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I was vegan for over six years, put my whole heart and soul into it. Not only did I eat 90% whole foods plant based (as opposed to junk food vegan) but I looked at every aspect of my life and how I could live it as free from animal products as possible. I joined vegan protests, marched in a Walk For Farm Animals to raise money for Farm Sanctuary, I leafleted Vegan Outreach materials during rush hour in downtown Duluth and downtown Minneapolis, and also on 4 different college campuses all on my own. I tabled vegan materials and ideas at a private college in their student union and talked one on one with faculty and students. I worked with a local medical complex to get vegan items on the menu and in the cafeterias and to advocate for vegan patients. I was at least partially successful as the director began to incorporate six vegan meals into the meal rotation and they now offer plant milks, hummus, vegan bars etc in their cafeteria. I converted family members to vegan at least temporarily, and got my meat eating husband to eat all vegetarian at home and all vegan on trips.
But my own health challenges (osteoporosis, eating disorder, thyroid disorder etc) made veganism very challenging for me and worsened some of my conditions. I also became very obsessive with it so that my whole life, everything I ate and breathed, was veganism. I shut out family, friends etc because i became so self righteous with veganism, and judgmental of others. I saw this in myself and I did not like who I was becoming. I started out on my journey wanting to be a more loving and compassionate person towards all life. But it turned me into an angry person. My eating disorder also became much worse.
But the most maddening thing was other vegans. I was accused of not being vegan because I fed my dog meat. Or because I had an omni partner I had been with for over twenty years who refused to become vegan. I was advised by animal rights vegans I should leave him, even if he is the best thing that ever happened to me. I was accused of not being vegan because I rely on medications that may have been tested on animals, or because I ate Daiya products when that vegan company sold out to a non vegan company to survive. It just became more and more ridiculous. I became totally burned out. I didn't even like the leaflets I was passing out as they always showed the worst case scenerio examples of factory farming, and offered a lot of highly processed vegan junk food to appeal to non vegans.
When I left being vegan and moved to lacto ovo vegetarian and finally pescetarian, the hate from other vegans was unbelievable. Everything I had ever done for the movement was immediately erased and I was a traitor, a hypocrite, or I "never was a true vegan". Or "you did it wrong". I didn't even come out right away, and when I did I started with family/friends etc. I left vegan groups because I had seen how they raked others over the coals who stopped being vegan. Ex vegans are treated worse than meat eaters by many vegans. They can be really awful. Because I was involved in local vegan groups in person, I've been questioned and drilled about health issues that are frankly no one else's business. Never once during any of my get togethers with hundreds of vegans during marches and protests and events did anyone ask if I was ok when I was 22 lbs underweight. I felt a total lack of compassion towards humans. I realize that a lot of vegans are not like this. I still have vegan friends that are ok with where I am. But I've had more judgment and rudeness and harassment from vegans than i ever had from meat eaters when I went vegan. My philosophy about animal rights has also changed greatly and I don't believe there is one and only one way to live and eat and be compassionate towards animals. The world is too diverse and there are too many gray areas. This black and white all or nothing approach does not work for many. I have a lot of anger towards some vegans for the way I have been treated. It doesn't mean I am against what vegans are doing or that i don't respect them. I'd just like to see some respect in return. I'm still very much doing what I feel is right for my own sanity and health while balancing that with what I feel is good for the environment, animals, health etc but trying to strike a balance between the two which don't always mesh.
I should've said "...the flesh & secretions of tortured animals..." That would've been more accurate.
If your oh so delicate sensibilities can handle it, watch the documentary "Earthlings" sometime.
Or Google the Hormel undercover investigations. Hell, Google 'factory farm undercover investigations' in general, there are plenty of them.
Or visit the websites or FB pages of Mercy For Animals, Compassion Over Killing, Free From Harm, Toronto Pig Save, Peaceful Prairie Sanctuary, etc. to learn more about what happens in the animal agriculture industry & why that industry keeps trying to get ag gag laws passed.
Then maybe we can have a discussion.
Everything named above my daughter's into and studying at college. She's shown us all of those websites and movies and taught us to eat ethically. She eats vegan and vegetarian. We eat organic free range meat, eggs, dairy, (never feedlot/caged) now thanks to her. We live together in the same household yet don't want to kill one another. We respect each other's preferences. Some people are just fighters, receiving an adrenaline high from it. Or they're just stubborn. My family would rather just relax and get along.
Last edited by Withinpines; 11-21-2019 at 12:55 AM..
