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I don't have any direct experience with the 11-87, but if you want a good utility turkey/waterfowl gun, I would suggest a plain finish 870 as being hard to beat. You don't need to buy it new, they are available at gun shows, gun shops, pawn shops, want ads. I don't know how many 870s are in circulation, but, a lot of them are out there, and while you can find a worn out or damaged gun if you look, most of them are quite serviceable.
I just prefer a pump to most autoloaders, since I reload, if one shot gets it done, I can dismount the gun, roll it to the right, and eject the empty right at my feet. (Uncle Jeff would not approve - instead recommending a reflexive reloading stroke without regard to hit or miss - which is the thing to do in a tactical or dangerous game situation...but I think he got more free and discounted ammo than I ever did...)
But regardless how you work it, the pump works fine with any load, light or heavy, and you have to get it really dirty to get into functioning problems.
For a dedicated turkey gun, Marlin made a bolt-action shotgun for a while, it's not beautiful in the sense of a Model 21 or Browning Superposed, and while I have never shot one, probably it works right well.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M3 Mitch
I don't have any direct experience with the 11-87, but if you want a good utility turkey/waterfowl gun, I would suggest a plain finish 870 as being hard to beat. You don't need to buy it new, they are available at gun shows, gun shops, pawn shops, want ads. I don't know how many 870s are in circulation, but, a lot of them are out there, and while you can find a worn out or damaged gun if you look, most of them are quite serviceable.
I just prefer a pump to most autoloaders, since I reload, if one shot gets it done, I can dismount the gun, roll it to the right, and eject the empty right at my feet. (Uncle Jeff would not approve - instead recommending a reflexive reloading stroke without regard to hit or miss - which is the thing to do in a tactical or dangerous game situation...but I think he got more free and discounted ammo than I ever did...)
But regardless how you work it, the pump works fine with any load, light or heavy, and you have to get it really dirty to get into functioning problems.
For a dedicated turkey gun, Marlin made a bolt-action shotgun for a while, it's not beautiful in the sense of a Model 21 or Browning Superposed, and while I have never shot one, probably it works right well.
Along those lines, I would recommend a well-used 870 over a brand new one. Then you don't have to deal with the possibility of any "break-in" pains. I'm of the opinion that 870s don't wear out, they just wear in.
I finally made it back to the gun counter to take a close look at an 870. First, I just want to say that I am ashamed that it took me this long to get back to the gun counter. Texasredneck will probably disown me as a friend for this.
I was impressed with the 870, and especially for the price. I love pump action because it is virtually indestructible, too. I think you gentlemen have influenced my decision. I am now leaning toward the 870. I'll probably check out a couple other models as well, but this one is now the front-runner.
Keep in mind that a new one is not necessarily any better than a used one, and for that matter may not be as good from what I have read about Remington having QC issues of late. If you had the gun today, right now, would you have any use for it beyond shoot some targets (which is a good use for it IMHO). - there will be some gun shows, check the pawn shops and "real" gun shops where they will have some used 870s.
Hey, sometimes work and stuff gets in the way of being a gun nut and hunter. Sad to say, it happens to me all the time...
Keep in mind that a new one is not necessarily any better than a used one, and for that matter may not be as good from what I have read about Remington having QC issues of late. If you had the gun today, right now, would you have any use for it beyond shoot some targets (which is a good use for it IMHO). - there will be some gun shows, check the pawn shops and "real" gun shops where they will have some used 870s.
Hey, sometimes work and stuff gets in the way of being a gun nut and hunter. Sad to say, it happens to me all the time...
I know. Life has a nasty habit of interfering with our best laid plans. But I did make it out to the range tonight after work to send my Savage 93 (.22 WMR) and Remington 700 (.30-06) on their maiden voyages. That brought a smile to my face. Then as if that wasn't enough, another guy showed up with his M1 Garand that had "fought" in WWII. i was "oohing and awing" over it, and he asked if I wanted to shoot it.
It was a real privilege to fire a piece of history. I already wanted one of those. Now my life will not be complete until I do. (okay, maybe that's an over-statement...but not really.)
We are wandering off the original topic, but you can definitely get set up to buy a Director of Civilian Marksmanship (DCM) Garand by participating in a few matches. Take a look in American Rifleman and you will no doubt see the ad, I forget what they are charging for them, but I have never known anyone to be disappointed with what they got.
Or, pick one up at a gun show.
Some places you can hunt deer with a Garand, some you can't, due to magazine capacity restrictions. IIRC you can't hunt with a centerfire autoloader at all in PA - not sure, I doubt I will ever hunt in that part of the country...It is a bit heavy ("8.32 lbs" I guess I will never forget that...) and while it's possible to put a scope on it, I would shoot it with original peep sight or shoot something else - anyway I digress.
We are wandering off the original topic, but you can definitely get set up to buy a Director of Civilian Marksmanship (DCM) Garand by participating in a few matches. Take a look in American Rifleman and you will no doubt see the ad, I forget what they are charging for them, but I have never known anyone to be disappointed with what they got.
Or, pick one up at a gun show.
Some places you can hunt deer with a Garand, some you can't, due to magazine capacity restrictions. IIRC you can't hunt with a centerfire autoloader at all in PA - not sure, I doubt I will ever hunt in that part of the country...It is a bit heavy ("8.32 lbs" I guess I will never forget that...) and while it's possible to put a scope on it, I would shoot it with original peep sight or shoot something else - anyway I digress.
