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Old 02-04-2012, 01:44 PM
 
11,266 posts, read 45,002,839 times
Reputation: 15138

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chemistry_Guy View Post
There has never been a credible study that has held up to peer review showing any harmful effects when aspartame is used appropriately. Some guy on the internet is not a reliable source. Anecdotal experience is not reliable.

Snip

I have much more confidence in these sources than a guy wearing a tinfoil hat who used to work at a hospital, or whatever rock the aspartame hoaxers live under.


There are all kinds of health issues associated with many products sweetened by aspartame. As I said earlier, health experts that care about what they eat and drink will not touch diet soda.
Through several posts of yours, I understand your position that anybody who disagrees with your sources or your assertions is either mentally unbalanced, a tinfoil hat wearer, or has anecdotal experience that is of no merit whatsoever in your view.

So be it. Everybody's a kook, nut, incapable, incompetent, ignorant, or a fool, right?

But what about these folks?

1. National Cancer Institute Cancer Statistics Review 1973-87. Bethesda, N111 Pub. No. 89-2789
2. Roberts, H.J.; Does Aspartame Cause Human Brain Cancer?. Journal of Advancements in Medicine. Vol. 4, No. 4, Winter 1991
3. W.C. Monte, Aspartame: Methanol and the Public Health. Journal of Applied Nutrition, Vol. 36, No. 1, 1984.
4. P.J. Shaw, Excitatory amino acid receptors, excitotoxicity, and the human nervous system. Current Opinion in Neurology and Neurosurgery 1993, 6:414-422 UK
5. T.J. Maher and R.J. Wurtman, Possible Neurologic Effects of Aspartame, a Widely Used Food Additive. Environmental Health Perspectives. Vo. 75, p. 53-57, 1987.
6. M.E. Drake, Panic Attacks and Excessive Aspartame Ingestion. p. 631 The Lancet, Sept. 13, 1986
7. Congressional Record, Senate. Saccharin Study and Labeling Act Amendments of 1985. May 7,m 1985, p. S5489-5516
8. Congressional Record Senate. Aspartame Safety Act of 1985. August 1, 1985, p. S10820-10847
9. Ishu, II: Incidence of brain tumors in rats fed aspartame. Toxicol Letters 1981, 7:433-437.
10. R.G. Walton, Seizure and Mania after high intake of aspartame. Psychomatics, 1986; 27:218-220
11. R.J. Wurtman, E.R.Walker, Dietary Phenylalanine and Brain Function, MIT Press May, 1988.


Are they all tinfoil hat ignorant fools, too?

Apparently, the US Navy and Air Force have both advised pilots to not consume any aspartame. Are their MD's also all tinfoil hat ignorant fools, too?

How about the anecdotal stories that have been posted within the pilot community of vision and impaired mental abilities? Are every one of those people tinfoil hat wearing fools, too? This is a group of folk for whom health is a prime factor in their ability to perform their tasks and earn a living, so it's not trivial when they can personally find a link between a certain food item and their health; ie, some have discovered for themselves that their cognitive skills and vision deteriorate when consuming as little as a stick of aspartame sweetened chewing gum, let alone sweetened beverages. Their work performance is highly monitored, so a deviation from their normal performance is readily noted by themselves as well as their associated pilots and flight crews.

Or are pilots, as a group, just more sensitive to the effects of substances than other folks, so the threshold of adverse effects starts with a smaller than normal intake of aspartame? Note that very few other professions require such intensive and frequent health exams as the FAA requires of 1st class medical certificate holders .... so the group is consistently monitored for any deviations from the standards of performance for vision, cognitive skills, hearing, cardiovascular performance, etc.
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Old 02-04-2012, 01:49 PM
 
Location: Cincinnati near
2,591 posts, read 3,659,066 times
Reputation: 5944
Quote:
Originally Posted by lifelongMOgal View Post
A holistic medicine website! Haha! I'll take the FDA, MIT, Time Magazine, and ACHS over a holistic medicine website every day.

