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We are all in a situation where we are being asked to make personal sacrifices to protect the health of others. This begs the question: how much responsibility do we have to others to keep ourselves healthy? To live a lifestyle where we maintain a healthy weight, exercise, eat well, dont smoke, drink to excess, do damage with drugs, etc?
Illness and accidents can take out anyone at any time of course. Advanced age is also a factor. But what about preventable health issues? Do we have a social responsibility not to burden others with our costly care? Do you think attitudes will change due to this current crisis? Or do you believe that it's an entitlement to live whatever lifestyle you choose no matter what the cost? Do you think employers or others might start discriminating against those who have preventable health issues after this is all done?
I think you should be allowed to do whatever you want with your body. I also believe you should be responsible for the payment to repair or save your life if you have a blow out. I used to work in a lot of hospitals and 8 got to know a lot of doctors and nurses. . I remember one doctor. We were talking. He said see that guy....I just did a quadruple bypass on him. Guy was in the waiting area for pick up. Gets in the truck and i kid you the f not.....Lights up a cigarette. Doc says that was a waste of his time.
I know a guy who has a company who refuses to hire smokers. I used to call smokers one armed workers. They usually took longer more frequent breaks. I used to smoke years ago. Before work on my break/lunch or after work. That was it. In a lot of places we couldn’t smoke. I quit i think 10/11 years ago
Being smart with foods, not smoking and so much goes a long way in our lives. So glad I never smoked...just hearing on the news about the obese population and chronically ill in MS and LA and how the "virus" is hitting there.
I hope the above poster quit smoking soon enough. I think of a close family member who didn't.
People will do what they want, including things that are bad for them. Always have, and always will. We can only be responsible for our personal well being and it's futile to try to convince others to change. I've known several people who STILL smoked after being diagnosed with COPD. Others who have obesity induced health issues and still eat whatever they want, whenever they want. Also, I can't speak for anyone else but quite a few of the health care professionals I've had business with aren't exactly shining beacons of wholesome living. You can't effectively lecture people to live healthier when you are really overweight, or when patients observe you on your smoke break.
This is a country of people who care strongly about their individual freedoms. With that freedom comes the price of tolerating people who do things that annoy us. Or in some cases put us at risk.
There are plenty who want to remove your freedoms too.
They invoke socialized healthcare , " but we all foot the bill" mentality.
The problem is, socialism always requires a loss of freedom.
Thats why the constitution was written the way it is, to stop them.
I am not concerned with how anyone wants to destroy themselves, my concern is if they want help.
Abraham Lincoln wrote " a man without vices is just as lacking in virtues".
Thats because those without vices are the first to play God.
Its a slippery slope and the thin end of the wedge is not visible.
There are plenty who want to remove your freedoms too.
They invoke socialized healthcare , " but we all foot the bill" mentality.
The problem is, socialism always requires a loss of freedom.
Thats why the constitution was written the way it is, to stop them.
I am not concerned with how anyone wants to destroy themselves, my concern is if they want help.
Abraham Lincoln wrote " a man without vices is just as lacking in virtues".
Thats because those without vices are the first to play God.
Its a slippery slope and the thin end of the wedge is not visible.
I have a personal belief that I am to cause no harm to others - so, ideally, that would be in thought/action/deed.
In a quantum universe, "no man is an island." We all affect each other, so if you are socially conscious, you would not want to hurt others, and the best way to not hurt others is to be the best version of yourself possible.
I have a personal belief that I am to cause no harm to others - so, ideally, that would be in thought/action/deed.
In a quantum universe, "no man is an island." We all affect each other, so if you are socially conscious, you would not want to hurt others, and the best way to not hurt others is to be the best version of yourself possible.
That's one key to recognize - the best version of yourself "possible". Humans love to believe they are in control of everything. Some people are healthy (or appear so) and haven't really done much to be healthy but they have good genes, e.g. Those people often like to take 100% of the credit for their healthy appearance when talking about others who are "lazy", "fat", eat badly, etc. Some people do those things and get away with them while others suffer the full wrath.
We need to get a whole lot more sophisticated about understanding the causes and influences of health and of healthy behaviors. You and I'll do what we can, but judging others as though we know 100% of the cause and effect of illness and understand 100% of people's motivations is wrong.
I sure hope that my decisions to eat certain foods doesn't have some minor negative impact on others - I may get judged in 10 years for doing something considered horrendous that people today think is "good". Our knowledge is limited.
We are all in a situation where we are being asked to make personal sacrifices to protect the health of others. This begs the question: how much responsibility do we have to others to keep ourselves healthy? To live a lifestyle where we maintain a healthy weight, exercise, eat well, dont smoke, drink to excess, do damage with drugs, etc?
