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Old 05-27-2009, 06:23 AM
 
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Anyone know of good information on how barrels were rifled back in the 1700's?

I'm thinking Kentucky/Pennsylvania Rifle stuff here. No hydraulic presses, no electricity, etc.

Can't seem to find much online that really describes the tooling or processes to the level that one could actually do it if one were to find oneself living in conditions without power tools, etc.

I've read they do it at Colonial Williamsburg, but the photos and actual info aren't useful.

In any event, rifling well predates things like electricity, hydraulic presses, etc. So it's got to be possible to build reasonably accurate barrels "in the wild" by some process. I mean, consider that the classic statue of a Minuteman is with Kentucky Rifle, so by at least the American Revolution, rifled small arms were in existence. And, they certainly didn't have todays machine tools available.
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Old 05-27-2009, 01:29 PM
 
Location: Gila County Arizona
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First, just because the Colonials did not use power tools in gun making should not imply that it is simple.

The method used to rifle Flint lock barrels was a "cut type rifling".

By this method, a tool largely in the shape of a "J' was inserted from the muzzle end of the barrel and completely through. The tool was then pulled backward toward the muzzle.

As the tool was pulled, it scored the inside of the barrel. As the cutter was being pulled, the fixture that held the barrel rotated, thereby scribing a spiral. (think of a "push type drill")

Next, the barrel would be indexed to another position and the process repeated.

When the maker had completed his desired number of groves, the process was continued on until he was satisfied with the depth of the grooves.

The fly in the ointment for the home maker is the fixture. This device was a rather complex machine (even if not powered).

Getting the bore correct and the rate of rifling was an art not a science. Early on, gun makers would also make an individual bullet mold for each arm they produced, (because each bore was different).

One thing to consider was the fact that by colonial standards, guns were EXPENSIVE, and only the wealthy could afford them. Even then, the Gun smiths art was valued, and price accordingly.

I hope all of this helped. Definitely NOT A HOME PROJECT.
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Old 05-27-2009, 08:08 PM
 
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I've seen one rifling set-up ... I think it was in Minden, NE ... for doing this type of work. I don't know if it was a replica or a genuine antique, but it was interesting.

The drill fixture was a solid wood shaft with exterior large grooves milled into the surface, and it was held in a very robust wood block. The wood shaft was about 8" in outside diameter. It had a handle on it to pull it through the block and the whole affair was mounted on a lathe type bed. The barrel to be machined was held in an indexable headstock, also wood, and the barrel was supported along it's length in wooden v-blocks.

In operation, a smaller diameter wooden shaft with a cutter was inserted through the barrel and the end of the shaft was clamped into the larger grooved shaft. The tool was then pulled through the barrel and the grooves turned the tool as the cutter was withdrawn. At the end of the cut, the cutter shaft was unclamped from the big shaft, the barrel rotated to the next index position, and the process repeated.

I'd estimate the grooving was 1 turn in 14".

With a wood lathe and drill press, I don't see why somebody couldn't replicate the tooling in hardwoods with relatively simple hand tools. The machine was pretty massive, but simple in it's design and execution.
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Old 05-28-2009, 11:32 AM
 
Location: Sinking in the Great Salt Lake
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sunsprit View Post
I've seen one rifling set-up ... I think it was in Minden, NE ... for doing this type of work. I don't know if it was a replica or a genuine antique, but it was interesting.

The drill fixture was a solid wood shaft with exterior large grooves milled into the surface, and it was held in a very robust wood block. The wood shaft was about 8" in outside diameter. It had a handle on it to pull it through the block and the whole affair was mounted on a lathe type bed. The barrel to be machined was held in an indexable headstock, also wood, and the barrel was supported along it's length in wooden v-blocks.

In operation, a smaller diameter wooden shaft with a cutter was inserted through the barrel and the end of the shaft was clamped into the larger grooved shaft. The tool was then pulled through the barrel and the grooves turned the tool as the cutter was withdrawn. At the end of the cut, the cutter shaft was unclamped from the big shaft, the barrel rotated to the next index position, and the process repeated.

I'd estimate the grooving was 1 turn in 14".

With a wood lathe and drill press, I don't see why somebody couldn't replicate the tooling in hardwoods with relatively simple hand tools. The machine was pretty massive, but simple in it's design and execution.
More or less right, the process is called "button rifling" and the twist would be more like 1:66, or about 1 complete revolution through the entire length of the barrel to get the best accuracy with a patched roundball. The barrel itself would be made by hammering hot steel over a round steel form (not drilling) and draw filing the octagon profile and swamping the exterior (breech and muzzle thickest, thinning out in the middle) of the barrel, then using a drill to polish and true out the bore before rifling.

It would be impossible to do it "in the bush" without a complete blacksmith shop. This kind of barrel also could not be used with smokeless powder ammunition; it could not withstand the pressure and would blow up. And yes, they made VERY accurate barrels this way in colonial times.
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Old 07-21-2009, 10:24 AM
 
Location: PA
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I resently visited the Landis Valley Museum in Lancaster, PA. They have an original gun shop still set up on site. The Landis' made rifles and sold them as well. As newer models came out they bought the old ones and stored them in one of the attics. When the state took over there was found over four hundred of these riffles. They have many hand guns as well. On the tour they take you into the gunsmith shop and we looked at how they hand forged the barrels, drilled them and riffled them. All the equipement is on display for inspection. There is nothing from preventing you from touching anything in the shop. I think they would allow you to measure the large wooden equipement used to riffle the barrels. They even let you pick up and handle some of the old hand guns. If anything it would be worth the trip to see the shop set up as it was from the late 1700's-early 1800's.

I took pictures of the equiment and the shop and when I get a chance I will post some of the **** in my album.
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Old 07-22-2009, 04:30 AM
 
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HI Nikk, cool, would be interested in those pix.

No doubt it can be "done at home". May not be an easy project, but there are a few builders out there these days even, that do it with the hand powered rifling ***. It's the cutting tool that I'd really like a good look at.

I've seen videos of forging barrels. I probably wouldn't want to do it that way. How could you ever be sure the seam was any good?

But for shorter barrels, say handguns, one could definitely bore, rather than forge on a mandrel.
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Old 07-24-2009, 08:38 AM
 
Location: Cody, WY
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There is a lot of information on old time gunmaking in Foxfire 5. It's a must have for your library.
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Old 07-24-2009, 03:43 PM
 
Location: mid wyoming
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Uh, sorry the above post says it all only faster than me.Ha,ha.
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Old 10-02-2009, 03:08 PM
 
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Check out the site at [URL="http://www.americanlongrifles.com"]www.americanlongrifles.com[/URL] several builders who handmake their own barrels in the 18th century fashion participate and there are many pictures. you can search the archives for rifling machines

Enjoy
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Old 11-26-2012, 06:02 AM
 
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check your library for a copy of the fox fire books. there is a good drawing and naration how it works there!
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