Why Baltic states hate Stalin/Soviets, but consider nazis heroes? (WW2, war)

[russiaonline]

A spin off from another thread:

Even in Latvia? In partly fascist Latvia? [during WW2]

What about posting some numbers - real ones? Like that:

Ð*яды жертв репрессий в Латвии множатся - Известия

The real numbers are very different from what your politicians and "historians" tell you.

Now compare them with these numbers:

Латвия в годы Великой Отечественной войны — Википедия

During the German occupation of Latvia its population declined by 400,000 (20%).
313 798 Soviet citizens (including 39 835 children) and 330,000 imprisoned Soviet soldiers were killed.
279 615 people were taken to Germany for forced labor.
Germans destroyed most of the economy.

And now you (Latvians) spill tons of poison on Stalin, and hail SS scum as heroes... How can you explain this?

[Kiss Kiss Bang Bang]

Considering the fact that there are probably more skinheads in Russia than entire population of Latvia it is weird that you call us a fascist country.
And those Latvian SS soldiers were fighting exclusively on the battlefront, so they deserve some remembrance. Even in Nuremberg they were justified and actually served as prison guards for nazi war criminals.

[russiaonline]

Originally Posted by Kiss Kiss Bang Bang

Considering the fact that there are probably more skinheads in Russia than entire population of Latvia it is weird that you call us a fascist country.

During WW2 many in Latvia supported nazism. Today things are even worse - after everything nazis did to you.

In Russia today neonazis comprise about 0,03% of the population, so don't BS. Or you confuse nationalists with nazis?

And those Latvian SS soldiers were fighting exclusively on the battlefront, so they deserve some remembrance.

That's exactly what I mean - Latvia was devastated by Germany, yet you now consider them saviors. Where is logic?

[texdav]

Both Hilter and Stalin wre mass murders the death toll fro both show.Both wre socialist central control leader much alike which is why they were such enemies.

[Kiss Kiss Bang Bang]

Originally Posted by russiaonline

During WW2 many in Latvia supported nazism. Today things are even worse - after everything nazis did to you.

In Russia today neonazis comprise about 0,03% of the population, so don't BS. Or you confuse nationalists with nazis?


That's exactly what I mean - Latvia was devastated by Germany, yet you now consider them saviors. Where is logic?

Not that many people actually supported nazism. Probably not more than in Russia. But I admit that many supported the fact that germans kicked bolsheviks out of Latvia. NKVD behaved here very nastily and any power that kicked their butts were seen as liberators. And no one actually praises nazism as ideology here. It is very simple - your enemy's enemy is your friend.

[russiaonline]

Originally Posted by Kiss Kiss Bang Bang

But I admit that many supported the fact that germans kicked bolsheviks out of Latvia. NKVD behaved here very nastily and any power that kicked their butts were seen as liberators.

They only arrested nazis and their supporters. Compare that with what Germans (and domestic nazis) did.

And no one actually praises nazism as ideology here. It is very simple - your enemy's enemy is your friend.

Nazis devastated Latvia reeeeally hard. Russians rebuilt it. You hail nazis, and curse Russians. Why?

I'm really puzzled. And I'm no less puzzled by the fact that Latvians can't answer this simple question.

[russiaonline]

Originally Posted by texdav

Both Hilter and Stalin wre mass murders the death toll fro both show.Both wre socialist central control leader much alike which is why they were such enemies.

You've missed the thread - comparison of them is here:
Who was worse/scarier: Stalin or Hitler

[RememberMee]

Most of the modern ethnic Lithuanians, Latvian and Estonians who are populating Baltic states hate/dislike/indifferent to USSR and Russia in particular (including Stalin, Gorbachev and Putin). Keep in mind that whopping 30%+ of population of the Baltic States are ethnic Russians, Ukrainians etc. who, as a rule, don't share Baltic ethnic sentiments, except for the younger euro centric generations who think with their wallets and willing to accept any view that promises better opportunitie$.

Naturally, Germans (enemy of USSR and Russia) are "friends" of the modern Baltic folks who hate Russia. It's natural to like or to be neutral to Germany (and Hitler). Keep in mind that ethnic Baltic folks have huge amount of German blood flowing in their veins. "German" (there was no Germany at the time, so I use this term very broadly) Teutonic knights exterminated many indigenous tribes (including the Baltic tribe with the name of Prussians) to establish Livonia order in 13th century. Actually, many crusaders instead of Palestine went on the crusade against Baltic savages. And what a crusade that was. Extermination + Cultural/Linguistic/Genetic insemination = modern Baltic ethnic groups. Actually, if not for the "Russians" (also a broad term reflecting medieval and post medieval realities) who stopped and reversed medieval German/Catholic expansion there would be no Lithuanians, Latvians or Estonians today.

Keep in mind that Hitler' Germany didn't designate Baltic folks as :Untermensch" to be exterminated. Baltic folks were considered as Volksdeutsche — "German in terms of people/folk". Hitler's victory wasn't a survival threat to either of 3 ethnic groups, quite to the contrary. It was a mortal threat to the Russians.

Of course, later day Russian Empire and USSR didn't really like ethnic or cultural "diversity" within their borders. In accordance with the nation state paradigm (identical to the one that Latvians, Estonians and Lithuanians savagely apply to their ethnic & linguistic minorities today) they wanted homogeneous culture, language & aspirations within their borders. Both Russian Empire and USSR applied assimilation pressure to the Baltic.

Yet, paradoxically, because of the "paternalistic", semi-isolated (from global "integration") and traditionalist (i.e. not 100% market driven) nature of the Russian Empire and USSR, Baltic identity was protected and preserved within Russian and Soviet borders as never before or after. It was golden age of the Baltic ethnic identity, the very same identity & culture that simply disintegrates under the pressure of the global capitalism. These "peculiarities" of the Russian/Soviet state over-weighed very real and murderous repressions immediately before and after WWII. Baltic nationalists just don't dare to admit the obvious.

[firefly_tranquility]

Forced Russification does that....plus deporting a large percent of their populations to gulags kinda makes you hate people..

[Kiss Kiss Bang Bang]

These two videos pretty much sums up my thoughts about Stalin.

О Сталине после реставрации метро «Курская» - YouTube

Познер о Сталине - YouTube