 cents. And I have no idea what it cost China, but it's much less than us because they have no environmental rules like we have an private property to buy.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil P
Which is half the CO2 per person still... The point is who put all the historical CO2 in the atmosphere? Not china - while they have a lot now, it's the developed that put the bulk of the historical CO2 up there. As other's have stated, China has it's own security and viability at stake with energy independence so they have their own motives to get off oil - regardless of the environmental aspects.
Once again, if this was that important, the Chinese would be cutting their emissons, but they're not. They are doing what's best for China, not the world.
Paltry? Granted the federal fuel tax isn't much, but my state is almost 50 cents. And I have no idea what it cost China, but it's much less than us because they have no environmental rules like we have an private property to buy.
Once again, if this was that important, the Chinese would be cutting their emissons, but they're not. They are doing what's best for China, not the world.
The dictators of communist China are infamous for doing what is best for themselves and not the country. China's current leader - President Xi Jinping - is no exception to that rule and as a result, China has been suffering from one major climate disaster after another. Who cares? Not Xi Jinping. His bank account continues to grow and there can be no upwelling of voter resentment that gets him kicked out of office.
Even in the United States voters continue to be apathetic about addressing the climate crisis. This is not because climate change is not that important, its because the fossil fuel industry seems to have won the current round if not the entire game. Currently, everyone is patting themselves on the back for declaring climate change to be a "hoax" and saving the nations of the world from some shadowy conspiracy to empower one to rule all.
The generations to come will curse the generation of today for being tragically mistaken about what is "that important"
If China produced as much CO2 per person as the USA, we'd be even further up ---- creek than we already are.
The question is: should the West be held to China's standards on per capita emissions?
The answer is that it wouldn't help, anyway. AGW is here. We didn't build the nuke plants that we needed to and now it's too late. The only solution is Geoengineering. We need to shift away from 50 years of failed policy on conservation and minimization of GHG emissions and direct our efforts into controlling the climate directly.
We need to start building the systems to reduce incident sunlight through solar shade spacecraft and increasing albedo by stratospheric aerosol dispersion.
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