If these nine pages have revealed anything it is that vegans are held in contempt by many. For what reason, I can't that figure out. I suppose they are an easy target and humans naturally want to feel superior to others. Yes, it's impossible to exist as a human without negatively impacting lesser creatures but I think it's a worthwhile endeavor to try to minimize the deaths and suffering of the lesser ones. I applaud those who have made the effort. Just my opinion and obviously not shared by most if this thread is any indication. I would love to see more tolerance.
Indeed...
Quote:
Originally Posted by JOinGA
Eating meat is eating violence. Foregoing meat does not mean one has to load up on carbs and sugars. This is just a ploy to distract from the fact that people can be very healthy on a vegan diet and there are plenty of world-class vegan athletes to prove it.
Vegans are held in contempt by many because this is the attitude that the more vocal of vegans put on display all over the internet, and in life. Actually, the bolded is rather tame compared to the things I've heard some vegans say to other people.
I don't care what someone eats, they shouldn't care what I eat. If they want to care what I eat, they can start buying my food. Only when they are buying my food do they then get to have any say about what I eat.
At least we agree on 1 thing. No, I don't think abortion is ok. I'm 100% against it.
The problem a lot of us vegans have with people who consume meat, dairy, & eggs is that they are forcing their agenda on defenseless animals. If you ever saw some of the photos & videos that so many of us vegans have seen of what goes on in the animal agriculture industry, you might understand the outrage some of us feel. It's all too easy sometimes to become that angry judgmental vegan that just annoys the cr@p out of everyone
But yeah, I used to eat dairy, eggs, & meat too so I really don't have any right to feel superior to anyone. If nothing else, hopefully these undercover investigations that have come to light the last few years will spur the food industry to treat farmed animals more humanely.
treating them humanly, to me, is very different than not killing and eating them period. If we did not kill animals, especially wild ones many would starve to death or die under worst conditions than shooting them. I also do have a huge problem with the vegan diet not allowing the consumption of eggs and dairy products. But I also respect the views of those who differ from me along as they are not going to lecture me or try to make me feel uncaring or inferior
A plant based diet is by far the best way to eat. All the people talking about needing meat for protein have no idea how biochemistry works (full disclosure i have a PhD in Nutritional Biochemistry). All the meat we eat (like cows and chickens) eat plants. Thus, the protein we need can be obtained directly at the source (plants) versus eating the animals that had to eat the plants to give them protein. The biggest animals on the planet eat plants. We are meant to have a plant-based diet. Always have been. The 1950s in America and the advent of convenience changed everything.
Look at how much protein you get in a cup of edamame or in a cup of lentils. Will blow any meat out of the water. in terms of protein content.
Plus, any animal product (cheeses, milk, etc) still have the bad things in them that cause atherosclerosis, heart disease, diabetes, etc (like heme iron for example). These all act to increase the amount of inflammation in the body, thus leading to the problems described above. You can say that its not harming you, but the alarming rate of coronary heart disease and cancer say otherwise.
If all of America went to a completely plant-based diet for 5 years, you would see the levels of Coronary Heart Disease, Cancer of all types, heart attacks, diabetes, hypercholesterolemia, etc, absolutely plummet. But no, we just keep eating meat and animal products and wondering why we keep getting fatter and sicker. Its all about the sh*t you keep putting in your body for decades on end. You eventually pay the ultimate price.
I should've said "...the flesh & secretions of tortured animals..." That would've been more accurate.
If your oh so delicate sensibilities can handle it, watch the documentary "Earthlings" sometime.
Or Google the Hormel undercover investigations. Hell, Google 'factory farm undercover investigations' in general, there are plenty of them.
Or visit the websites or FB pages of Mercy For Animals, Compassion Over Killing, Free From Harm, Toronto Pig Save, Peaceful Prairie Sanctuary, etc. to learn more about what happens in the animal agriculture industry & why that industry keeps trying to get ag gag laws passed.
Then maybe we can have a discussion.
Vegans who wonder why people react defensively when you say you're vegan? This post right here shows exactly why, and this kind of vegan is who you should have problems with because they cause that defensive and annoyed reaction. And they are generally much louder than rational vegans.
As someone who lives in ranch country AND who has worked in rescue for over 15 years, I could tear the post apart with facts, but will simply let it stand as a bad example of propaganda and the worst kind of proselytizing.