The sights on that thing are a thing of beauty. I actually shoot better with iron sights anyway. I have scopes on my Savage and Remington and half of becoming proficient with those two rifles is going to be getting used to shooting with the optic. That is, eye adjustment and focus on clear cross-hairs. It is more challenging than I thought it would be.
My M4 carbine had a trijicon RCO that for the most part was a good piece of gear. The problem was your adjustments were not instant. You could potentially "chase" rounds across the target if you weren't patient. Halfway through range week I was ready to scrap that thing and fire with iron sights, despite already having gone on a combat deployment with the optic.
Okay, back on topic, here. Remington 11-87. Or rather, 870.
I finally made it back to the gun counter to take a close look at an 870. First, I just want to say that I am ashamed that it took me this long to get back to the gun counter. Texasredneck will probably disown me as a friend for this.
I was impressed with the 870, and especially for the price. I love pump action because it is virtually indestructible, too. I think you gentlemen have influenced my decision. I am now leaning toward the 870. I'll probably check out a couple other models as well, but this one is now the front-runner.
I'd throw my lot in for a pump-action shotgun such as a Remington 870. I have a 12-gauge 870 Express and it makes a perfectly fine turkey gun. It's a simple, inexpensive shotgun that does what it is supposed to do. I have a standard one with a 28" barrel and wood stock and think that is probably the best combination to get. Stubby barreled shotguns are easy to handle but short barrels with heavy turkey loads are deafeningly loud; the noise decreases as you add barrel length. Plus the extra weight in longer barrel is welcome in reducing the elephant rifle levels of recoil a turkey gun generates. About the only bad things I can think of with the 870 are that it is a stamped steel receiver instead of a milled steel receiver and it is a little rougher in the action than some other units. The Browning BPS is a milled steel receiver gun that is very slick and probably the best pump out there, but it costs twice as much as an 870 Express. I would go with the 870 if the gun will pretty much just be a turkey gun and shell out more for the BPS or a slicker semi or O/U if you will be doing a bit of other shooting with the shotgun. Personally I like pumps as they are lighter and have more shots than O/Us (hard to hit triples with an O/U) and less expensive, more reliable and effectively just as fast as a semi-automatic.
Quote:
Originally Posted by M3 Mitch
We are wandering off the original topic, but you can definitely get set up to buy a Director of Civilian Marksmanship (DCM) Garand by participating in a few matches. Take a look in American Rifleman and you will no doubt see the ad, I forget what they are charging for them, but I have never known anyone to be disappointed with what they got.
Or, pick one up at a gun show.
Some places you can hunt deer with a Garand, some you can't, due to magazine capacity restrictions. IIRC you can't hunt with a centerfire autoloader at all in PA - not sure, I doubt I will ever hunt in that part of the country...It is a bit heavy ("8.32 lbs" I guess I will never forget that...) and while it's possible to put a scope on it, I would shoot it with original peep sight or shoot something else - anyway I digress.
Most states should allow hunting with a Garand if they allow hunting with high-velocity centerfire rifles. I know some states don't allow rifles at all and others only allow some low to medium-velocity "pistol caliber" rifles (I realize that last one gets gamed a lot with necked up WSSMs and such.) Even the People's Republic of Kalifornia should be fine with a Garand as the only "scary evil gun" feature of the Garand is that it has a bayonet lug and it takes two "scary evil gun" features to be banned. I'd shoot the Garand with the original peep too if I had a Garand. The only thing I can think of that may make a Garand a less than stellar deer rifle would be that the gas system can have a bit of an issue with slower-burning powders used in modern factory hunting loads. But if you reload, it should work great.
Who has an opinion about this shotgun? I've read many reviews, and it seems people either swear by it or have absolutely no use for it whatsoever. Reviews tend to lean slightly toward those who swear by it, though enough users have enough negative things to say about it that it has me thinking twice. I am leaning hard toward purchasing one of these guns later this year or early next year. Generally I trust the Remington brand, and the 11-87 is a reasonably priced gun. I plan on using it as a turkey gun for spring gobbler season here in VA.
I really want an O/U but there are a couple reasons why I am beginning to change my mind. The high cost of a good one being one reason, and the fact that they aren't really commonly used as turkey guns is not lost on me either. So I began looking at other options.
Some of the impressions I have after reading A LOT of reviews is that the older copies of this gun tend to be fine. It's the new ones that tend to get the mixed reviews. For example, one outdoor shops site may feature 20 reviews from customers who have bought the gun in the last 2 years. 11 will be 5 star, 8 will be 1 star, and there will be 1 3 star thrown in just to make it more fun.
A common complaint has been the charging handle breaking off. Common praises include cycling and reliability, with one review claiming that his sat at the bottom of a pond for 2 days before he could recover it. After drying and cleaning, he said it fired as if nothing ever happened.
What are your thoughts?
There are shotguns that are better, and there are those that are worse. I really don't think you could go wrong with anything Remington makes and usually the price is right. I owned an 11-87 for several years and used it for pheasants, it never let me down. I gave the gun to my son in law because I had four other semi auto's (1100 Remington's), A Valmet O/U, and a Beretta 687 EELL also an O/U, and three pump guns. I would like to have a Beretta Extrema, almost no recoil, that will be my next shotgun.
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Remington 11-87
