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Old 02-26-2013, 11:12 PM
 
66 posts, read 81,663 times
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If he were in a university in Germany or Austria NOW? Could he do? And what would the responses be to that? Just curious.

 
Old 02-27-2013, 06:43 AM
 
Location: Southern New Hampshire
10,048 posts, read 18,079,840 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Global View Post
If he were in a university in Germany or Austria NOW? Could he do? And what would the responses be to that? Just curious.
The Holocaust is a historical fact according to all reputable historians. So why would anyone try to do this unless they had some anti-Semitic agenda?

Holocaust deniers are lunatics. (There's no nice way to say that.)

Also, why do we need another thread on this? There was one recently that was just as idiotic.
 
Old 02-27-2013, 07:35 AM
 
14,780 posts, read 43,702,592 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Global View Post
If he were in a university in Germany or Austria NOW? Could he do? And what would the responses be to that? Just curious.
One is allowed to conduct Holocaust research in those nations, but any conclusions obviously require extensive academic proof. Setting out to disprove a widely known and verifiable fact would require such overwhelming evidence as to be nearly impossible to do. If one was to doggedly pursue the topic of denial and publish papers denying that it happened without said proof, then they would be risking prosecution, as a few individuals have. There are several researchers who have sought to examine the true scope of the Holocaust in terms of numbers and methods. While their work has been contrary to the general understanding, it was considered academically acceptable, even if it was strongly countered by other academics.
 
Old 02-27-2013, 08:05 AM
 
Location: Parts Unknown, Northern California
48,564 posts, read 24,133,502 times
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Such research will always be accompanied by deep suspicions about the motives involved.

In the same manner that religious interests only seem to have a problem with those scientific doctrines which debunk long held religious assertions, histological massacre deniers only seem to have a problem with the Holocaust.

The fundamentalists never attack the theory of black holes or the accuracy of the estimates of distance to stars or the Doppler Affect, only evolution. And the genocide deniers never show any interest in proving that the Armenian massacre or the American Indian extermination never happened, only the Holocaust.

Because of this, as noted, it is extremely difficult to grant credibility to those who claim that their only interest in researching the Holocaust is historical truth. Because there are so many obviously agenda driven Holocaust "researchers", anyone making that claim is going to have to be held to extremely high standards of academic fairness, and if that person should happen to be a member of some ethnic group, nationality or political organization which has been traditionally hostile toward Jews, it will be impossible to conclude that this is nothing more than a love of academic integrity and historical truth at work.
 
Old 02-27-2013, 08:15 AM
 
66 posts, read 81,663 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by karen_in_nh_2012 View Post
Holocaust deniers are lunatics.
Relax Karen. Why are you angry? Did there anyone mistakenly step on your tail?

Quote:
why do we need another thread on this? There was one recently that was just as idiotic
Didn't see it?
 
Old 02-27-2013, 08:16 AM
 
Location: Free From The Oppressive State
30,261 posts, read 23,746,924 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Global View Post
If he were in a university in Germany or Austria NOW? Could he do? And what would the responses be to that? Just curious.
Only if he never wanted to be taken seriously ever again in his entire life. About anything.
 
Old 02-27-2013, 08:21 AM
 
66 posts, read 81,663 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NJGOAT View Post
One is allowed to conduct Holocaust research in those nations
Sound great.
Quote:
If one was to doggedly pursue the topic of denial and publish papers denying that it happened without said proof, then they would be risking prosecution, as a few individuals have.
Why it's not the same case if he denied any other historical facts?
 
Old 02-27-2013, 08:29 AM
 
66 posts, read 81,663 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grandstander View Post
Such research will always be accompanied by deep suspicions about the motives involved.

In the same manner that religious interests only seem to have a problem with those scientific doctrines which debunk long held religious assertions, histological massacre deniers only seem to have a problem with the Holocaust.
I can't agree more.

Quote:
The fundamentalists never attack the theory of black holes or the accuracy of the estimates of distance to stars or the Doppler Affect, only evolution
But we've never heard of anyone who's being jailed because of his denial of evolution.
 
Old 02-27-2013, 08:30 AM
 
Location: Victoria TX
42,554 posts, read 87,003,003 times
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Salient to the specific question, it is my understanding that in Germany, it is illegal to even publicly state the opinion that further research could shed some doubt on the legitimacy or authenticity of the data that is currently held to be absolute.

That the earth was the center of the universe was once a "widely known and verifiable fact", and deniers were put to death, without even being given the benefit of the doubt by merely being called lunatics. Not to mention the "widely known and verifiable fact" that Saddam Hussein had weapons of mass destruction. That there is no God but Allah and Muhammed is his prophet is a widely known and verifiable fact.

Criminalizing doubt is hardly an avenue to enlightenment.
 
Old 02-27-2013, 08:37 AM
 
Location: Parts Unknown, Northern California
48,564 posts, read 24,133,502 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Global View Post

But we've never heard of anyone who's being jailed because of his denial of evolution.
Is that your only concern here? Academic freedom?

You have no sort of grudge of any kind against Jews? Are you a supporter of Israel or an enemy of Israel?

Establish first that you are neutral and interested only in an academic approach, and perhaps you might command some credibility.
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