Norfolk= cross between Raleigh-Durham, NC and Cleveland, Oh? (Virginia Beach, Chesapeake: houses, gated)

[Taggerung]

Is this accurate? I feel that Norfolk has some of the gritty, industrial 'urban' feel of Cleveland and some of the 'country', 'wooded' feel of Raleigh, Durham.

[murksiderock]

Norfolk has some of the Sunbelt character of Raleigh-Durham, but is definitely more urban. It is not nearly as urban as Cleveland...

I haven't really seen good comps for Norfolk. It is a pretty weird city. Buffalo compares well size wise, as both have small downtowns, are on water, have blue signage, largely segregated, largely working class, and about the same size overall. But Buffalo is way, way more urban than Norfolk...

Norfolk is wildly suburban but isn't touching the level of suburban you find in Raleigh-Durham...

[Kbank007]

Originally Posted by Taggerung

Is this accurate? I feel that Norfolk has some of the gritty, industrial 'urban' feel of Cleveland and some of the 'country', 'wooded' feel of Raleigh, Durham.

I like the comparison that you mentioned describing Norfolk to an extent. I also agree with Murk that Norfolk has some similarities to a less urban Buffalo. Norfolk is one of the south's legacy cities along with Richmond, New Orleans, Louisville, etc; however, it is difficult to gather that information based on the fact the city did not retain the majority of its original infrastructure. If you look at the pictures of Norfolk prior to 1960 you can see that the city resembled a smaller Baltimore, Buffalo, or Pittsburgh. Here is a website where you can see some historical pictures of Norfolk also:
https://nrha.photoshelter.com/galler...000mFu6K_1vm7Y
https://nrha.photoshelter.com/galler...000qc26LdCEPMs

[Taggerung]

Originally Posted by Kbank007

I like the comparison that you mentioned describing Norfolk to an extent. I also agree with Murk that Norfolk has some similarities to a less urban Buffalo. Norfolk is one of the south's legacy cities along with Richmond, New Orleans, Louisville, etc; however, it is difficult to gather that information based on the fact the city did not retain the majority of its original infrastructure. If you look at the pictures of Norfolk prior to 1960 you can see that the city resembled a smaller Baltimore, Buffalo, or Pittsburgh. Here is a website where you can see some historical pictures of Norfolk also:
https://nrha.photoshelter.com/galler...000mFu6K_1vm7Y
https://nrha.photoshelter.com/galler...000qc26LdCEPMs

Let me guess, a botched urban renewal is why Norfolk no longer looks like this pics?

[spencer114]

Norfolk can feel a bit like Baltimore if you squint. Ghent reminds me of a midwestern city, a bit like Milwaukee.
I don’t see anything even remotely like Raleigh there. Portsmouth is really the only city in VA that feels like a city to our south.

[murksiderock]

Originally Posted by spencer114

Norfolk can feel a bit like Baltimore if you squint. Ghent reminds me of a midwestern city, a bit like Milwaukee.
I don’t see anything even remotely like Raleigh there. Portsmouth is really the only city in VA that feels like a city to our south.

I disagree with this, Spence!

Hampton Roads is a lot more southern than people on CD seem to believe. There is almost nothing un-southern about Newport News and Hampton. Suffolk is the most southern place in all of the Virginia Crescent (NoVa x Central VA x Tidewater). Norfolk and Virginia Beach certainly aren't heavily southern but there is more southern characteristics present in both than there is in Richmond...

Where I will agree is that you can draw a comparison between Norfolk and Baltimore, there is a comparison there....

Overall Norfolk is like a cross between Baltimore and The Triangle, probably slightly favoring Baltimore. But Norfolk is a truly unique city, it's more dissimilar to either than similar, there isn't much it has in common with many places besides Virginia Beach...

Virginia Beach also has a little Raleigh to it, but as with Norfolk, is much more dissimilar to Raleigh than similar...

[spencer114]

I agree that Tidewater is southern, I just don’t see any Raleigh to it.
Newport News and Hampton are basically grid cities (NN in particular). You just don’t see that in NC.
VA Beach may have some Triangle attributes but I think the Peninsula in particular is more like NoVa ( not the super built, cosmopolitan parts but like Annandale) and Norfolk like a midwestern City (and Baltimore). Portsmouth and Chesapeake are certainly the most Southern in the area. The old houses in Hampton are right out of Steel Magnolias but downtown Hampton doesn’t feel very Southern. The mansard roofs of HU across the river (and the commercial fishing boats) change the feel quite a bit, almost a Hudson Valley feel (the old housing at Ft Monroe looks very central NY too).

It’s all Bay country and looks like it. Historically the connections were to the North and it shows in the built environment.

[Old Dominionite]

This thread reaffirms the reality that Hampton Roads, while having some similarities with other cities and other parts of the country, is truly a unique place. I see a lot of untapped potential if the cities worked more closely together to “brand” this uniqueness and raise awareness across the country, and even the globe.

[goofy328]

Originally Posted by Taggerung

Is this accurate? I feel that Norfolk has some of the gritty, industrial 'urban' feel of Cleveland and some of the 'country', 'wooded' feel of Raleigh, Durham.

I'd wager that Norfolk's grittiness, in size and "depth", for lack of a better term, is maybe 1/30th of what is going on in Cleveland. Cleveland is really out there, not as far as a city like Detroit or parts of Chicago but it can get really bad really quick. 1/30th, and that might be a conservative bet. And there's nothing like East Cleveland anywhere in Hampton Roads.

If anything Norfolk is a lot closer to conditions on the West side of the city. Isn't Portsmouth and Newport News grittier than Norfolk? Or not anymore. Newport News in particular impressed me back in the day things may have changed.

I can't speak for Raleigh or Durham, never been to either.

I love Cleveland but I don't want Norfolk to be another Cleveland. If I want Cleveland I'll just move there; its cheaper anyway and I can get more for my money than I do with Norfolk.

I'll go as far as to say that people want Southern cities to be as dystopian, gritty, and filthy as Northern cities and it is never going to happen. What you do get is no where near the size and scale of what goes on in Northern cities. There are good reasons for that. If anything that is the past no one in their right mind is trying to recreate that magic.

[goofy328]

Originally Posted by Old Dominionite

This thread reaffirms the reality that Hampton Roads, while having some similarities with other cities and other parts of the country, is truly a unique place. I see a lot of untapped potential if the cities worked more closely together to “brand” this uniqueness and raise awareness across the country, and even the globe.

It is definitely underrated, in all things both good and bad. It can be really hard to articulate this place to someone that has never lived here.