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I get your point, but I think it circles back to mine as well. Greenville has plenty for YP's, you just have to broaden your search. No need for you to go all the way to Travelers Rest. You can do Greenville city and the immediate area, you just have to stop zeroing in on downtown.
You also have to realize downtown's prices are not unique, nor is downtown targeted at YP's, nor is Greenville a huge YP hub in general. But overall, the city and region are in good standing for what the wages are. Your money is going to go a good ways with a COL index of 94.
Right, again going back to my main point that outside of downtown, there really is not much to offer. On the other hand, you can live in a place like TR or like Greer where they can offer a bit of a neighborhood, village, feel with some nightlife.
I get your point, but I think it circles back to mine as well. Greenville has plenty for YP's, you just have to broaden your search. No need for you to go all the way to Travelers Rest. You can do Greenville city and the immediate area, you just have to stop zeroing in on downtown.
You also have to realize downtown's prices are not unique, nor is downtown targeted at YP's, nor is Greenville a huge YP hub in general. But overall, the city and region are in good standing for what the wages are. Your money is going to go a good ways with a COL index of 94.
What would you consider to be plenty for YPs outside of downtown?
as somebody who lived most of my 20s and 30s in Greenville, most 'young professionals' that I know who rented, rented in the Woodruff Road area, Pelham Road area around Thornblade golf course, and Fairview road area in Simpsonville. They bough houses in Simpsonville, Five Forks, Pelham Road, Pebble Creek, Half Mile Lake areas. many of the better companies in the metro are out close to 85 so doesn't make much sense to live close to downtown.
there has been a ton of new 'luxury' apartments built the past 15 years or so outside of downtown and there must be a lot of 'young professionals' living in them.
there are bars and restaurants all over the Greenville metro. don't get the assertion there is nothing outside of downtown.
As in what is out of downtown Greenville that is appealing for YPs?
The city of Greenville. Literally the city. Greenville is small area wise. Youre never too far from the core.
Unlike many other cities, not all of Greenvilles job centers are clustered downtown. Theres professional employement along Pleasantburg, 85, Haywood, Pelham, 385, etc. You want to live near your job and jobs here are more spread out. That is appealing.
The city of Greenville. Literally the city. Greenville is small area wise. Youre never too far from the core.
Unlike many other cities, not all of Greenvilles job centers are clustered downtown. Theres professional employement along Pleasantburg, 85, Haywood, Pelham, 385, etc. You want to live near your job and jobs here are more spread out. That is appealing.
I agree Greenville is not very spread out and many areas I speak of are somewhat close to downtown, but my point is that downtown is still where you have to go to have fun and enjoy yourself and living outside of downtown means that you cant walk there, it would be an expensive Uber ride, and all in all just inconvienent.
If Greenville had pockets of neighborhoods outside of downtown with bars, nightlife, etc. that YPs could enjoy that would be walkable to where they live, we wouldn't be having this discussion but the problem is Greenville does not have that. Sure, living near your office is a nice perk but a trend seen from folks at the Urban Land Institute that makes sense when talking about millenials is that they tend to choose to live where they want, not where they work, meaning that living near their office is not the high priority but rather a place they will enjoy living is.
My whole point is that Greenville's downtown is the only thing truly appealing about Greenville, especially to YPs. When YPs are priced out of downtown and have to live 5-8 miles away, have nothing around them other than suburban shopping centers with no nightlife, and to go out any they must take an Uber costing well over $5 or have to fight the parking garage and pay for parking, Greenville's appeal diminishes.
This, again, is what will fuel growth in places like TR & Greer as well as Spartanburg and Anderson.
I disagree. When i think of places to go have fun with a group of friends around here, 4 places that quickly come to mind are D&B, Frankies, Haywood Mall, and Skyzone. None of those are downtown. Theres also the movies, which is not downtown either. Matter of fact you have to go to Simpsonville for IMAX (or Liemax).
