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Old 07-17-2012, 08:08 PM
 
Location: Texas
1,767 posts, read 2,339,795 times
Reputation: 634

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Quote:
Originally Posted by sailordave View Post



They do so in the hopes of preventing history from repeating itself.

Many deniers are actually racist who sympathize with the Nazi's plan and wish they had not stopped. Some are not only proud of what they did during WW2, some restarted the ethnic cleansing as recently as the 1990s in the former Yugoslavia. The people there weren't content with gassing or shooting their victims, they also had knives strapped to their wrist to make it easier to slash the prisoners' throats. Even the Nazis said they were vicious.


The irony is... TPTB who try to control thought and opinion via repression will be responsible for history repeating itself.
And it very well could begin in Serbia's Holy of Holies [Kosovo.]


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Old 07-17-2012, 08:41 PM
 
Location: Native Floridian, USA
5,297 posts, read 7,579,732 times
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I guess I missed something....what is TPTB ?
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Old 07-17-2012, 09:00 PM
 
Location: Texas
1,767 posts, read 2,339,795 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AnnieA View Post


I guess I missed something....what is TPTB ?

TPTB = The Powers That Be


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Old 07-18-2012, 09:08 AM
 
Location: Texas
632 posts, read 1,175,653 times
Reputation: 694
Quote:
Originally Posted by LakeShoreSoxGo View Post
Sounds like he was just a pawn following orders. A bunch of hoopla gets raised over small fries, but we welcomed Von Braun and all these other guys to work for NASA with open arms. Albert Speer toured the US selling his autobiography. Senator McCarthy spearheaded the release of those responsible for the Malmedy Massacre.
This is something that has frustrated me about our education system (even up to the college level). I feel so naive in believing that the Allied Forces were there to do good and could not have stooped to the level of their Nazi enemies.

Boy was I wrong! Rape of Nanking to the bombing of Dresden, its no wonder people in other countries hate the West or England/US considering how we pick and choose wars, commit atrocities but look the other way, etc etc

Correct me if I'm wrong but, didn't Stalin kill Jews and just about anyone he felt like? I'm sure he killed more people than Hitler ever deported.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ovcatto View Post
Pawns are piece on a chess board, men are not. Men have free will and are individually responsible for the decision that they make.
Not when you have a gun to your head or are ordered by the state to do something. Are you telling me that if the government put a gun to your head and said we will kill your family members if you don't do XYZ, you will refuse?

Not all Nazi's were die-hard believers and even some high-ranking officials broke their own rules (e.g. Himmler saving some of his friends that were Jewish or had Jewish ancestry, Hitler covering for his mother's favorite doctor who happened to be Jewish)

Quote:
Originally Posted by king's highway View Post
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When does it end?

Offspring of holocaust victims can now be considered holocaust victims themselves...
so that may open up a can of worms for Nazi offspring.
Good question! What does the Simon Wiesenthal Center do when all the Nazi's are dead, go after their offspring because they have Nazi blood?
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Old 07-18-2012, 09:37 AM
 
Location: Cardboard box
1,909 posts, read 3,766,859 times
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The funny thing is it is not Holocaust deniers who have re-wrote history, it is the opposite.

If you actually study the Holocaust you will see it was quite a political process.

For example 99% of Jews from Denmark survived the war. The Germans literally allowed them to all leave to Sweden. In France 75% of the Jews survived the war. In Germany and Poland Jews were sent to the camps. In the USSR Jews met their fates at the hands of Einzatsgruppen.

The Holocaust was not some uniform action where they got all the names on a list and put everyone on the trains, like they tell you in school. It was way more complicated than that.

But you point this out you are a "denier".
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Old 07-18-2012, 09:53 AM
 
Location: Brooklyn
40,049 posts, read 34,475,681 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LakeShoreSoxGo View Post
Sounds like he was just a pawn following orders.
That's what they all say when they're suddenly facing retribution, isn't it?

