A few specific questions on schools (Greenville, Wade Hampton: how much, neighborhoods, high schools)

[joer97]

If any has experience with Greenville schools, I would love to hear your thoughts on the following questions.

- Riverside seems to have higher test scores (ACT/EoCT/SAT) than Wade Hampton, Eastside and JL Mann. But those schools have far more students enrolled in AP courses (and passing AP tests). Wade Hampton has 96% of students in AP courses (according to the report card)! JL Mann has 62% and Riverside "only" has 34%. Is that right?

- I have seen some bad comments on this board about Wade Hampton. ("my kids went to wade hampton. lots of violence and drugs."Ditto on Wade Hampton HS. There are wonderful students there but there is a strong element of "thug life" there."). Do you agree?

Thanks

[greenvillebuckeye]

Originally Posted by joer97

If any has experience with Greenville schools, I would love to hear your thoughts on the following questions.

- Riverside seems to have higher test scores (ACT/EoCT/SAT) than Wade Hampton, Eastside and JL Mann. But those schools have far more students enrolled in AP courses (and passing AP tests). Wade Hampton has 96% of students in AP courses (according to the report card)! JL Mann has 62% and Riverside "only" has 34%. Is that right?

- I have seen some bad comments on this board about Wade Hampton. ("my kids went to wade hampton. lots of violence and drugs."Ditto on Wade Hampton HS. There are wonderful students there but there is a strong element of "thug life" there."). Do you agree?

Thanks

WHHS might enroll 96% of their kids in AP/IB classes BUT if you look at their pass rate it's below 50%. They're AP/IB enrollment went up 15% from the previous year BUT their pass rate stayed the same. Long story short, WHHS (and believe me they are not the only offender, JL Mann is guilty of this as well) have placed kids in AP / IB courses that have NO business being in them for 2 reasons 1.) It makes the school look better in the eyes of US News and their rankings BS and 2.) AP courses do not cost the students / families a dime. The district / state foots the bill through grant money.

Compared with Mauldin who has less than 50% of their student body in AP courses and of that group 75% pass AP tests. That's because Mauldin isn't shoving kids into AP classes who shouldn't be in there.


Each school has a "negative" element I'll call it. WHHS is no different than any other school. Plus parents will turn one incident in four years into a blanket statement about the school.


Riverside is a fine school. If only 30% of the school is enrolled in AP classes and 70% of those enrolled are passing their AP tests that's a good thing right?

[joer97]

Thanks GVB. Do you know that WHHS is doing this to pump up their ratings? Or just surmising that's probably why?

It's true that because Riverside has a more select group taking APs, more of them pass. But if you look at the % of the total class passing, Wade Hampton still does better. From the report cards, multiplying the % taking APs with the % "successful" at APs (I think this is the right thing to do), I get:

Wade Hampton: 96% taking, 50% successful, 48% of total class takes and passes AP tests
JL Mann: 83%, 51%, 42%
Eastside: 62%, 62%, 39%
Mauldin: 46%, 74%, 34%
Riverside: 34%, 71%, 24%

So Wade Hampton has twice as many students passing AP tests as Riverside. Of course, they also have 48% of their class failing APs (must be a bad experience for those kids), vs. Riverside which has 10% of their class failing APs.

Regarding the "negative element", it's true every school will have one, but some have more than others It sounds like you don't see a significant difference on this front between the schools?

The only data I have is from the scorecards:
- Expulsions due to violence: WHHS 0.9% of students expelled (ranking 92nd in SC); Riverside 0.2% of students expelled (ranking 44th in SC)
- Poverty: WHHS 47% of students "poor", ranking 25th richest school in SC ; Riverside 29%, ranking 7th richest school in SC

The expulsion rate could also depend heavily on school policies (turning a blind eye to bad behaviour vs. cracking down on marginal incidents). The poverty rate in a school is only weakly correlated to bad behaviour. So no really good data on this.

[greenvillebuckeye]

Originally Posted by joer97

Thanks GVB. Do you know that WHHS is doing this to pump up their ratings? Or just surmising that's probably why?

It's true that because Riverside has a more select group taking APs, more of them pass. But if you look at the % of the total class passing, Wade Hampton still does better. From the report cards, multiplying the % taking APs with the % "successful" at APs (I think this is the right thing to do), I get:

Wade Hampton: 96% taking, 50% successful, 48% of total class takes and passes AP tests
JL Mann: 83%, 51%, 42%
Eastside: 62%, 62%, 39%
Mauldin: 46%, 74%, 34%
Riverside: 34%, 71%, 24%

So Wade Hampton has twice as many students passing AP tests as Riverside. Of course, they also have 48% of their class failing APs (must be a bad experience for those kids), vs. Riverside which has 10% of their class failing APs.

Regarding the "negative element", it's true every school will have one, but some have more than others It sounds like you don't see a significant difference on this front between the schools?

The only data I have is from the scorecards:
- Expulsions due to violence: WHHS 0.9% of students expelled (ranking 92nd in SC); Riverside 0.2% of students expelled (ranking 44th in SC)
- Poverty: WHHS 47% of students "poor", ranking 25th richest school in SC ; Riverside 29%, ranking 7th richest school in SC

The expulsion rate could also depend heavily on school policies (turning a blind eye to bad behaviour vs. cracking down on marginal incidents). The poverty rate in a school is only weakly correlated to bad behaviour. So no really good data on this.

Part surmising, part word of mouth from relationships with those in the district (and again it's not just WHHS). But again if someone else is footing the bill then why not right?

I don't see much difference as far as the negative element goes for WHHS, EHS, JLM and RIV. Although negative element can include everything from fighting to drug use / possession on campus, to weapons possession, etc..... Not sure how much fighting occurs at Riverside, nor weapons possession but increasingly America's suburbs and subdivisions are becoming infested with illegal narcotics. Riverside is essentially a community of subdivisions, not to impede them all or even any but just saying for the sake of saying. All 4 have been known to keep their respective noses fairly clean I'd say....at least far as negative media attention.

Expulsion takes a lot of work from the student side haha, as well from the admin side. First the incident has to be pretty bad to warrant expulsion even be brought up and there is a review / hearing type process one must go through. Riverside sitting at a fifth of a percent has gotta be one of the lowest in the state I would imagine.

[WhitewaterVol]

Those are all good schools. If I was looking to move within the Greenville County School system area, I'd look at Riverside, Mauldin, Eastside, and Wade Hampton. I can't think of a logical situation where 96% of students should be in AP courses unless you are in a selective school like the governor's school. My daughter's high school had a far lower AP enrollment but I would still rank her school (Powdersville) as one of the best in the area. They aim for a very high pass rate on the AP and only enroll capable students in those classes.

I don't think expelling students is necessarily a bad thing. If schools expelled more of the problem students, it would improve overall discipline and improve the environment for students that actually want to learn. Part of the current discipline problem in a lot of schools is students know their is little consequence for their actions.

[joer97]

WhitwaterVol:

Did you purposefully leave JL Mann out of that list of High Schools?

[WhitewaterVol]

Originally Posted by joer97

WhitwaterVol:

Did you purposefully leave JL Mann out of that list of High Schools?

Not purposefully but there aren't a lot of neighborhoods in that attendance zone that would suit my needs.

[joer97]

Thanks WhitewaterVol