Theres great places to eat and socialize downtown, but theres also great places outside too, like Bar Louie, Yard House, Cali Dreaming, CCF, Firebirds, HuHot, Tucanos, etc. Theres no Chipotle or Moes downtown. No Trader Joes or Whole Foods. All are millenial favorites.
Theres no YMCA. Fitness centers are all over the city. No Pure Barres or anything like that downtown. No recreation. Theres no bowling downtown. Charleston has the Alley, which is a bowling alley, bar, and dance floor all in one. DC also has something similar in Chinatown. Greenville does not.
Theres one pool hall downtown, 3 on Haywood. Strips clubs are technically "nightlife." None of those downtown. No laser tag downtown. Do you see this trend? Theres things to do all over. Its undisputable.
Sure theres a couple comedy clubs downtown, but one of them closes at 10pm so.
Maybe I'm spoiled by DC, Charleston, and NYC, but my experiences with Greenville nightlife have been more on the lame side. Downtown at night is fun, but downtown nightlife has let me down. And the crowds here are older.
You're not going to get the "ultimate" experience here, thats just how it is. Greenville is a family city, not a single youth mecca. This is not Miami Beach or Arlington or even Myrtle Beach, this is Greenville, SC. I wouldnt even put Greenville in the top 3 for SC nightlife, and top 4 is debatable.
Look weve been discussing this what feels like forever now. I honestly dont know what else to tell you. You have tunnel vision and act like its downtown or nothing, which is why we're even having this discussion.
Ive already dispelled the price myth. Go on Trulia. Theres properties all over Gville for a great price, including downtown. And do it without applying filters, which you probably have been doing.
If you dont think Greenville is appealing to young people, then calling Anderson and TR appealing is a big lol.
Downtown Greenville is tiny. Only so much can fit. You ask for too much. Walkability is not big in SC period. Sure downtown Charleston is walkable, but Mount Pleasant is not. Downtown Columbia is walkable, but NE Columbia is not.
Clemson around the campus is walkable, but Clemson the town is not. Downtown Greenville is walkable, but Mauldin is not. Theres no difference here. You cant penalize Greenville there.
Take the city for what it is, and take the whole city for what it has, and then youll be able to enjoy yourself.
I disagree. When i think of places to go have fun with a group of friends around here, 4 places that quickly come to mind are D&B, Frankies, Haywood Mall, and Skyzone. None of those are downtown. Theres also the movies, which is not downtown either. Matter of fact you have to go to Simpsonville for IMAX (or Liemax).
Theres great places to eat and socialize downtown, but theres also great places outside too, like Bar Louie, Yard House, Cali Dreaming, CCF, Firebirds, HuHot, Tucanos, etc. Theres no Chipotle or Moes downtown. No Trader Joes or Whole Foods. All are millenial favorites.
Theres no YMCA. Fitness centers are all over the city. No Pure Barres or anything like that downtown. No recreation. Theres no bowling downtown. Charleston has the Alley, which is a bowling alley, bar, and dance floor all in one. DC also has something similar in Chinatown. Greenville does not.
Theres one pool hall downtown, 3 on Haywood. Strips clubs are technically "nightlife." None of those downtown. No laser tag downtown. Do you see this trend? Theres things to do all over. Its undisputable.
Sure theres a couple comedy clubs downtown, but one of them closes at 10pm so.
Maybe I'm spoiled by DC, Charleston, and NYC, but my experiences with Greenville nightlife have been more on the lame side. Downtown at night is fun, but downtown nightlife has let me down. And the crowds here are older.
You're not going to get the "ultimate" experience here, thats just how it is. Greenville is a family city, not a single youth mecca. This is not Miami Beach or Arlington or even Myrtle Beach, this is Greenville, SC. I wouldnt even put Greenville in the top 3 for SC nightlife, and top 4 is debatable.
Look weve been discussing this what feels like forever now. I honestly dont know what else to tell you. You have tunnel vision and act like its downtown or nothing, which is why we're even having this discussion.