Also, just for the record, you don't think higher-ups like Hitler or Goebbels would have escaped trial and sentencing, do you? They just didn't happen to be alive at the time. (Goering was captured alive and put on trial, but managed to sneak a cyanide capsule into his cell in a particularly gross manner, and avoided being hanged).
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Old 07-18-2012, 03:08 PM
 
Location: Texas
1,767 posts, read 2,339,795 times
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.


Repeating history... or history in the making ?

//www.city-data.com/forum/polit...-bulgaria.html



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Old 07-18-2012, 03:52 PM
 
Location: On the Chesapeake
44,905 posts, read 59,894,528 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fred314X View Post
That's what they all say when they're suddenly facing retribution, isn't it?

Also, just for the record, you don't think higher-ups like Hitler or Goebbels would have escaped trial and sentencing, do you? They just didn't happen to be alive at the time. (Goering was captured alive and put on trial, but managed to sneak a cyanide capsule into his cell in a particularly gross manner, and avoided being hanged).

What gross manner? The accounts I've seen is that the capsule was secreted in his Meerschaum pipe. Himmler's was in a hollow tooth.

Going back a bit: Speer recanted, begged forgiveness and was spared execution, although he did serve 20 years at Spandau. Goering was defiant, Hess was, well he was Hess, Ribbentrop went to pieces as did Keitel. The rest ran the gamut. Eichmann remained defiant at his trial, actually proud of his part.
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Old 07-18-2012, 04:25 PM
 
Location: Texas
632 posts, read 1,175,653 times
Reputation: 694
Quote:
Originally Posted by RedRage View Post
This is something that has frustrated me about our education system (even up to the college level). I feel so naive in believing that the Allied Forces were there to do good and could not have stooped to the level of their Nazi enemies.

Boy was I wrong (e.g. Bombing of Dresden)! Its no wonder people in other countries hate the West or England/US considering how we pick and choose wars, commit atrocities but look the other way, etc etc

Correct me if I'm wrong but, didn't Stalin kill Jews and just about anyone he felt like? I'm sure he killed more people than Hitler ever deported.



Not when you have a gun to your head or are ordered by the state to do something. Are you telling me that if the government put a gun to your head and said we will kill your family members if you don't do XYZ, you will refuse?

Not all Nazi's were die-hard believers and even some high-ranking officials broke their own rules (e.g. Himmler saving some of his friends that were Jewish or had Jewish ancestry, Hitler covering for his mother's favorite doctor who happened to be Jewish)



Good question! What does the Simon Wiesenthal Center do when all the Nazi's are dead, go after their offspring because they have Nazi blood?

Made a correction
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Old 07-18-2012, 05:36 PM
 
31,387 posts, read 36,906,291 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RedRage View Post
Not when you have a gun to your head or are ordered by the state to do something. Are you telling me that if the government put a gun to your head and said we will kill your family members if you don't do XYZ, you will refuse?s
Oh puleeeze! No one put a gun to the head of the shiite bags who joined the Einsatzgruppen, a bottle maybe but no guns. Even in the cases where they lost their taste for murdering Jews they were just transferred to other duties. All of these folks were die hard anti-semites.

Quote:
Not all Nazi's were die-hard believers and even some high-ranking officials broke their own rules (e.g. Himmler saving some of his friends that were Jewish or had Jewish ancestry, Hitler covering for his mother's favorite doctor who happened to be Jewish)
Oh, puleeeze 2.0. Saving a "Jewish friend" here and there doesn't change the fact that they were all virulent anti-semites and genocidal maniacs.

Quote:
Good question! What does the Simon Wiesenthal Center do when all the Nazi's are dead, go after their offspring because they have Nazi blood?
Judging from the nonsense that comes from neo-Nazis, Holocaust deniers and other types of apologist 70 years after the fact, the Wiesenthal Center will have plenty of work to do long after the last original pact of Nazis are long gone.
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