A plant based diet is by far the best way to eat. All the people talking about needing meat for protein have no idea how biochemistry works (full disclosure i have a PhD in Nutritional Biochemistry). All the meat we eat (like cows and chickens) eat plants. Thus, the protein we need can be obtained directly at the source (plants) versus eating the animals that had to eat the plants to give them protein. The biggest animals on the planet eat plants. We are meant to have a plant-based diet. Always have been. The 1950s in America and the advent of convenience changed everything.
Look at how much protein you get in a cup of edamame or in a cup of lentils. Will blow any meat out of the water. in terms of protein content.
Plus, any animal product (cheeses, milk, etc) still have the bad things in them that cause atherosclerosis, heart disease, diabetes, etc (like heme iron for example). These all act to increase the amount of inflammation in the body, thus leading to the problems described above. You can say that its not harming you, but the alarming rate of coronary heart disease and cancer say otherwise.
If all of America went to a completely plant-based diet for 5 years, you would see the levels of Coronary Heart Disease, Cancer of all types, heart attacks, diabetes, hypercholesterolemia, etc, absolutely plummet. But no, we just keep eating meat and animal products and wondering why we keep getting fatter and sicker. Its all about the sh*t you keep putting in your body for decades on end. You eventually pay the ultimate price.
Loma Linda California is a blue zone (meaning the people live the longest there). They practice a vegetarian lifestyle. Their whole lifestyle (faith, community, health, food) promotes long life.
Loma Linda California is a blue zone (meaning the people live the longest there). They practice a vegetarian lifestyle. Their whole lifestyle (faith, community, health, food) promotes long life.
Icaria is a famous Blue Zone. While they eat a plant-based diet, they do eat fish and pork (raised in the back yard, primarily). They have goats and use goat milk and yoghurt. They also drink lots of wine, last I heard there were no clocks on the island, and exercise is a part of daily life. Time is spent daily with family and friends, and family tends to stay close to home (as in, not moving away - there's a social and familiar structure that remains intact and close-knit and physically close).
Sardinia, another Blue Zone, has a diet that is likely plant-based, but with amounts of meat, fish and poultry included. Again, dairy products (cheese and other dairy products). Again wine daily. Similar culture in terms of families staying close, lots of down time spent with friends.
In looking at the Blue Zones, the common denominator appears to be not so much diet (except they all seem to eat a lot of beans) as an approach to life that is far more relaxed and happy than ours. Even those of our vegetarians and vegans.
A plant based diet is by far the best way to eat. All the people talking about needing meat for protein have no idea how biochemistry works (full disclosure i have a PhD in Nutritional Biochemistry). All the meat we eat (like cows and chickens) eat plants. Thus, the protein we need can be obtained directly at the source (plants) versus eating the animals that had to eat the plants to give them protein. The biggest animals on the planet eat plants. We are meant to have a plant-based diet. Always have been. The 1950s in America and the advent of convenience changed everything.
Look at how much protein you get in a cup of edamame or in a cup of lentils. Will blow any meat out of the water. in terms of protein content.
Plus, any animal product (cheeses, milk, etc) still have the bad things in them that cause atherosclerosis, heart disease, diabetes, etc (like heme iron for example). These all act to increase the amount of inflammation in the body, thus leading to the problems described above. You can say that its not harming you, but the alarming rate of coronary heart disease and cancer say otherwise.
If all of America went to a completely plant-based diet for 5 years, you would see the levels of Coronary Heart Disease, Cancer of all types, heart attacks, diabetes, hypercholesterolemia, etc, absolutely plummet. But no, we just keep eating meat and animal products and wondering why we keep getting fatter and sicker. Its all about the sh*t you keep putting in your body for decades on end. You eventually pay the ultimate price.
Well, many plant eating animals got large only eating plants. Which makes it unreasonable to think that we have to eat animal meat in order to grow. Some of the largest mammals are plant eaters like the elephant, giraffes, and horses. Grass is actually very nutritious but you have to consume a large quantity. That's the problem with us is that we are not built to eat plants for a long duration of time. We would have to spend 1/3 of our day eating plants in order to keep up with an active life style.
How many vegans can actually keep eating 1/3 of their day to get their essentials. As you get older you need even more vital nutrients to prevent bone density and tissue loss. Veggies just don't have enough amino acids vs a simple egg yolk. You need to eat a whole lot of grains and it's not exactly healthy to eat too much grains, it's very high on the glycemic index to eat a ton of grains for protein. Unless you plan on running 5mi a day like our ancestors do without cars and trains.
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