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Old 06-21-2020, 03:02 PM
 
Location: Kahala
11,970 posts, read 16,386,144 times
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Just saw a fairly lengthy segment on CNN on contact tracing - and I've got to say, I see no reason to have a program like that after watching it.

You get Covid and then contacted. They'll ask you a lot of personal questions (many of which can be uncomfortable such as who you are having intimate relationships, where you've been etc). Ok, so far so good (although the segment noted many don't cooperate due to the personal questions).

But wait - here is where it gets nearly worthless.

Then they start contacting people as best they can. They'll say - you may have been in contact with someone who has Covid. We recommend you self quarantine and get a test. That's it.

They won't tell you the name of the person due to HIPAA. So let's get this straight, we can have emergency orders to stay at home, quarantine or go to jail - restrict movement, but can't have an emergency order to tell you who you may have been exposed to?

And of course, getting tested and self quarantine is optional and on the honor system. What a lousy system.
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Old 06-21-2020, 06:07 PM
 
Location: Honolulu/DMV Area/NYC
27,740 posts, read 14,683,147 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whtviper1 View Post
Just saw a fairly lengthy segment on CNN on contact tracing - and I've got to say, I see no reason to have a program like that after watching it.

You get Covid and then contacted. They'll ask you a lot of personal questions (many of which can be uncomfortable such as who you are having intimate relationships, where you've been etc). Ok, so far so good (although the segment noted many don't cooperate due to the personal questions).

But wait - here is where it gets nearly worthless.

Then they start contacting people as best they can. They'll say - you may have been in contact with someone who has Covid. We recommend you self quarantine and get a test. That's it.

They won't tell you the name of the person due to HIPAA. So let's get this straight, we can have emergency orders to stay at home, quarantine or go to jail - restrict movement, but can't have an emergency order to tell you who you may have been exposed to?

And of course, getting tested and self quarantine is optional and on the honor system. What a lousy system.
Good points. I know that I'm not answering certain questions with regard to contact tracing, such as questions dealing with who I have been intimate with (it's none of their damn business) or where I have been in every instance.

That said, I think it's better than nothing.

As for HIPPA, it's all about federal preemption of and supremacy to state law.
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Old 06-21-2020, 07:27 PM
 
Location: Kahala
11,970 posts, read 16,386,144 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by prospectheightsresident View Post
As for HIPPA, it's all about federal preemption of and supremacy to state law.
Then there should be an Federal executive order to suspend specific to COVID contact tracing. If I'm contacted and they can't even bother to tell me who I got it from and where I could have gotten it from from it is in my opinion near worthless.
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Old 06-21-2020, 09:49 PM
 
Location: Honolulu/DMV Area/NYC
27,740 posts, read 14,683,147 times
Reputation: 29777
Quote:
Originally Posted by whtviper1 View Post
Then there should be an Federal executive order to suspend specific to COVID contact tracing. If I'm contacted and they can't even bother to tell me who I got it from and where I could have gotten it from from it is in my opinion near worthless.
I'm not sure that such an order would be lawful if issued. Executive orders at the federal level can only be issued where the law is ambiguous or silent, or where the law explicitly authorizes such orders. But if the law as established by Congress clearly stipulates that--using HIPPA for the sake of argument--only the patient or court order can lead to someone's medical records being released--then POTUS could not issue an executive order. I'd imagine that HIPPA is pretty strict in this sense, but would have to do more research.

