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Old 04-29-2020, 12:27 AM
 
Location: Portland OR / Honolulu HI
941 posts, read 1,092,583 times
Reputation: 1853

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“Freedoms” aren’t free. It actually takes a lot of sacrifices to maintain freedoms ... some small, some large. Without short term sacrifices now to contain coronavirus until a vaccine, treatment, or seasonality is proven, there would be no freedoms in the future (or they would look much different than today). This is no flu. Regardless of death, a large % of those infected require hospitalization .... even if they survive.

The real threat to “freedom” is those who take it for granted and abuse the freedom they have been given without consideration for others.
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Old 04-29-2020, 09:11 AM
 
2,378 posts, read 1,117,484 times
Reputation: 1722
Quote:
Originally Posted by Futuremauian View Post
When I first replied to this post it was one sentence long. Are you finished yet?

I've followed this thread (mostly out of boredom) and noticed, early on, that you are one of the vast group of "Trump interpreters" who try to rewrite history every time Trump says something stupid.

He sure stuck his foot in it when he talked about injecting disinfectants. Immediately you and many others claimed he didn't even say it. Dude, we all watched it live on TV. Then, after all of his minions tried to interpret "what he really meant", he finally came back a day later and claimed he was "being sarcastic". Yeah right!

Meanwhile I'm not living in fear. Aside from missing my awesome job, the biggest "liberty" I've had to surrender is sitting on my favorite beach after swimming. Fortunately, I live right on my second favorite beach so I go downstairs and straight into the ocean. Life is great!

Hope life gets better for you, you seem really stressed.
I’m not trying to be mean here, but people who believe President Trump meant injecting and ingesting cleaning products are the same people who would do it, just like the fish tank cleaner couple. I’m sorry, but you have to seriously be low IQ If you thought that is what President Trump meant, but leave it to our wonderful unbiased media to run on that. Yes, President Trump does say dumb stuff, I’m not going to deny that. For instance when he attacked the Khan family. Yes, they attacked him first at the DNC, but candidate Trump should have let that one go. They are a Gold Star family who lost their son. But to think Trump meant using household cleaner to ingest and inject is insane. President Trump isn’t always clear like most people aren’t always clear, but he did not suggest what the left is saying he suggested. He even deferred to medical doctors when talking about it. I think he was referring to UV light because that is what he was briefed on by Bill Bryon. But only people who are really dumb or suffer through TDS think otherwise.
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Old 04-29-2020, 09:30 AM
 
2,378 posts, read 1,117,484 times
Reputation: 1722
Quote:
Originally Posted by WaikikiBoy View Post
“Freedoms” aren’t free. It actually takes a lot of sacrifices to maintain freedoms ... some small, some large. Without short term sacrifices now to contain coronavirus until a vaccine, treatment, or seasonality is proven, there would be no freedoms in the future (or they would look much different than today). This is no flu. Regardless of death, a large % of those infected require hospitalization .... even if they survive.

The real threat to “freedom” is those who take it for granted and abuse the freedom they have been given without consideration for others.
Yes, the older you are the greater chance of hospitalization. The heavier you are the greater chance of hospitalization. If you are older and obese it’s even a greater chance of hospitalization. If you end up on a ventilator, you have a 20% chance of survival along with damage to the lungs do to the ventilator. Being on a ventilator is not good.

Hospitalizations for people in their 40’s is around 4% and the younger you are the lower the percentage of hospitalizations there are. For instance, people aged 20-29 the hospitalization rate is 1%. For those in their 80’s, the hospitalization rate it 18%.
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Old 04-29-2020, 11:35 AM
 
Location: Juneau, AK + Puna, HI
9,147 posts, read 5,734,611 times
Reputation: 13210
Quote:
Originally Posted by WaikikiBoy View Post
.. This is no flu. Regardless of death, a large % of those infected require hospitalization .... even if they survive. ..

A large % of older people, yes.

This quote below from CDC, dated mid April:

"..The overall cumulative COVID-19 associated hospitalization rate is 29.2 per 100,000, with the highest rates in persons 65 years and older (95.5 per 100,000) and 50-64 years (47.2 per 100,000). Hospitalization rates for COVID-19 in older people are higher than what is typically seen early in a flu season..."