If you think holisticmed.com is a credible source and doesn't have an agenda, I think that really ends all possibility of an intelligent debate.

Again, just because someone on the internet says something, it doesn't make it true.
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Old 02-04-2012, 01:55 PM
 
11,266 posts, read 45,002,839 times
Reputation: 15138
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chemistry_Guy View Post
(snip)
Again, just because someone on the internet says something, it doesn't make it true.
Indeed!

For me, I'm in that group of pilots that will not consume products containing aspartame or MSG. With the host of reports I've seen, there's enough doubt about the safety or effects of these substances in our diet that I cannot justify having them in my diet.

If I'm right, then I've avoided substances which have been the causation of many health problems among my contemporaries.

If I'm wrong, then I've avoided substances which I didn't miss in my diet. Sure beats the potential adverse consequences at risk, IMO.

Incidentally, long before there were drug companies, there was holistic medicine which had been well proven as efficacious in several different ancient cultures.
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Old 02-04-2012, 02:05 PM
 
Location: In a house
13,253 posts, read 37,848,758 times
Reputation: 20198
The FAA investigated complaints that came in by only a few individuals that aspartame had impaired their vision and caused dizziness. They hired a contract research firm to run studies and came to the conclusion that *there is no evidence* of result any different from a placebo.

The FAA has never forbidden pilots from drinking soda containing aspartame. That is an urban legend, that was begun by someone named Nancy Markle, back in the 1970's.

I'm guessing there's probably some regulation in the FAA forbidding pilots from mainlining aspartame into their veins. There are FAA regulations about all kinds of odd things, because stupid people will, given a loose enough leash, do stupid things.

So um, yeah. Don't inject yourself with aspartame, mmkay? Mainlining aspartame is bad for you. But feel free to have an occasional sip of diet whatever, if it floats your boat.
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Old 02-04-2012, 10:38 PM
 
Location: Georgia, USA
25,201 posts, read 30,070,230 times
Reputation: 31332
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnonChick View Post
The FAA investigated complaints that came in by only a few individuals that aspartame had impaired their vision and caused dizziness. They hired a contract research firm to run studies and came to the conclusion that *there is no evidence* of result any different from a placebo.

The FAA has never forbidden pilots from drinking soda containing aspartame. That is an urban legend, that was begun by someone named Nancy Markle, back in the 1970's.

I'm guessing there's probably some regulation in the FAA forbidding pilots from mainlining aspartame into their veins. There are FAA regulations about all kinds of odd things, because stupid people will, given a loose enough leash, do stupid things.

So um, yeah. Don't inject yourself with aspartame, mmkay? Mainlining aspartame is bad for you. But feel free to have an occasional sip of diet whatever, if it floats your boat.
Aspartame's OK for pilots. Ethanol is not.

Effects of acute aspartame and acute... [Aviat Space Environ Med. 1991] - PubMed - NCBI

"Results were found to be consistent with prior flight-simulator studies of alcohol, but do not appear to support the concerns expressed in anecdotal testimony regarding the deleterious effects of aspartame upon cognitive performance."

Effects of alcohol and chronic aspar... [Aviat Space Environ Med. 1994] - PubMed - NCBI

"No detectable cognitive performance decrements were associated with the aspartame condition. However, the alcohol results exhibited a pattern of asymmetric lateral brain impairment that closely resembles that observed in studies of depressive patients."
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Old 02-05-2012, 05:58 AM
 
Location: Earth Wanderer, longing for the stars.
12,408 posts, read 16,930,228 times
Reputation: 8800
I believe that you really have to know yourself and how you react to these things. I drink diet soda, but maybe a can or two a week. I use Saccharin in my tea. From what I last heard, those saccharin tests that destroyed the rats were feeding the animals amounts of saccharin that were almost impossible to consume on a daily basis.

Any sugar substitute ending in 'ol', however, really gives me gas and a very severe stomach upset.

Not everyone reacts the same way to the same substances.

I found Stevia not to taste very good, personally, but if that's all you have, perhaps you can get acclimated to it.

