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Old 07-15-2022, 06:52 PM
 
2,343 posts, read 908,106 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghaati View Post
Ethically - wait til you learn how many animals were slaughtered in the process of harvesting your plant-based diet. All those rabbits, squirrels, chipmonks, other garden-dwellers and farm animals that get stuck in the combines.

If you REALLY want to go the "ethical" route - you'll respect the food chain. Hunt for your dinner. Grow your own vegetables and fruits. Pick them by hand, not by machine. Avoid plastics. Re-use, recycle, have a compost heap, and a compost toilet. And a water-barrel/cistern system to provide your house with fresh rainwater instead of causing the death of millions of fish and other animal life every day in the public reservoirs and water treatment plants. Have a rain-based irrigation system for your garden.

If you're not going that route - then your "ethics" are not really ethics. They're just a platform you've chosen to stand on, that has no base.
and those animals that are killed by combines harvesting plants for a plant based diet, are also killed in hayfields by combines. that hay then feeds livestock and guess where the livestock goes- into your meat based diet. So lets not criticize ethics. You are doing the same thing.
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Old 07-15-2022, 07:01 PM
 
160 posts, read 178,718 times
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Eat meat or don't eat meat. Personally I think a diet that includes all of the food groups that focuses on minimally processed foods will do just fine. Staying away from junks foods and fast foods will do wonders for your health.
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Old 07-16-2022, 07:44 AM
 
762 posts, read 274,959 times
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Originally Posted by Parnassia View Post
Agree. Just about everything a person consumes can end up being bad for them under the right circumstances. Even something as innocuous as water. Too much water = drowning. Personally, I get heartily sick and tired of people who preach endlessly that this or that particular food is bad or good. Living a life, especially a longer one, is more complex than that. No action you take, nothing you ingest exists in isolation.
The food industry loves to here people say things like that. They couldn't hope for anything better. It's their dream come true. Some years ago there was a supermarket food chain that hired a doctor with a degree in nutrition to go around giving free lectures, and she said almost the same thing you said. And they didn't stop there: They hired dietitians who also did the same. Their message was, "There's no such thing as bad food."

That's exactly the idea the food industry wants to promote.

Last edited by LongevitySeeker; 07-16-2022 at 08:06 AM..
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Old 07-16-2022, 07:57 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghaati View Post

Humans are omnivorous. Vegetarianism and Veganism is a food choice and/or a lifestyle choice, not a biological or anatomical necessity for the human species.
I couldn't have said it better.

But I would add this: Just because we have the ability to eat almost any type of food, doesn't mean we should.
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Old 07-16-2022, 08:13 AM
 
10,465 posts, read 14,497,230 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Northrick View Post
My mom, who has eaten meat all her life, is 80 and still doing well. Are you saying she might live to be over 115 if only she hadn't eaten meat?
And George Burns smoked cigars every day and lived to be 100. That doesn't mean that smoking is healthy and leads to longevity.
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Old 07-16-2022, 08:26 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mightyqueen801 View Post
I was a vegetarian for a couple of years. Added back fish, then meat, but still have lots of meatless days and my food choices grew exponentially because of the vegetarian years. There are lots of good vegan/plant-based choices out there.

For those who want to improve their health by cutting down on animal products, you don't have to be an extremist. Start by having meatless meals or meatless days. Unless you're one of those Arctic people, you probably already consume tons of plant-based foods. We're just conditioned to think that a hunk of dead animal must always be the center of the meal, and that way of thinking can be changed. Let the meat be the appetizer or a side dish.
You appear to be offering advice to others, but you didn't give a reason for "adding back fish, then meat...."

Unless, perhaps, you think the reason is obvious, that vegans need more enjoyment, that no one could possibly enjoy being a vegan.

If I were the type to be inclined to do that I would have done it by now. During my 17 years of veganism, I never had any desire whatsoever to have a side dish of meat.

Dr. Campbell has said it's best to go all the way for the best health effect. And he compared it to smoking. If someone quits smoking completely, should we call them extremists and suggest that they have at least one or two smokes per day?
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Old 07-16-2022, 08:50 AM
 
762 posts, read 274,959 times
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Originally Posted by Sand&Salt View Post
Yes, every time someone pressures us to go vegan, I think of the Inuits traditional diet. No veggies for them, lol.
And the Masai in Africa. Meat, milk and blood.

Both very healthy and fit.
But there are no long-term formal studies to back that up. I believe it might just be a fantasy designed to keep the high protein dieters on board. (The beef industry loves that story.)
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Old 07-16-2022, 09:08 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Sand&Salt View Post
Me either! We evolved eating meat.

I would have died from a vegan diet in my 20s. All that indigestible fiber blocked the stomach-emptying valve and without modern medical intervention, I would have blown up and died.

There is such a thing as too much fiber. We're actually on a fiber-restricted diet right now due to DH's stomach issues.

We're not herbivores, who need gigantic and/or multi-stomachs to digest all that fiber. We just cannot. Nor can we chew cud.
There's no such thing as too much fiber for anyone who has a digestive system in good working order.

We don't digest the fiber! The microorganisms in our lower digestive system digest the fiber. If a person's digestive system doesn't have the proper community of microorganisms, then, yes, the fiber won't get digested. It's called a "Microbiome". And the community microorganisms that make up the microbiome are supposed to be passed along from mother to child at birth. Otherwise, people sometimes take probiotics in an attempt to get it going. Without a healthy microbiome, poor health is often the result.
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Old 07-16-2022, 09:16 AM
 
Location: USA
6,492 posts, read 3,263,770 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MadManofBethesda View Post
And George Burns smoked cigars every day and lived to be 100. That doesn't mean that smoking is healthy and leads to longevity.

He enjoyed his 100 years with smoking. I'm sure that throughout his life, his doctors kept telling him to stop smoking. "It would be better for his health."

I can only imagine the exact words he used in responding to all those well-meaning, but clueless people.

Well, I say those same words now to the people who insist on telling me that I'm living my life the wrong way. I should do this, and I shouldn't do that.

"Should" is not a word to use to adults. I find people who proselytize about religion, eating habits, or lifestyles are very tedious.

Now- if I could only get really good pastrami here in the Gulf coast of Florida.
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Old 07-16-2022, 09:24 AM
 
762 posts, read 274,959 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MadManofBethesda View Post
Vegans, especially ethical vegans, aren't necessarily healthy and fit either.
Omnivores, especially ethical omnivores, aren't necessarily healthy and fit.

We have a nation full of unhealthy omnivores.

My opening post was not intended to represent all vegans, ethical or otherwise. Of course there are unhealthy ethical vegans.

Last edited by LongevitySeeker; 07-16-2022 at 09:34 AM..
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