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Old 04-30-2020, 09:30 AM
 
1,385 posts, read 740,185 times
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11 days from starting this thread, the new title should now be:

So FAR: Covid Deaths Exceed Flu Deaths For All Years In The Last Decade And It Happened Within 2 Months (not a full flu season)

We're at 61514 deaths. The first reported death in the US was Feb 29 ( https://www.nytimes.com/article/coro...-timeline.html )

THUS: In just TWO MONTHS, more people have died of Covid-19 than of the flu for the last decade.

And we're not done yet.

Again:

1. Covid numbers are WITH social distancing.

2. Flu number are WITHOUT social distancing.

3. The flu has comorbidity too...which I haven't seen mentioned in all these arguments about "other illnesses/being old"/cancer/heart disease.

Thus, Covid-19 is worse than the flu.
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Old 04-30-2020, 10:54 AM
 
1,385 posts, read 740,185 times
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Oh, and it's 5x the deaths of 9/11, and more dead than all 14 years of US involvement in the Vietnam war (some of us remember the somber daily scrolling names of the dead during that war - "somber" because we cared)

And we ain't done with it yet.

But still, the privileged want to go to the beach and restaurants.
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Old 04-30-2020, 11:19 AM
 
2,281 posts, read 1,540,587 times
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And people dying from starvation could amount to 300,000 a day worldwide due to the shutdown all around the world! https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/u...nturn-n1189326

Let's keep the world on lockdown until there's a vaccine! The world can always repopulate.
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Old 04-30-2020, 11:26 AM
 
1,385 posts, read 740,185 times
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There's one of those negating, dynamic dart boards now.
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Old 04-30-2020, 01:13 PM
 
1,163 posts, read 262,639 times
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right, Susan? hehehe ... they just keep coming...



It's kind of hard to follow the article - there are no source documents - but it seems like they're saying tourism is the main reason for the starving...but then it says school lockdowns / no free lunch is the reason. These things are quite at odds. I'm not saying it's not true. I'm saying the article is all over the map, with no easy way to find the data myself. The only sentence that's crystal clear to me is this one: "...there are no famines yet..."
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Old 04-30-2020, 03:17 PM
 
1,385 posts, read 740,185 times
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Yeah, no surprise there. Interesting to note though, re his idea of starvation - during the Great Depression from that reliable source known as the National Academy of Sciences: https://www.pnas.org/content/106/41/17290

"...In 1931 alone, there were at least twenty documented cases of starvation; in 1934, that number grew to 110. In rural areas where such documentation was lacking, the number was likely far higher. And while the middle class did not suffer from starvation, they experienced hunger as well...."

Collaborated in Digital History

And tons of sources saying things like: "..."Our study provides evidence that even major depressions do not imply mortality crises," says study lead author David Stuckler, of the London School of Hygiene & Tropical Medicine. "Whether health improves or worsens during hard times depends mainly on how governments choose to respond." https://www.smithsonianmag.com/scien...ates-46713514/

People aren't (wise to be) worried about starving to death. They're worried about money. I don't think that's insignificant. I think it's important.

I happen to value life over money (and eating out, and beaches...yeesh.)

The Grim Reaper is much better with pandemics than he is with finances.

Last edited by crusinsusan; 04-30-2020 at 03:53 PM..
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Old 05-01-2020, 12:19 PM
 
Location: Not far from Fairbanks, AK
17,083 posts, read 30,230,224 times
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Once anything one can think of gets on the Internet and turns "political/economical," all kinds of supposedly "independent" data posted here and there is nothing but a "smoke and mirror show". So here we are arguing with each other about all the show's "smoke" being presented to us.

Lets face it: there is not a vaccine for the common cold, nor a definite (permanent) one for the Flu because this virus mutates, and so the Corona virus (SARS). There isn't a vaccine not even for AIDS. Back in 1918-20, the War Flu (Spanish Flu) killed more people-in two or three seasons-than the Coronavirus and subsequent flu seasons put together. And back then the world wasn't as populated as it is today.
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Old 05-01-2020, 12:55 PM
 
7,434 posts, read 4,127,054 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crusinsusan View Post
New title should now be:


So FAR: Covid Deaths Exceed Flu Deaths in 7 years of the Last Decade
You mean the 2009 Flu PANDEMIC? Yes, that was declared a Pandemic. Obviously, you survived that one.

However, 1918 (most talked about) and 2009 were not the last Flu Pandemics. There was Flu Pandemics in 1957 and 1968. Many Epidemics in between those years. What were the number of cases, and deaths, from those other pandemics? Nobody ever mentions those two.

Pretty sure I had the 1957 one, especially remember my Mom saying, "Oh, No. It's February she is going to be out of school with the flu." 1968 I definitely had it because I could not get out of bed, go to work, and Mom stayed at my home to care for me. She did not catch it from ME probably because she had that same strain before in her life.

While there has not been a TOTALLY NEW strain of flu, and they say that the same strains change from year to year, there has to be at some natural immunity for those who had those strains. Otherwise, why would you have people saying they never had a flu shot but don't catch the flu?

COVID 19 is new, but we will probably see the same happen over years as with the flu. The more people who catch it, survive, produce antibodies, will give herd immunity.
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Old 05-01-2020, 01:09 PM
 
7,434 posts, read 4,127,054 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RayinAK View Post
Once anything one can think of gets on the Internet and turns "political/economical," all kinds of supposedly "independent" data posted here and there is nothing but a "smoke and mirror show". So here we are arguing with each other about all the show's "smoke" being presented to us.

Lets face it: there is not a vaccine for the common cold, nor a definite (permanent) one for the Flu because this virus mutates, and so the Corona virus (SARS). There isn't a vaccine not even for AIDS. Back in 1918-20, the War Flu (Spanish Flu) killed more people-in two or three seasons-than the Coronavirus and subsequent flu seasons put together. And back then the world wasn't as populated as it is today.
Do do a Google Search. It was the healthy young adults in 1918 who were far more affected than older people. Why? Because there had been another Pandemic in 1886 (did you know that?) and older people alive then had a degree of immunity to the one in 1918. That happened again in 2009 far more affecting the young. Older people had already survived previous pandemic of the same strain.

Why do you think they don't only want positive/negative testing, but antibody testing as well?
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Old 05-01-2020, 01:24 PM
 
1,163 posts, read 262,639 times
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Otherwise, why would you have people saying they never had a flu shot but don't catch the flu?

That's a common question with an easy answer: Influenza carriers are generally symptomatic when they're contagious. Even when they're not - it's for a day or two, not two weeks. In short - COVID is a bit more "contagious" than the regular old flu. If the flu acted like COVID - everyone without a shot would probably catch it, and many WITH a shot would also catch it. Unless you've already had it. Then you won't. But no one (well, nearly no one) has already had COVID.



For COVID in particular - you are, in a sense, completely correct. The more people that catch it, the fewer left that CAN catch it - but I disagree it will take years. With a lockdown - yes, years. Free -range? Like we're about to all do? As NY, Italy, Spain, England have all demonstrated: It will not take years. Months maybe. A few real holdouts (for instance, older folks sequestered in a home with a never-ending source of food and support) - they may never, ever get sick - and simply remain vulnerable.



The more people that catch it - get sick (known or unknown) - and get over it - then the lower your chance is of running into someone with it. The pile of SICk and OVER IT gets bigger, and the pile of NEVER HAD IT gets smaller. Soon, the pile of OVER IT gets biggest, and the NEVER HAD IT group has to find a SICK group to catch it. Odds get smaller every day - but never zero.
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