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Old 12-20-2010, 08:57 AM
 
Location: Victoria TX
42,554 posts, read 86,968,624 times
Reputation: 36644

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Listener2307 View Post
What utter crap.
You would have no way of knowing this, since you have been a contributing member of city-data for only 19 minutes. But this is the history forum, and traditionally, we try to back up our statements with a bit more explanation and authentication than that.
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Old 12-20-2010, 09:40 AM
 
Location: West Virginia
16,672 posts, read 15,668,595 times
Reputation: 10922
Some things that happen are NOT a result of a conspiracy. There were way too many cell phone calls from that airplane for it to have been shot out of the sky by a missile. Too many passengers told too many people that they were taking control of the airplane too far ahead of time for conspiracy theories to make sense.
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Old 12-20-2010, 09:47 AM
 
Location: Victoria TX
42,554 posts, read 86,968,624 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mensaguy View Post
Some things that happen are NOT a result of a conspiracy. There were way too many cell phone calls from that airplane for it to have been shot out of the sky by a missile. Too many passengers told too many people that they were taking control of the airplane too far ahead of time for conspiracy theories to make sense.
There is no solid evidence that there were ANY cellphone calls from that plane from any passengers. Only two cell phone calls can be verified, and only those two, both from crew, were referenced in the FBI 2006 report. . Many unverifiable statements from people alleging that they received calls. It would have been easy to persuade family members to say they received such calls, given the enthusiasm already shown in this thread for Americans, including participants in this very history forum, to desire that such a story gain traction. Americans were so desperate that day for heroics, they would have bought it at any price.

Last edited by jtur88; 12-20-2010 at 10:01 AM..
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Old 12-20-2010, 09:54 AM
 
14,780 posts, read 43,687,668 times
Reputation: 14622
The problem with this "theory" is that why wouldn't the government own up to it. There have been mutliple statements made by people from Bush and Cheney to Rice and Rumsfeld that the order had been given and confirmed that if the plane continued to fail to repsond they would have ordered it shot down.

Additionally, they have interviewed the pilot who was the closest to the plane and revealed that the plane was only armed with limited machine gun ammo and no missiles. He would have had to ram the jet to bring it down and has stated that he was prepared to do so.

Since the government and people in charge on that day freely admit they would have ordered the plane brought down and the pilot admits he would have done it if ordered, why cover up what actually happened? This theory is predicated on the government wanting to hide the fact that they shot down a civilian airliner, however, they openly admit they would have if they had to. What's the point of a cover up?
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Old 12-20-2010, 10:14 AM
 
Location: Las Flores, Orange County, CA
26,329 posts, read 93,755,036 times
Reputation: 17831
Quote:
Originally Posted by NJGOAT View Post
The problem with this "theory" is that why wouldn't the government own up to it. There have been mutliple statements made by people from Bush and Cheney to Rice and Rumsfeld that the order had been given and confirmed that if the plane continued to fail to repsond they would have ordered it shot down.

Additionally, they have interviewed the pilot who was the closest to the plane and revealed that the plane was only armed with limited machine gun ammo and no missiles. He would have had to ram the jet to bring it down and has stated that he was prepared to do so.

Since the government and people in charge on that day freely admit they would have ordered the plane brought down and the pilot admits he would have done it if ordered, why cover up what actually happened? This theory is predicated on the government wanting to hide the fact that they shot down a civilian airliner, however, they openly admit they would have if they had to. What's the point of a cover up?
If it happened they might not want to deal with the legal (lawsuits) problems.
Saying now that they would have shot it down isn't the same as saying then that they did shoot it down. They've had time to see the big picture. Back then it was shoot first, lie, and see what happens.
If the plane was shot down, the government may have lied because it didn't have time to realize telling the truth may have been harmless (if it was harmless - see above). In hindsight the government may have told the truth but things were changing so fast they may have erred on the side of caution.
Future shoot downs are authorized perhaps because the legal scenerios have been worked out (the government may have given itself the immunity it may not have had in 2001).
Announcing acceptability of future shoot downs might deter terrorists. If they know they'd get shot down before they accomplish their mission, they might think it is worth it even if it results in the destruction of a commercial jet (but not a target like the white house).

So, to answer the original poster's question, sure it is possible. Anything is possible. And all the scenarios mentioned are reasonable.

Wasn't there an incident in WWII that resulted in allied bombers knowingly bombing an allied ship (or a German ship with allied prisoners on it) because to not do so would have confirmed to the Germans that the Allies had cracked the German code? (Or something like that?) The allies had to shoot their own guys otherwise the Germans would have known their code was broken. I forgot the details - some History Channel thing I saw.

Last edited by Charles; 12-20-2010 at 10:22 AM..
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Old 12-20-2010, 03:03 PM
 
Location: Victoria TX
42,554 posts, read 86,968,624 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Charles View Post
If it happened they might not want to deal with the legal (lawsuits) problems.
And now we see the real 800-pound gorilla, who is sitting in every room in which decisions are made in America.
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Old 12-20-2010, 05:42 PM
 
31,387 posts, read 37,045,063 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steel7 View Post
Is it possible that united flight 93 was shot down by american jets in penna on 9/11 ?
No.

Since Bush hasn't denied that he ordered the shooting down of any hijacked airliners, why would the government lie about failing to do that which it publicly stated it intended to do?
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Old 12-21-2010, 10:34 AM
 
Location: Savannah GA/Lk Hopatcong NJ
13,404 posts, read 28,726,919 times
Reputation: 12067
Quote:
Originally Posted by jtur88 View Post
America's entire official history seems to be a concoction of Pastor Weems feel-good stories that people like much better.

How about "Five million well-trained and fully-equipped Al Qaida troops were lying just offshore in landing craft, ready to occupy America and make all our wimmenfolk cover their faces and speak Arabic, but they were stopped in the kick of time by our brave troops in Iraq who defended our freedom.

How about "There was nothing suspicious about the crash of Senator Paul Wellstone's plane (who voted against all MidEast wars), and it does not warrant further investigation."
Hey I'm entitled to my opinion just as you are and in this instance I say let sleeping dogs lie
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Old 12-21-2010, 10:35 AM
 
Location: Savannah GA/Lk Hopatcong NJ
13,404 posts, read 28,726,919 times
Reputation: 12067
Quote:
Originally Posted by Charles View Post
No way.



Keep it a secret just to make the families feel better? Are you serious?

You're advocating a government cover up?

We're pi radians out of phase on this one.
Yes in this one instance I say let sleeping dogs lie...what's the point at this point
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Old 12-21-2010, 10:38 AM
 
Location: Las Flores, Orange County, CA
26,329 posts, read 93,755,036 times
Reputation: 17831
Quote:
Originally Posted by njkate View Post
Yes in this one instance I say let sleeping dogs lie...what's the point at this point
My original response was based on the government's handling of this at the time it happened: to keep it secret or not.


Then, as well as now, I would prefer for it not to be kept a secret unless it's release would cause me (the US) harm - which I don't think is the case as are military secrets for example.
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