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Nobody can't just go in for free and post a complete project description.
Actually you are incorrect. Anyone can sign up to the site for free and anyone can submit information.
Whether they post it is another question.
Seeing that this is Roy Carroll who has a track record, and that there was news about it - I wouldn't be surprised that they would publish it if the submitter included the news links.
For what it is worth, I sent them an email asking if it was possible that they could let me know what was the source of this project. For all I know they won't respond, but I thought it was worth an ask.
I repeat that I doubt this is Carroll's project (and thus probably shouldn't have been used to bump up this thread) as I can't see something that is listed with a $5-$25m value being a 561 ft tower.
Actually you are incorrect. Anyone can sign up to the site for free and anyone can submit information.
Whether they post it is another question.
Seeing that this is Roy Carroll who has a track record, and that there was news about it - I wouldn't be surprised that they would publish it if the submitter included the news links.
For what it is worth, I sent them an email asking if it was possible that they could let me know what was the source of this project. For all I know they won't respond, but I thought it was worth an ask.
I repeat that I doubt this is Carroll's project (and thus probably shouldn't have been used to bump up this thread) as I can't see something that is listed with a $5-$25m value being a 561 ft tower.
I'm pretty sure it is Carroll's project, I just think the $5 to $25 million is not an accurate range that is set in stone. There have been no official plans drawn up at least that we know of and its hard to put an accurate value on the project. I'm also sure the public doesn't know everything. Developers don't tend to reveal all of their plans until they are ready to move forward. It may be that Construction Wire got the information from the media just because of the timing of the news story and the timing of the Construction Wire post. I doubt it would be anything else because there is no other project I can think of that includes both office and a hotel. Any such project would have at least been published in the Triad Business Journal. Also I want to stress that while its likely Carroll will move forward, its still early and plans evolve. That's what happened with Bellemeade Village. At first Roy Carroll wanted to build just an 8-story hotel. That plan grew in scope to include 300 luxury apartments and retail. He'll build some kind of tower, what it will look like and its exact height may not be set in stone but once he publically announces plans for a project he follows through. That's his track record. The only thing that could halt this project is not securing enough tenants or something unexpected like a downturn in the economy. Apparently there is enough interest for him to at least announce he plans to build a 561 ft tower. Nobody is going to plan to build such a tower if there is no kind of demand for it. 561 ft seems pretty big but remember all of it would not be office space. At least 6-stories would be for parking and another 5 to 8 stories would likely be hotel space. That takes up about 14-stories right there. So in terms of office space you are looking at about 14-stories in a 28-story tower. If you were to put that office space in its own building it would be shorter than the four tallest buildings downtown. That's not a tall order for downtown (no pun intended) and its certainly feasible. Roy Carroll is a smart guy and he is also realistic about what he can build. Keep in mind that both the idea of a developer turning the old Wachovia Building into a high-rise condo tower and building a massive 300 luxury apartment complex and hotel would have been laughed at 10 years ago and both have come to fruition. 10 years ago I honestly didn't believe we would be seeing the construction of a downtown 3,000 seat performing arts center any time soon. Greensboro is at a point in time where its now feasible for developers to pursue larger scale urban projects. Greensboro is a city of almost 300,000 people and the demographics are changing. Higher paying jobs are beginning to come to the city.
The only thing that could halt this project not securing enough tenants or something unexpected like a downturn in the economy.
Two things to remind yourself
1. You can't halt a project that hasn't launched. Once again the developer himself has stressed that this is only in the idea stage right now. There is no project yet.
2. Mr. Carroll himself provided a reason in the original presentation of his idea to the rotary club of why this idea may never move beyond the idea stage: "Carroll said that even if he finds tenants, he’ll need to charge a higher rental rate to make the project feasible. He said office rents downtown are closer to $20 a square foot, and he would like them to rise to the high $20s or low $30s."
I suspect that you include me in the "naysayers" label that you mention often, but I'm not. I want to see this happen. I do.
Greensboro is long overdue an addition to its skyline, but there is nothing definite about this project until it is announced by the developer as something that has moved to the actual project stage.
I will make one promise though. If and when that does happen - I will be right there with you applauding!
The only thing that could halt this project is not securing enough tenants or something unexpected like a downturn in the economy...So in terms of office space you are looking at about 14-stories in a 28-story tower...That's not a tall order for downtown (no pun intended) and its certainly feasible...Keep in mind that both the idea of a developer turning the old Wachovia Building into a high-rise condo tower and building a massive 300 luxury apartment complex and hotel would have been laughed at 10 years ago and both have come to fruition...Greensboro is a city of almost 300,000 people and the demographics are changing. Higher paying jobs are beginning to come to the city.