Illness and accidents can take out anyone at any time of course. Advanced age is also a factor. But what about preventable health issues? Do we have a social responsibility not to burden others with our costly care? Do you think attitudes will change due to this current crisis? Or do you believe that it's an entitlement to live whatever lifestyle you choose no matter what the cost? Do you think employers or others might start discriminating against those who have preventable health issues after this is all done?
This is dangerous thinking that can lead down a slippery slope quickly. The concept of "healthy life style" and "healthy choices" are fluid and mean different things to different people. My "healthy life style" may not be your "healthy life style". Who(m) defines it? We are not all the same person with the same environment and the same challenges. You might say "We need to punish that person for smoking" and "we need to punish that person for eating a Big Mac with a large french fries" and "we need to punish that person for not getting out and walking every day" and "we need to punish that person for being sexually promiscuous". Where does it end? Fines? Imprisonment? Special insurance classes? For making everyone act basically the way we want them to act? The way that's "good for them". Once this starts, it is not going to end. As far a me having to pay for your indulgences in your lifestyle when it comes to health care, welcome to socialism or "taking from the workers and giving to everyone else". Perhaps we can pass a clause in healthcare where we don't cover illnesses cause by bad lifestyle choices. But who(m) defines bad lifestyle choices in this instance? Are we trying to take care of everyone else or are we trying to control everyone else (care is a form of control). Perhaps we should each just take care of ourselves and model a healthy lifestyle for others to see.
I think in this modern age that it all comes down to economics. We all expect good healthcare for ourselves and our loved ones. If someone acts selfishly and irresponsibly, he uses healthcare that we might need for ourselves. We are seeing this right now in people refusing to distance themselves from others "because I have a right to do what I want" and thus becoming part of the huge healthcare problem that we have right now.
If we live in a healthcare system that provides care for everyone, behaving irresponsibly can use up valuable $$ that might mean there was no care left if you needed it, or taxes would need to go up to provide it. If we live in a system that uses private insurance to provide healthcare, someone behaving irresponsibly in your particular insurer's pool of users can cause the costs to go up for everyone who uses that insurance company. Whether or not we have universal healthcare or not, the cost of care each year is divided by the pool using it and billed accordingly.
So it's in everyone's economic interest for people to stop behaving selfishly with their health. As far as how to determine what is a healthy lifestyle, as Demolitionman2 above asks, that's what we have doctors for. Right now doctors don't want to tell people they're too fat, etc., because their clients will just get angry and go to another doctor - again, all about economics. But somehow we have to get over that problem and find a way to bring all the bad actors into the system.
We are all in a situation where we are being asked to make personal sacrifices to protect the health of others. This begs the question: how much responsibility do we have to others to keep ourselves healthy? To live a lifestyle where we maintain a healthy weight, exercise, eat well, dont smoke, drink to excess, do damage with drugs, etc?
Illness and accidents can take out anyone at any time of course. Advanced age is also a factor. But what about preventable health issues? Do we have a social responsibility not to burden others with our costly care? Do you think attitudes will change due to this current crisis? Or do you believe that it's an entitlement to live whatever lifestyle you choose no matter what the cost? Do you think employers or others might start discriminating against those who have preventable health issues after this is all done?
This is dangerous thinking that can lead down a slippery slope quickly. The concept of "healthy life style" and "healthy choices" are fluid and mean different things to different people. My "healthy life style" may not be your "healthy life style". Who(m) defines it? We are not all the same person with the same environment and the same challenges. You might say "We need to punish that person for smoking" and "we need to punish that person for eating a Big Mac with a large french fries" and "we need to punish that person for not getting out and walking every day" and "we need to punish that person for being sexually promiscuous". Where does it end? Fines? Imprisonment? Special insurance classes? For making everyone act basically the way we want them to act? The way that's "good for them". Once this starts, it is not going to end. As far a me having to pay for your indulgences in your lifestyle when it comes to health care, welcome to socialism or "taking from the workers and giving to everyone else". Perhaps we can pass a clause in healthcare where we don't cover illnesses cause by bad lifestyle choices. But who(m) defines bad lifestyle choices in this instance? Are we trying to take care of everyone else or are we trying to control everyone else (care is a form of control). Perhaps we should each just take care of ourselves and model a healthy lifestyle for others to see.
No "punishment " was mentioned at all. Not sure why you went down that road. But let's talk about cost. If you eat to excess for example, and get into the obese range, maybe your health care costs more than someone who doesn't and it's your responsibility to foot that bill. Maybe your food costs more if its junk and fast food. Maybe fruit and healthy snacks are conversely less expensive and exercise classes are free. Maybe you get a bonus for getting back to a healthy weight or the extra you spent on health care is returned to you.
If we live society and not on our own personal island its valid to question whether our fellow social beings are creating issues for others to clean up. There are mores and values at work. I think in light of what's happening in the world today these are valid thought exercises.
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