Energy policy solution for Left, Right, Greenies, Libertarians, and Centrists-- But who will agree to compromise???

[rlchurch]

Originally Posted by thecoalman

The Polk plant in Florida is apparently capable at least according to the engineer on the Frontline piece "Heat" . Chapter 4 around the 8:50 mark, untested because of liability issues.

FRONTLINE: heat: watch the full program | PBS

Just tell me who has a CCS process which will provide normal commercial guarantees for use cleaning up the stack gas of a coal-fired power plant.

BTW I did watch that segment and there are huge holes in the "analysis". The first is that the Kansas project is not an IGCC it's a powdered-coal plant -- the technologies are totally different. The second is that the CO2 that an IGCC can capture is that which comes off the gasifier. There's another major stream that comes from combustion of the syngas (a mixture of H2 and CO), which was left out in the sales pitch and the reporter was too ignorant to ask about. The third and final was the "liability issue." All the company wants is a "get out of jail for free card" so any damage or deaths cause by the injection of CO2 in the ground is picked up by the state. I hope we have learned our lesson about privatizing profits and socializing losses. The legal issues of injecting CO2 into underground structures are huge.

But I'm all for it. As soon as a company can capture the CO2, build more coal fired plants. Until then, we have viable cost effective renewable technologies that work, have commercial guarantees, and are affordable.

[vec101]

Some effects of Cap and trade in Europe:

Kollo Holding's ....
But Europe's emissions program has driven electricity prices so high that the facility routinely shuts down for part of the day to save money on power, which, contrary to environmental goals, reduces energy efficiency.
Although demand for its products is strong, the plant has laid off 40 of its 130 employees and trimmed production.
Two customers have turned to cheaper imports from China, which is not covered by Europe's costly regulations.
EUROPE'S "CAP AND TRADE" PROBLEMS

French cement workers fear they're going to lose jobs to Morocco, which doesn't have to meet the European guidelines; and German homeowners pay 25 percent more for electricity than they did before the caps.
EUROPE'S "CAP AND TRADE" PROBLEMS

[vec101]

Some additional Cap and Trade concerns.....

Next Bernie Madoff? Emissions Cap-and-Trade Aids the Corrupt, Hurts the Little Guy

The cap-and-trade system being touted on Capitol Hill would create a multibillion-dollar playground that would, once again, create a group of wealthy traders benefiting at the expense of millions of average families—middle to low-income households that would end up paying more for food, energy, and almost everything else they buy.
Next Bernie Madoff? Emissions Cap-and-Trade Aids the Corrupt, Hurts the Little Guy - US News and World Report

LOL, if Enron thought it was a good idea and "lusted for it" we should definately run the other way

Enron executives—before their well-deserved fall—did little to conceal their lust for cap-and-trade. In 2002, the Washington Post reported that "an internal Enron memo said the Kyoto agreement, if implemented, would do more to promote Enron's business than almost any other regulatory initiative outside of restructuring the energy and natural gas industries in Europe and the United States." Next Bernie Madoff? Emissions Cap-and-Trade Aids the Corrupt, Hurts the Little Guy - US News and World Report