Ive already dispelled the price myth. Go on Trulia. Theres properties all over Gville for a great price, including downtown. And do it without applying filters, which you probably have been doing.
If you dont think Greenville is appealing to young people, then calling Anderson and TR appealing is a big lol.
Downtown Greenville is tiny. Only so much can fit. You ask for too much. Walkability is not big in SC period. Sure downtown Charleston is walkable, but Mount Pleasant is not. Downtown Columbia is walkable, but NE Columbia is not.
Clemson around the campus is walkable, but Clemson the town is not. Downtown Greenville is walkable, but Mauldin is not. Theres no difference here. You cant penalize Greenville there.
Take the city for what it is, and take the whole city for what it has, and then youll be able to enjoy yourself.
If you cant do that, IDK what else to say.
First of all, no filters on Trulia, Zillow, or HomeFinder and no filters on Apartments.com or Craigslist, if you can find me one property downtown that is not in the ghetto for less than $200k, please post it here.
I don't disagree that some things are out of downtown, but I would hardly consider any place you mentioned legit nightlife and more or less your run of the mill suburban "dad" hangout that just about every city in America has on its suburban areas.
Now, a good idea would have been to develop some of these areas into more walkable mix use developments similar to a Village at Sandhill, but instead you have what you have which is a downtown area and a run of the mill every city USA suburban area, not walkable, not connected, and certainly not appealing.
Again, my point is not arguing that Greenville is some crap city outside of downtown, its not but if you have lived in NY, DC, where ever, I fully expect you to see where I am coming from in saying that Greenville needs a more appealing alternative to downtown than what we have now, as well as the benefit of appealing to a YP demographic.
Look, we can argue this all day long but I think the best course of action is to agree to disagree at this point but the one thing we can agree on is your point about wages here. While compared to the places you have lived, Greenville's market may be reasonable but just like you said, wages here do not reflect that. My counterpart in New York that I work with has the same experience and responsibilities as I do but makes about $15k more than I do per year. Charlotte is about the same way.
Last edited by ColaClemsonFan11; 12-14-2016 at 12:18 PM..
First you complain about high rents, but now you talk about housing costs. Are we renting or buying? The downtown prices tennis match is old. It's supply and demand, man. There are affordable units and it's overall not that expensive. You can believe it be if you want. Obviously your mind is not going to change on it so it's a dead horse.
And really, Frankies is a "dad hangout?" Skyzone, IMAX, recreation, bowling, Whole Foods, Chipotle, and Pure Barre (which is women's fitness) are dad hangouts? Wow. You are out of touch. I guess when Top Golf comes, we should best not get excited, since it'll be a dad zone because it wasn't crammed into downtown.
Village at Sandhill? Sounds pretty "every city in America suburban." Sandhill is the same thing as Magnolia and Greenridge, an open air retail town center. Literally the same thing. Only difference is there's some residential. And then what's all around Sandhill??? Suburbia. Sure you can walk around Sandhill, BUT you still have to drive to it. Same way you can walk around Greenridge, just gotta drive to it...no difference.
I just gave you paragraph of things young people can do around town, and you completely disregarded the entire list. Your downtown blinders are definitely still on and it's obvious they're not coming off. Yes I see where you're coming from, and then I dont, because I'm being realistic. Greenville is not built like, doesn't function like, and doesn't match DC or NYC. That's how it is. Plus, I think Greenville already has other appealing, or appealing enough, zones. You just overlook them.
32% of the county has a bachelors degree or higher and the median age is 37.7. What Greenville has and doesn't have reflects that. Greenville is a family city like I said, not a single youth mecca, which is what you clearly want. Well you're not gonna get it out of Greenville. Has nothing to do with downtown or prices or poor planning, has to do with demographics.
And this isn't on the city. The city can't force a brewery or a bar or other "nightlife" to open. They come when and where there's a need in the market. Obviously Greenville's lack of all this stuff you want means there just isn't a market for it all. Which is the point I tried to make. That is how it is.
Last edited by Jandrew5; 12-14-2016 at 05:55 PM..
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