Ancient Greek Texts and Muslim Golden Age ??'s (Roman, Egypt, Europeans)

[Six Foot Three]

I watched an three hour documentary over the weekend about the ''Muslim Golden Age'' (750's - 1250's) to which they discovered and transcribed all the ancient greek works e.g. Socrates, Plato, Aristotle, Hippocrates etc. on their new creation ''paper'' in which europeans would later discover and help foster in the ''Renassance'' during the middle ages.

So where did the muslims find these hidden ancient works that even the early middle age europeans had no knowledge about? Is it possible that Alexander the Great and the subsequent greek Seleucid Empire (312 b.c. - 63 b.c.) brought those works with them out to babylon etc. to which the muslims would eventually discover in that territory? Possibly somewhere in Anatolia when the Seljuk Turks conquered it from the greek Byzantines in the early 1100's?

Anyway it was really surprising to find out that they and not europeans had saved all those ancient greek works although i thought that the byzantines had done so as well.

[Randomstudent]

Originally Posted by 6 Foot 3

I watched an three hour documentary over the weekend about the ''Muslim Golden Age'' (750's - 1250's) to which they discovered and transcribed all the ancient greek works e.g. Socrates, Plato, Aristotle, Hippocrates etc. on their new creation ''paper'' in which europeans would later discover and help foster in the ''Renassance'' during the middle ages.

So where did the muslims find these hidden ancient works that even the early middle age europeans had no knowledge about? Is it possible that Alexander the Great and the subsequent greek Seleucid Empire (312 b.c. - 63 b.c.) brought those works with them out to babylon etc. to which the muslims would eventually discover in that territory? Possibly somewhere in Anatolia when the Seljuk Turks conquered it from the greek Byzantines in the early 1100's?

Anyway it was really surprising to find out that they and not europeans had saved all those ancient greek works although i thought that the byzantines had done so as well.

The Muslims conquered Egypt, which was a center of Greek and Roman learning, early on and Muslim scholars were interested in it. It is not as though the Christians did not have access to these things, but rather early Christian philosphers like St. Augustine had said that Greek and Roman learning was unimportant relative to spiritual matters and possibly dangerous. As a result a fair amount of classical work was learning was ignored, and rising illiteracy rates in Europe likely did not help the problem. It wasn't until more liberal thinkers like St. Thomas Aquinas that classical learning became important again in Europe.

[diogenes2]

6 Foot 3,

This may be the same program you saw, but last evening our local PBS station featured, Cities of Light: The Rise and Fall of Islam in Spain. It wasn't always sweetness and light under the Muslims in Spain, but there were periods of remarkable harmony between the three religions, especially under the leadership of Abdur Rahman III. Under his rule, an unusual tolerance was shown, where scholarship was encouraged and a high level of learning was attained. During that time, Jewish scholars familiar with ancient languages translated many Greek manuscripts.

Of course, all of this came apart after the death of Rahman and the various factions struggled for control of Spain. One of the best books on Islamic Spain that I have read is The Ornament of the World: How Muslims, Jews and Christians Created a Culture of Tolerance by Maria Rosa Menacol.

[Six Foot Three]

Originally Posted by Randomstudent

The Muslims conquered Egypt, which was a center of Greek and Roman learning, early on and Muslim scholars were interested in it. It is not as though the Christians did not have access to these things, but rather early Christian philosphers like St. Augustine had said that Greek and Roman learning was unimportant relative to spiritual matters and possibly dangerous. As a result a fair amount of classical work was learning was ignored, and rising illiteracy rates in Europe likely did not help the problem. It wasn't until more liberal thinkers like St. Thomas Aquinas that classical learning became important again in Europe.

Oh i should have thought about Alexandria as i can't believe i let that get by me and yeap that makes perfect sense as they were very hellenized indeed now that you brought that to my attention.

You rock Randomstudent

[Six Foot Three]

Originally Posted by diogenes2

6 Foot 3,

This may be the same program you saw, but last evening our local PBS station featured, Cities of Light: The Rise and Fall of Islam in Spain. It wasn't always sweetness and light under the Muslims in Spain, but there were periods of remarkable harmony between the three religions, especially under the leadership of Abdur Rahman III. Under his rule, an unusual tolerance was shown, where scholarship was encouraged and a high level of learning was attained. During that time, Jewish scholars familiar with ancient languages translated many Greek manuscripts.

Of course, all of this came apart after the death of Rahman and the various factions struggled for control of Spain. One of the best books on Islamic Spain that I have read is The Ornament of the World: How Muslims, Jews and Christians Created a Culture of Tolerance by Maria Rosa Menacol.

I don't recall the exact name of the show as it was a three part (three hour) show and yes they did mention the iberian muslim founding city of Cordoba and how it was the most advanced city in western europe during the dark ages (something i also reciently learned) although it didn't mention about the jews there transcribing the greek ancient manuscripts and so i appreciate the info from your posting Diogenes2

[David Alleyne]

Here's the one that I enjoyed: When the Moors Ruled in Europe.

I found it all interesting too, especially how it has been omitted for so long.

[Six Foot Three]

Originally Posted by David Alleyne

Here's the one that I enjoyed: When the Moors Ruled in Europe.

I found it all interesting too, especially how it has been omitted for so long.

Thanks for the posted link David as i'll check it out later on today.

Anyway that was a really good show that diogene's reported ''Cities of Light, Rise and Fall of Islam'' that i watched on youtube as i now understand that they transcribed the ancient Greek works with their interactions with Byzantine scholars and ambassadors during the 8th and 9th centuries and preserved them for Western Europe when the christians conquered the peninsula later during the 14th and 15th centuries. I now have my question answered and thanks again to those who posted!

Sidenote observation: How odd that when muslim Spain (Al-Andulas) was finally conquered and united by king Ferdinand and queen Isabella that it would usher in (IMO) the Spanish ''dark ages'' over the coming centuries.