Last edited by prospectheightsresident; 06-21-2020 at 10:01 PM..
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Old 06-21-2020, 10:38 PM
 
Location: Kahala
11,970 posts, read 16,386,144 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by prospectheightsresident View Post
I'd imagine that HIPPA is pretty strict in this sense, but would have to do more research.
The the Congress/Senate should modify the law. It is ridiculous as is. It’s either a national emergency. Or, it isn’t.
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Old 06-21-2020, 11:01 PM
 
Location: Honolulu/DMV Area/NYC
27,740 posts, read 14,683,147 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whtviper1 View Post
The the Congress/Senate should modify the law. It is ridiculous as is. It’s either a national emergency. Or, it isn’t.
Meh, I don't think that part of the argument matters one way or the other (I generally agree with the points from your earlier post). I'm struggling to see how you as an individual knowing exactly who you came into contact with is necessary to achieve the end state here Those who came into contact with someone who tested positive will be told that they came into contact with such a person (government officials and medical professionals who conducted the test would know . . . they just couldn't share the specifics with many others . . . but I say so what?). They can then isolate themselves and let others who came into contact with them know to do the same.

Simply put, knowing exactly who you came into contact with may satisfy your inquisitive nature, but it isn't necessary for contact tracing and subsequent efforts to isolate to be successful. Granted, I don't think contact tracing will be totally successful for other reasons, but not because you don't know the exact identify of the person that you came into contact with who tested positive for covid.
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Old 06-21-2020, 11:34 PM
 
Location: Kahala
11,970 posts, read 16,386,144 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by prospectheightsresident View Post
Meh, I don't think that part of the argument matters one way or the other (I generally agree with the points from your earlier post). I'm struggling to see how you as an individual knowing exactly who you came into contact with is necessary to achieve the end state here Those who came into contact with someone who tested positive will be told that they came into contact with such a person (government officials and medical professionals who conducted the test would know . . . they just couldn't share the specifics with many others . . . but I say so what?). They can then isolate themselves and let others who came into contact with them know to do the same.
Let’s put it this way. If it’s someone I know whom I see repeatedly at work or possibly very close I can take that more seriously than a random stranger.
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Old 06-22-2020, 03:34 AM
 
2,096 posts, read 1,359,393 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whtviper1 View Post
Let’s put it this way. If it’s someone I know whom I see repeatedly at work or possibly very close I can take that more seriously than a random stranger.
Correct. The media created covid to be such a huge boogeyman, but in reality time and amount of exposure matters a lot more than incidental or quick exposure as far as risk. Someone in constant contact with numerous random people or in constant contact with the same people are far more at risk than incidental quick contact. It's the reason why we see 15 cases in 1 family in waipahu, the bartender getting the virus (along with his mom), etc.

They make contract tracing out to be some sort of mythical art, but in reality all it is is finding out who you live with and who you work with and who you spent an extended period of time with the previous week or two. If any of those people test or tested positive, you do the same for them. If there's common connections, such as workplace or living arrangement, congrats, you discoverd a cluster.
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Old 06-22-2020, 03:58 AM
 
Location: Honolulu/DMV Area/NYC
27,740 posts, read 14,683,147 times
Reputation: 29777
Quote:
Originally Posted by whtviper1 View Post
Let’s put it this way. If it’s someone I know whom I see repeatedly at work or possibly very close I can take that more seriously than a random stranger.
Ok, that's fair, but then that would be on you and not inherently a problem with not knowing explicitly who the person is. To that extent, the covid contact you came in contact with could very well be a stranger.
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Old 06-22-2020, 10:39 AM
 
Location: Kahala
11,970 posts, read 16,386,144 times
Reputation: 5988
Quote:
Originally Posted by rya96797 View Post

They make contract tracing out to be some sort of mythical art, but in reality all it is is finding out who you live with and who you work with and who you spent an extended period of time with the previous week or two. If any of those people test or tested positive, you do the same for them. If there's common connections, such as workplace or living arrangement, congrats, you discoverd a cluster.
This is how I thought it would work - and be effective.

After the preliminary reason for calling -

Whtviper1, do you know rya96797? Answer no. Ok, we see you were at Morton's on June 15, and a patron tested positive for Covid - you may to consider a test.

Do you know rya96797? Answer yes!!! Yes, that is someone I see all the time, we just had drinks yesterday. Whtviper1, you should proceed to get a test immediately and self isolate until you get the results.

Seems as if none of the above will really happen.
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