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Frankly, I am unable to name "a most important battle". After all, western history covers a lot of years. One would have to consider the ancient battles involving the Romans and their various enemies, and the Greeks and their various enemies, then proceed on up through history to such things as William the Conqueror in 1066 (a battle whose results gave us the English language more or less in its present form), and on and on though the years.
Also, how are we going to define "important"? By the numbers of combattants involved? By the numbers of combattants killed? By the end results of the battle on subsequent human history and culture? By the "turning-point" effect within the particular major war in which the battle occurred?
I would venture this: No battle since World War II would qualify, even given the ambiguity of the criteria. And to go out on a limb, I think a case can be made for looking to World War II for our most important battle because of the scope of that war - the scope in almost all senses: numbers of combattants, numbers of combat deaths, numbers of civilian deaths, geographical range of the fighting, scope of the destruction of civilian infrastructure.
So (even provided anyone agrees with my looking at World War II) would we look to the Pacific War or to the European War for our "most important" battle? We all know about certain massive battles which were turning points: in Europe, Stalingrad, Kursk, the invasion of Normandy. In the Pacific, Midway. Of course Midway was a naval aviation battle and the total number of participants was quite small in comparison to Stalingrad, Kursk, or the DDay invasion. So despite being a significant turning point, I eliminate Midway.
So I remain stumped. But I submit that my brief discussion is still relevant to the thread title and I will certainly be interested in other people's answers.
Battle of Yorktown, the last major battle of the Revolutionary War that brings independence to the United States. I'm not a battle expert but think there may have been greater battles in the Revolutionary War, but Yorktown works for me. France helped immensely with naval support to block Cornwallis from getting troops and supplies in from the sea, and help from France with troops and commanders such as General Rochambeau. With all France did for us to gain independence, would it have been too much to ask of Thomas Jefferson, when he was president, to trade with France and support them, rather than abolish all trade with both France and England ? I could rip on Thomas Jefferson some more but I don't want to hijack the thread.
What battle would be the most important battle for England to evolve into what it became? Battle of Hastings in 1066 ? I would also think the battles Spain had with the Moors were pretty darn important, capture of technology for Europe and getting Christopher Columbus on his way.
I have to go with the Battle of Marathon, although Im not sure its the most important, it definately is a big one for Western Civ. It was the first Greek victory over the Persians and gave the Greeks the confidence to actually take on and defeat the Persian empire, keeping its influence out of Europe.
There are several candidates for most important in "Western History". While I agree with what Escort Rider said, I do think we can look back to the time when western civilization faced near destruction. The losses of those battles would have reverberated throughout history and there might not have been a western civilization if they had been lost. So, here are my candidates...
1. Battle of Marathon, 490 BC: The Greek victory here ended the immediate threat of the first Persian invasion that would have resulted in the destruction of the Greek city-states. The victory made the Greeks realize they could beat the Persians and set the stage for future victories.
2. Battle of Salamis, 480 BC: The Greek naval victory here shattered the Persian fleet during the second Persian invasion. This "revenge" invasion led by Darius' son Xerxes was intended to completely conquer and subjugate all of the Greek city-states. The victory at Salamis forced Xerxes to withdrawal and set the stage for the Battle of Plataea and Battle of Mycale. The first featured the largest hoplite army ever assembled that decimated the army Xerxes had left behind that contained his most elite troops. The second, saw the Greek navy inflict another crippling blow to the Persian navy. The victories that started at Salamis culminated in the Greeks throwing the Persians out of Europe and ending their power in the Aegean.
A loss at either one of these battles could have seen the nucleus of what is western civilization destroyed in the cradle. The Persian Empire would have become the greatest the world had ever seen and Persian culture would have replaced western.
3. Zama, 202 BC: The legions of Scipio rout the army of Hannibal outside Carthage. The battle results in the siege and eventual sack of Carthage which wipes the Carthaginian Empire off of the map. With Rome's greatest Mediterranean rival removed, Roman hegemony is allowed to spread carrying with it Greek and Latin culture.
4. Milvian Bridge, 312 AD: Constantine defeats the armies of Maxentius to gain control of the Western Roman Empire and eventually the Eastern Roman Empire as well. Fulfilling his vision, In Hoc Signo Vinces, Constantine adopted Christianity (eventually) and established religious tolerance within the Roman Empire, including the restoration of church property. He later presided over the Council of Nicaea which laid the foundations for Christian Orthodoxy and permanently split Christianity from its Judaic roots. No Milvian Bridge and Christianity may have remained just one of many Roman religious cults. No Constantine uniting the tetrarchy and the Empire under his leadership and Rome may have fallen sooner and there may never have been a Byzantine Empire defending Christendom for a millenia.
