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Quote: "Jonas Salk, inventor of the IPV, testified before a Senate subcommittee that nearly all polio outbreaks since 1961 were caused by the oral polio vaccine". End Quote. [now of course if I took the time I would need to find out the difference between the 'oral' and 'intravenous' vaccine, perhaps you could enlighten me, as I'm sure you will, or attempt to anyway.
That is because when you get the polio vaccine, sometimes you will get a weak polio reaction. This is normal, and it does not mean you have the full blown polio.
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Quote: "Crib death was so infrequent in the pre-vaccination era that it was not even mentioned in the statistics, but it started to climb in the 1950's with the spread of mass vaccination against diseases of childhood. - Harris L. Coulter, PhD." End Quote.
This person doesn't know what he is talking about. Before the 1950's no one keep any real statistic records of diseases like we do today.
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Do some reading from "vaclib.org" and then tell me that the establishment is looking out for your health!
Can you please provide a real and reliable source. Because if you quotes are from this webpage, even they are not reliable.
While I hate to split hairs, there is a huge difference between 1/100 and 1/1000. The website you posted does not say that in the US the death rate is 1%. It says that in DEVELOPING countries, the death rate can be from 1-5%. We are not a developing country.
If 1,000 children in the USA get measles, then approximately 1 will die. If 1,000 children in Africa get measles, then approximately 250 will die. The measles vaccination is a moot point in this case, because either the kids who got measles weren't vaccinated, or else their vaccine was not effective. So disregarding that, why do so many in Africa die from this disease? It's due to malnutrition and deficiency in vitamin A.
And with that, I'm bowing out... really, no one is going to change their mind here. Everyone has (hopefully) done their own research on the matter and will continue to make the best choices for themselves and their families than they can. Enjoy this beautiful Sunday! It's going to get into the 80s here, and I can't wait to get outside after church!
Thanks Woof, it just bugs me a little that anything/everything published by the establishment or 'authorities..?' is readily accepted as gospel whereas when any alternative information is found, which there is scads of if one digs deep enough, it's always viewed with scepticism and taken to with a baseball bat. What's that old saying..."from an acorn an oak tree grows", perhaps in some cases it could be said "from a little information a more informed public hopefully ensues". Given enough information the general public will be in a better position to make a more *informed* choice in some things, instead of being treated as mindless morons...only dead fish go with the flow!
But ignorance is not only lack of knowledge but is also lake or awareness. Where people follow information without real data or real evidence is not only gullible but also ignorant. You should always should ask for evidence including from the Government.
While I hate to split hairs, there is a huge difference between 1/100 and 1/1000. The website you posted does not say that in the US the death rate is 1%. It says that in DEVELOPING countries, the death rate can be from 1-5%. We are not a developing country.
If 1,000 children in the USA get measles, then approximately 1 will die. If 1,000 children in Africa get measles, then approximately 250 will die. The measles vaccination is a moot point in this case, because either the kids who got measles weren't vaccinated, or else their vaccine was not effective. So disregarding that, why do so many in Africa die from this disease? It's due to malnutrition and deficiency in vitamin A.
Again,
Let see if you get it.
In the US, with people being vaccinates the death rate is less then 1%.
In the US, with people not being vaccinated the death rate is about 1%
In other Countries where people are not vaccinated and with poor health system the death rate is almost 30%.
If you have 100 children in the US without the Vaccine but with the disease the death rate could be as high as 5%.
If you have 100 children in the US with the Vaccine and with the disease the death rate is less then 1%.
Because in Africa only 70% of the population is vaccinated, VS US where is almost 97%.
That little difference of 27% make a huge difference.
I understand that any information which is not passed on to the general public via the appropriate authorities will be ridiculed and every attempt will be made to discredit said information but nevertheless...
If the suggestion here is that the 'establishment' or 'medical authorities' are...reliable? sources of information I make no comment, but I believe I'll continue to trust my own judgement, based on viewing both sides of the coin, I feel more comfortable that way, and I feel I'm better informed, or misinformed, depending on an individuals perception/interpretation of all published material available.
I understand that any information which is not passed on to the general public via the appropriate authorities will be ridiculed and every attempt will be made to discredit said information but nevertheless...
No the problem is not that, because 90% of real source is pass down by Universities and Non-Government Institutions. The problem with your source is they don't have any study, is like me saying right now Water will kill you, and you just believe me without no actual data.
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If the suggestion here is that the 'establishment' or 'medical authorities' are...reliable? sources of information I make no comment, but I believe I'll continue to trust my own judgement, based on viewing both sides of the coin, I feel more comfortable that way, and I feel I'm better informed, or misinformed, depending on an individuals perception/interpretation of all published material available.