I really have to disagree with almost all of this. Assuming a 20,000 sf floorplate, 14 stories is 280,000 sf of office space. He'll likely have to prelease half of that (in addition to signing up a hotel with several other hotels already under construction or planned). 140,000 sf of space is a HUGE amount in downtown G'boro, especially at the rental rates he's talking about. And the real problem is that its highly unlikely a new company is going to sign on as an anchor tenant, because they won't have the luxury of waiting around for the tower to be built. So, his only chance is to poach several large tenants from existing space downtown, which will leave other buildings with huge vacancies that will be very difficult to backfill.
Very few people (and no one who actually knew anything about real estate) were laughing at the conversion of the Wachovia Building. Winston-Salem had already done a similar project with the BB&T building, and other projects like it were happening in many other cities. But there is absolutely no connection between that project and whats proposed, other than the same developer.
And what higher paying jobs are coming to the city? Greensboro economic development efforts have been almost non-existent for the past several years, while Charlotte and Raleigh have been going gangbusters.
I hope it happens too, but there are many obstacles in the way.
1. You can't halt a project that hasn't launched. Once again the developer himself has stressed that this is only in the idea stage right now. There is no project yet.
2. Mr. Carroll himself provided a reason in the original presentation of his idea to the rotary club of why this idea may never move beyond the idea stage: "Carroll said that even if he finds tenants, he’ll need to charge a higher rental rate to make the project feasible. He said office rents downtown are closer to $20 a square foot, and he would like them to rise to the high $20s or low $30s."
I suspect that you include me in the "naysayers" label that you mention often, but I'm not. I want to see this happen. I do.
Greensboro is long overdue an addition to its skyline, but there is nothing definite about this project until it is announced by the developer as something that has moved to the actual project stage.
I will make one promise though. If and when that does happen - I will be right there with you applauding!
uhhhh technically its has already been launched. Just because there are no blueprints or plans, doesn't mean its not a project.
I really have to disagree with almost all of this. Assuming a 20,000 sf floorplate, 14 stories is 280,000 sf of office space. He'll likely have to prelease half of that (in addition to signing up a hotel with several other hotels already under construction or planned). 140,000 sf of space is a HUGE amount in downtown G'boro, especially at the rental rates he's talking about. And the real problem is that its highly unlikely a new company is going to sign on as an anchor tenant, because they won't have the luxury of waiting around for the tower to be built. So, his only chance is to poach several large tenants from existing space downtown, which will leave other buildings with huge vacancies that will be very difficult to backfill.
Very few people (and no one who actually knew anything about real estate) were laughing at the conversion of the Wachovia Building. Winston-Salem had already done a similar project with the BB&T building, and other projects like it were happening in many other cities. But there is absolutely no connection between that project and whats proposed, other than the same developer.
And what higher paying jobs are coming to the city? Greensboro economic development efforts have been almost non-existent for the past several years, while Charlotte and Raleigh have been going gangbusters.
I hope it happens too, but there are many obstacles in the way.
How do you know Carroll is not talking with a potential big tenant? You don't plan a tower and then hope for tenants to move in. The article clearly stated that he is in discussion with some groups that would occupy this tower. They must be serious enough for him to even consider this proposal. Yes rental rates would be a little steeper than the rest of downtown but so what. There are companies out there that would pay it. Greensboro is not a tiny little textile town any more. rates are even higher in Charlotte and Raleigh.
uhhhh technically its has already been launched. Just because there are no blueprints or plans, doesn't mean its not a project.
Announcing a proposal is far from "launched". It's simply a dream right now, and when it's actually launched it will have something much more substantial than hot air behind it.
Nobody is against this happening - it would be great for the city. But you should really face reality here.
Announcing a proposal is far from "launched". It's simply a dream right now, and when it's actually launched it will have something much more substantial than hot air behind it.
Nobody is against this happening - it would be great for the city. But you should really face reality here.
The reality is that its getting built in one form or another This is Roy Carroll he gets what he wants.
It is a project...its called Project 561 That fact that he is in discussions with companies in occupying technically makes it an active project.
How do you know Carroll is not talking with a potential big tenant? You don't plan a tower and then hope for tenants to move in. The article clearly stated that he is in discussion with some groups that would occupy this tower. They must be serious enough for him to even consider this proposal. Yes rental rates would be a little steeper than the rest of downtown but so what. There are companies out there that would pay it. Greensboro is not a tiny little textile town any more. rates are even higher in Charlotte and Raleigh.
I didn't say he isn't talking to a potential big tenant. Of course he is...but that doesn't mean said prospect will sign a lease. But chances are, those big tenants are e siting companies already in downtown G'boro, which would result in no net gain in jobs. Reshuffling existing tenants doesn't do much, if anything, for the local economy.
And a 50% difference in rental rates isn't "a little steeper", it's MUCH higher than the current market. That's probably the biggest obstacle for this proposed building.
And yes, rental rates are higher in Charlotte and Raleigh...that's the point. So are wages, employment, job growth, etc.
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