I tend to agree that sugar is a much bigger threat to American health than sugar substitutes, and because they are different from each other chemically, it might be best to just vary your intake among them if you have these concerns.

Sure, an individual can have problems with certain foods. You should know yourself and the fact that what you react to in a negative manner may not be the same for other individuals.

Last edited by goldengrain; 02-05-2012 at 06:20 AM..
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Old 02-09-2012, 01:21 PM
 
9 posts, read 11,563 times
Reputation: 18
Chemistry guy said:

Soda in general is bad for you. For the most part, any liquid that can be stored at room temperature without spoiling is going to contain something that you don't want in your body. Most sodas contain a preservative such as sodium benzoate, which is a lot more dangerous to your body than aspartame. The bacteria that could grow in the absence of preservatives are potentially more toxic still, so preservatives are allowed. Soda is also very acidic to retard bacterial growth, which has a host of health effects as well.


Sooooo.....what about water? Can't water be stored at room temp without spoiling? Should I not be putting that in my body?

The fact of the matter is that people react in different ways to different substances just like some people have allergies and some don't no matter how many studies have been done......
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Old 02-09-2012, 02:55 PM
 
Location: In a house
13,253 posts, read 37,848,758 times
Reputation: 20198
Quote:
Originally Posted by kiowa_58d View Post
Chemistry guy said:

Soda in general is bad for you. For the most part, any liquid that can be stored at room temperature without spoiling is going to contain something that you don't want in your body. Most sodas contain a preservative such as sodium benzoate, which is a lot more dangerous to your body than aspartame. The bacteria that could grow in the absence of preservatives are potentially more toxic still, so preservatives are allowed. Soda is also very acidic to retard bacterial growth, which has a host of health effects as well.


Sooooo.....what about water? Can't water be stored at room temp without spoiling? Should I not be putting that in my body?

The fact of the matter is that people react in different ways to different substances just like some people have allergies and some don't no matter how many studies have been done......
I'm pretty sure chemistry guy misspoke as a result of forgetting that water doesn't need to be preserved or refrigerated and won't spoil.

However, the point still stands: being allergic doesn't make a substance dangerous for everyone. It makes it dangerous only for the person who's allergic to it. Aspartame is no different than wool or peanuts, in that regard. I don't *knowingly* consume foods containing aspartame, because I prefer actual sugar, or honey, or maple syrup for my sweeteners. But it doesn't make me sick when I do consume it and in fact, my daily chewable multivitamin is sweetened with aspartame and it doesn't bother my body a bit.

On the other hand, wool makes me itch and I think I might be allergic to the black dye in my new pair of jeans. Does that mean wool and black dye should be taken off the market, or come with a warning that it is dangerous?
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Old 02-10-2012, 07:52 AM
 
15,682 posts, read 32,413,392 times
Reputation: 19560
Everyone reacts differently, and also reactions to aspartame can be dose-related.

My husband cannot tolerate (nor can I) He gets a serious migraine headache EVERY SINGLE TIME he drinks a diet soda with aspartame. He goes off them for awhile then starts thinking it will be OK because he hasn't had a headache, then he drinks one and BOOM!

So for many it IS a serious poison. For others, maybe it's not an issue. I personally try to stick to all natural foods and beverages. And I avoid all sodas, mostly drink water, decaf coffee/tea and herbal tea. I get reactions to many food additives so I have to be careful.
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Old 02-10-2012, 10:43 AM
 
Location: Bucks, UK
523 posts, read 3,508,156 times
Reputation: 1154
it might be worth remembering (again) that taking the time to explain the principles of properly conducted scientific research, and translating the results of such research into an understandable and digestible format for non-scientists, neither means they will be understood nor digested.

some people just have intellectual dysfunction.

better to save your efforts.

it seems to go over many people's heads that positions held based on good levels of peer reviewed evidence and the body of scientific data are very, very, different from opinions held because of personal belief, prejudice, anecdote and speculation. it is a gross fallacy to assume both are equally valid positions in scientific debate.
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