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Old 03-18-2015, 10:15 AM
 
Location: Kihei, Maui
569 posts, read 782,922 times
Reputation: 1135

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Quote:
Originally Posted by pj737 View Post
We rank #5 in the country with the highest property taxes paid. Very far from the lowest in the country. And with the recent change in property tax classification for non-owner occupants, we will be #3 in the country by this time next year.

We also rank #1 in state income taxes

And #1 in sales tax (yes, it's only 4.5% but because it includes rent, food, clothing, medical, utilities, etc it's by far the highest "sales tax", dollar for dollar, in the country)

The average person thinks taxes here are low... like a 4.5% sales tax RATE seems very low when other states charge 8% or more. And $3.50/$1,000 valuation RATE also is very, very low. But when you look at what is being taxed (all-inclusive everything including high ticket items required to survive like rent) and the VALUATION of those taxed items (compared to earned income), the taxes paid in DOLLARS OUT OF ONES' POCKET is of the very highest in the country. Most intelligent people ignore tax rates and look at the physical dollar amounts they are actually paying. The former means nothing... the latter everything.



States with the highest average property taxes in dollars for single family homes:

1) New York($15,625)

2) New Jersey ($8,108)

3) New Hampshire ($5,795)

4) Connecticut($5,646)

5) Hawaii ($5,024)


States with the lowest average property taxes in dollars for single family homes:

50) Alabama ($618)

49) West Virginia ($931)

48) New Mexico ($1,096)

47) Tennessee ($1,116)

46) Indiana ($1,418)
Showing property taxes paid by dollar amount rather than tax rate isn't all that useful.
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Old 03-18-2015, 10:26 AM
 
Location: Kihei, Maui
569 posts, read 782,922 times
Reputation: 1135
Quote:
Originally Posted by whtviper1 View Post
Being a resident doesn't change your property tax.
I don't profess to be an expert on the subject, but my understanding (as explained by my Realtor when I bought the place 5 years ago) is that my property taxes will go down quite a bit if I make my Maui property my official residence.
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Old 03-18-2015, 11:04 AM
 
Location: Portland OR / Honolulu HI
961 posts, read 1,224,754 times
Reputation: 1880
Quote:
Originally Posted by MauiPartTimer View Post
I don't profess to be an expert on the subject, but my understanding (as explained by my Realtor when I bought the place 5 years ago) is that my property taxes will go down quite a bit if I make my Maui property my official residence.
If Hawaii is your primary residence and you live in your home at least 270 days per year, you can apply for a resident exemption that reduces the taxable property value assesment on your home. I believe it is $80,000 if you are under 65 and $120,000 if you are over 65. In effect, it simply subtracts that $$ amount off your assesed value prior to determining your takes.

If the tax rate is $3.5 per $1,000 of assessed value (Oahu), the $80,000 exemption would amount to a savings of $280 per year in property taxes or $420 if you are over 65. If you live on Maui ($5.75 per $1,000) or the Big Island your savings would be higher because the residental property rate is higher on those islands. So on Maui if you are under 65 the savings would be $460 per year.

If you are Retired, you may also see a bit more of a Tax savings as a Hawaii resident ... but that depends on the state you are comparing. Reason is that hawaii exempts from State Income tax your Social Security income and certain types of Pension income (pension ... not 401(k)). So there could be a savings there also depending on the State with which you are comparing.
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Old 03-18-2015, 12:50 PM
 
1,586 posts, read 2,123,045 times
Reputation: 1885
Quote:
Originally Posted by whtviper1 View Post
That would mean across the state we all average at least $3,000,000 homes.

Hawaii has the second lowest rate in the US, #1 is Louisiana.

Best and Worst States for Property Taxes
Wait, so you are saying tax RATE is more important than actual MONEY PAID IN TAXES? Good grief.

And I guess Realtytrac is not a credible source of information?


2014 Property Tax Rates by County | Newsroom and Media Center

Average home values and median are two different things. If a $3M home as you suggest was owner occupied, the owner would be paying more than double the $5K figure noted by Realtytrac. Also, if that home was NOT owner-occupied (which is very common), the taxes paid on that $3M home in Hawaii would be $18,000 ANNUALLY.


Let's compare...

whtviper "statistics" - $5,000 taxes collected annually on $3M home.
Honolulu's property tax division- $10,500 collected annually on a $3M home if owner occupied. If rented OR owner is not full-time resident OR is not primary home to owner, taxes collected on that same home is $18,000 annually.

Assuming 50% of these homes are NOT owner-occupied (which is VERY low), the average taxes collected on that home is $14,250.