From early March 2020, before covid burst on the scene, this quote from "Contagion" regarding flu:

"..The rate of hospitalization remains similar to what has been seen at this point in the flu season in recent years for adults and older adults. Overall, the cumulative hospitalization rate for the season stands at 52.7 per 100,000. However, hospitalization rates among children and young adults are higher than usual..."*
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Old 04-29-2020, 11:45 AM
 
Location: Juneau, AK + Puna, HI
9,147 posts, read 5,734,611 times
Reputation: 13210
Quote:
Originally Posted by whtviper1 View Post
..Have California and Nevada open - have them raise their hands it went fine - and I see us opening. I see no scenario we open to tourism and they don't.
Sounds reasonable, though opening crowded indoor venues like casinos isn't quite the same as opening primary attractions in Hawaii such as outdoor activities and physically distanced restaurants IMO.

Ige said he wouldn't join Western states alliance because they aren't similarly connected by land. What difference does that make? Most people travelling between those states do so by airplane.
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Old 04-29-2020, 11:46 AM
 
Location: Kahala
11,969 posts, read 16,379,967 times
Reputation: 5988
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nyfinestbxtf View Post

Hospitalizations for people in their 40’s is around 4% and the younger you are the lower the percentage of hospitalizations there are. For instance, people aged 20-29 the hospitalization rate is 1%. For those in their 80’s, the hospitalization rate it 18%.
I suspect you don't think 4% for people in their 40 and 1% for people in their 20's is a big number - but it is a huge number in terms of viruses for which we don't have a vaccine who otherwise wouldn't need to go to a hospital.
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Old 04-29-2020, 12:04 PM
 
451 posts, read 361,498 times
Reputation: 512
Quote:
Originally Posted by whtviper1 View Post
There is speculation from financial analysts they won't open this year - Disney hasn't said anything. Fun fact - Disneyland gets almost twice as many visitors in a year than the entire state of Hawaii

If California and Nevada don't open to tourism - I see absolutely no point in Hawaii taking the lead. The experiment Georgia, Oklahoma, and Texas soon opening up will telegraph if cases spike.

Have California and Nevada open - have them raise their hands it went fine - and I see us opening. I see no scenario we open to tourism and they don't

Newsom in California is already stating he can see the school year potentially starting in July - the pressure is real.

We might want to keep an eye on Okinawa. The Japanese 'Golden Week' holiday is beginning, and it has been reported in the Japanese media that 60,000 flight reservations have been booked to Okinawa. Okinawa prefecture (state) is comprised of a number of small islands and has a population about the same size as Hawai'i. Both have somewhat similar sized medical services infrastrucure. Okinawa's govenor has been requesting (begging) visitors not to come to the prefecture as the level of virus infection is still very small, and the residents are concerned their population will risk greater exposure when these Golden Week tourists arrive.
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Old 04-29-2020, 12:39 PM
 
2,378 posts, read 1,117,484 times
Reputation: 1722
Quote:
Originally Posted by whtviper1 View Post
I suspect you don't think 4% for people in their 40 and 1% for people in their 20's is a big number - but it is a huge number in terms of viruses for which we don't have a vaccine who otherwise wouldn't need to go to a hospital.
Four people out of a 100 people infected with C19 hospitalized doesn’t seem overly high. What is the hospitalization rate for those with the seasonal flu? 2018 flu season hospitals were overwhelmed, so the flu vaccine didn’t really seem to work all that well then.
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Old 04-29-2020, 02:22 PM
 
Location: Juneau, AK + Puna, HI
9,147 posts, read 5,734,611 times
Reputation: 13210
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nyfinestbxtf View Post
Four people out of a 100 people infected with C19 hospitalized doesn’t seem overly high. What is the hospitalization rate for those with the seasonal flu? 2018 flu season hospitals were overwhelmed, so the flu vaccine didn’t really seem to work all that well then.
Read my post above. Looks like 4 out of 100 is a bit high.

Of course, Covid is more contagious and lethal than the flu...
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Old 04-29-2020, 03:57 PM
 
2,378 posts, read 1,117,484 times
Reputation: 1722
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arktikos View Post
Read my post above. Looks like 4 out of 100 is a bit high.

Of course, Covid is more contagious and lethal than the flu...
I do believe C19 is very contagious, but read that it is not as contagious from child to adult. I disagree that C19 is more deadly than the flu. I haven’t seen statistical proof of that.
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