OK, you can stay misinformed if you want to. If you can just show some real evidence and not just people with no actual knowledge talking about it like if they are profession or just a bunch of parents talking about thing that they don't know, that is your right.
But I guess that when a University does some sort of study, is part of the Government or the Government is involved. Like if it is a big conspiracy, you know vaccine have microchips that record everything, and the government use it to track you.
[is like me saying right now Water will kill you, and you just believe me without no actual data.]
-Funny you should mention this, I actually have data, not *real* data of course. I found this some years ago...
"SACRAMENTO, Calif. - A woman who competed in a radio station’s contest to see how much water she could drink without going to the bathroom died of water intoxication, the coroner’s office said Saturday.
*******, 28, was found dead Friday in her suburban Rancho Cordova home hours after taking part in the “Hold Your Wee for a Wii” contest in which KDND 107.9 promised a Nintendo Wii video game system for the winner."
Would a coroners statement qualify?
[But I guess that when a University does some sort of study, is part of the Government or the Government is involved.]
There you go, there's those academics again, you'll always get your percentage of academics looking for their 15 minutes of fame, probably helps justify the expense of getting a higher education. As long as they don't stray from mainstream they will quickly be snapped up by the establishment. The other academics who try to put their scholastic efforts into true scientific research will in all probability not get funding if their chosen field of research falls outside of mainstream.
[If you can just show some real evidence and not just people with no actual knowledge talking about it like if they are profession or just a bunch of parents talking about thing that they don't know, that is your right.]
I think we both know that the notion of *real evidence* will only be accepted, and widely published as credible, when it comes from those academics who remain within the mainstream ideals, other academics who push a different barrow would be just pushing the proverbial up hill.
This has been a pleasant exchange but I believe this could go on infinitum, and we are probably digressing a little from the OP's original post, of which I've forgotten now, so perhaps it's best if we agree to disagree aye. I think we've made both our thoughts and/or beliefs fairly clear, no point in to-ing and fro-ing too long. I'm content to remain...'misinformed'.
[is like me saying right now Water will kill you, and you just believe me without no actual data.]
-Funny you should mention this, I actually have data, not *real* data of course. I found this some years ago...
"SACRAMENTO, Calif. - A woman who competed in a radio station’s contest to see how much water she could drink without going to the bathroom died of water intoxication, the coroner’s office said Saturday.
*******, 28, was found dead Friday in her suburban Rancho Cordova home hours after taking part in the “Hold Your Wee for a Wii” contest in which KDND 107.9 promised a Nintendo Wii video game system for the winner."
Would a coroners statement qualify?
Everybody remember that story, it was last year. She did because of the amount of water. Everything in life can kill you, even the things that you need for life. But you are now avoiding the subject.
If I say you shouldn't drink water because the Government put things in the water, would you believe me, especially when I don't have any real data?
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There you go, there's those academics again, you'll always get your percentage of academics looking for their 15 minutes of fame, probably helps justify the expense of getting a higher education. As long as they don't stray from mainstream they will quickly be snapped up by the establishment. The other academics who try to put their scholastic efforts into true scientific research will in all probability not get funding if their chosen field of research falls outside of mainstream.
I can see you don't know anything of how the University works.
some of this research last for years and with subject that wont make them rich nor famous.
And if you don't believe in this type of research, what type of research you do believe, the person that opens a web page and start talking with no education and no evidence?
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I think we both know that the notion of *real evidence* will only be accepted, and widely published as credible, when it comes from those academics who remain within the mainstream ideals, other academics who push a different barrow would be just pushing the proverbial up hill.
Can you provide any study done by anybody? And real evidence from Universities comes out all the time and they usually go against mainstream.
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This has been a pleasant exchange but I believe this could go on infinitum, and we are probably digressing a little from the OP's original post, of which I've forgotten now, so perhaps it's best if we agree to disagree aye. I think we've made both our thoughts and/or beliefs fairly clear, no point in to-ing and fro-ing too long. I'm content to remain...'misinformed'.
If you could just provide some sort of evidence or some sort of data down to show your point of view, I don't think I am asking much I am?
so a year is your evidence?
So I guess you evidence of 3 elderly people die from unknown consequences is your evidence??
3 people? that is it?
Last edited by cjma79; 04-26-2009 at 01:39 PM..
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I make no comment, but I believe I'll continue to trust my own judgement, based on viewing both sides of the coin, I feel more comfortable that way, and I feel I'm better informed, or misinformed, depending on an individuals perception/interpretation of all published material available. 