Your math is only off by a factor of 3X. At least you're getting better.

Last edited by pj737; 03-18-2015 at 01:03 PM..
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Old 03-18-2015, 02:37 PM
 
Location: Kahala
12,120 posts, read 18,005,554 times
Reputation: 6176
Fine, $5,000 was off the top of my head - still, a $1,500,000 house has a $5,000 tax bill.

Given the median single home price is $700,000 - the property tax is only $2,170 if owner occupied. So, the number of people paying $5,000 or more is small subset of the people who live here Given Condo median of about $350,000, they pay a whopping $1,000/year - so to say the average property tax bill is $5,000 seems way off given more than 50% of the population hardly pay anything for property taxes.
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Old 03-18-2015, 03:32 PM
 
1,586 posts, read 2,123,045 times
Reputation: 1885
Quote:
Originally Posted by whtviper1 View Post
Fine, $5,000 was off the top of my head - still, a $1,500,000 house has a $5,000 tax bill.

Given the median single home price is $700,000 - the property tax is only $2,170 if owner occupied. So, the number of people paying $5,000 or more is small subset of the people who live here Given Condo median of about $350,000, they pay a whopping $1,000/year - so to say the average property tax bill is $5,000 seems way off given more than 50% of the population hardly pay anything for property taxes.
Another thing you're missing is residents pay real property tax in other ways not just through owner-occupied residences. Every time you purchase something at the store you pay for the city's high property tax rate. While the owner AND full time occupant of that $1.5M home is paying a mere $5,250 annually, the exact same $1.5M valuation attached to the small store selling you mochi crunch is paying $18,600 in real property taxes annually. The commercial tax rate is over 3.5X the owner occ residential rate ($12.40/$1,000 vs $3.50/$1,000). So while you personally may not be paying a whole lot in your real property tax bill, you are indirectly paying for those taxes every single time you pay for a service or good. Just because you're not cutting the checks directly to the state/city doesn't mean you're not paying them.
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Old 03-18-2015, 03:38 PM
 
Location: mainland but born oahu
6,657 posts, read 7,786,874 times
Reputation: 3137
Quote:
Originally Posted by pj737 View Post
Another thing you're missing is residents pay real property tax in other ways not just through owner-occupied residences. Every time you purchase something at the store you pay for the city's high property tax rate. While the owner AND full time occupant of that $1.5M home is paying a mere $5,250 annually, the exact same $1.5M valuation attached to the small store selling you mochi crunch is paying $18,600 in real property taxes annually. The commercial tax rate is over 3.5X the owner occ residential rate ($12.40/$1,000 vs $3.50/$1,000). So while you personally may not be paying a whole lot in your real property tax bill, you are indirectly paying for those taxes every single time you pay for a service or good. Just because you're not cutting the checks directly to the state/city doesn't mean you're not paying them.
Dang uncle ive got to say that this is the best point and post ive seen in along time on here. Keep it up.
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Old 03-18-2015, 04:06 PM
 
Location: Kahala
12,120 posts, read 18,005,554 times
Reputation: 6176
Quote:
Originally Posted by pj737 View Post
Every time you purchase something at the store you pay for the city's high property tax rate. While the owner AND full time occupant of that $1.5M home is paying a mere $5,250 annually, the exact same $1.5M valuation attached to the small store selling you mochi crunch is paying $18,600 in real property taxes annually. The commercial tax rate is over 3.5X the owner occ residential rate ($12.40/$1,000 vs $3.50/$1,000). So while you personally may not be paying a whole lot in your real property tax bill, you are indirectly paying for those taxes every single time you pay for a service or good. Just because you're not cutting the checks directly to the state/city doesn't mean you're not paying them.
I could definitely get behind raising residential property tax rates and balance out by lowering commercial tax rates to encourage growth and jobs.
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Old 03-18-2015, 07:06 PM
 
Location: mainland but born oahu
6,657 posts, read 7,786,874 times
Reputation: 3137
Quote:
Originally Posted by whtviper1 View Post
I could definitely get behind raising residential property tax rates and balance out by lowering commercial tax rates to encourage growth and jobs.
Why? theres nothing wrong with the growth of the job market, very low unemployment. Its alot of the tourism money earned isnt being put back into the local economy. Thats the problem. I would go for raising the taxes more for foreign corporate business taking money out of Hawaii and giving local business a big tax break.
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Old 03-18-2015, 11:32 PM
 
Location: Kahala
12,120 posts, read 18,005,554 times
Reputation: 6176
Quote:
Originally Posted by hawaiian by heart View Post
I would go for raising the taxes more for foreign corporate business taking money out of Hawaii
Like who?
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