5. Battle of Tours, 732 AD: The Frankish leader Charles Martel defeats a Muslim army under Abd er-Rahman. Muslim influence and power had spread from India to Spain and was now threatening the heart of Europe in Gaul (France). Martel's victory ended Muslim expansion and preserved western civilization from Muslim subjugation. Martel never styled himself as king, but he divided his realm between his two sons Carloman and Pepin who ruled jointly until Carloman retired to religious life. Pepin would go on to become the first Carolingian king. Upon Pepin's death his realm was divided between his younger son Carloman I and his elder son...Charlemagne. No victory at Tours and not only do the Muslims take western Europe, but there wouldn't be a Charlemagne.
So, there's my list and reasoning. I think number 1 or 2 need to be the right answer for most important. I would personally lean towards number 2 as Xerxes was on a punitive expedition to conquer and destroy Greece to avenge his father's failure. Darius' invasion was more about keeping the Greeks in line. If Xerxes had won, western civilization simply wouldn't exist, at least as anything we would recognize.
Depends on what you define as The West. Is it simply the people who live on the western end of Eurasia, or is it the philosophical approach to government and society that we define as Western Civilization? You know, democracy, rule of law, egalitarianism, the scientific method, etc. Western Civilization has been a constantly evolving thing, with many of its precepts being hammered out on the battlefield. In that sense, prior to 1500, the West was poorer than its counterparts elsewhere in the world and, in many cases, less advanced. We were in the thrall of Catholicism. Our scientific achievements were second rate compared to the Chinese and Islam. We essentially were forced to endure the Islamic monopoly over trade routes to the Orient. And we were a collection of small, immature states that devoted huge amounts of energy and resources fighting one another.
Five hundred years later, Western Civilization had grown to become the preeminent civilization on the planet, pretty much eclipsing all others. Even in societies that are not Western in the ethnic sense of the word, the Western influence is very deep and profound. Even a country such as China runs on a variation of Marxism. Elsewhere, the science, economics, and social trends of the West are pervasive. So how did we get to this point over the past 500 years? It wasn't as if India, China, and the Islamic world threw up their hands and said, "Why, Western Europe, you do indeed have the better system. We defer to your way of thinking from now on."
So while the battles NJGoat pointed out were absolutely critical, I think there's an entirely different set of conflicts that came later, shaping what the West would become as a civilization and how we shaped the world.
The Reconquista -- The final ejection of Islam from Iberia. This allowed the Spanish and, to a lesser extent, the Portuguese to turn world trade routes on their heads, leading to half a millennium of Western domination.
Siege of Vienna -- The blunting of Ottoman designs on Europe and the beginning of their expulsion from Europe.
Gravelines -- The defeat of the Spanish Armada ensured the survival of Elizabethan England, which became the standard bearer for much of how we define Western Civilization today.
Yorktown -- The beginning of the end of colonialism, as well as the beginning of self-determination. Even though colonialism really endured until well into the late 20th Century, the American Revolution began the trend that played out in the Americas, eventually spreading to Asia and Africa.
Trafalgar -- At the highwater mark of Napoleon, kept him from dominating Europe for a generation.
Antietam -- I'm going to go out on a limb to call this the critical battle of the Civil War, as opposed to Gettysburg or a half dozen other battles. Even though, militarily, it could be seen as a draw, it was really a victory for the North simply because they didn't lose, which likely prevented a rout for the Republicans in the 1862 congressional elections. I'll agree with Stephen Sears here and assert that if the South had won here, a political end to the civil war might have occurred with the North simply not having the will to fight. The long-term consequences of a divided United States are pretty obvious. Heck, the speculation over what would have happened next has fueled an entire genre of fiction, á la Harry Turtledove.
Leningrad & Stalingrad -- Even though the Soviets were certainly not its ideal representatives, where would Western Civilization be if Hitler somehow triumphed over Stalin? Sure, we could debate all day on whether the Nazis could have ultimately conquered the Soviets. But I wouldn't want to have seen the aftermath had it happened.
So while the battles NJGoat pointed out were absolutely critical, I think there's an entirely different set of conflicts that came later, shaping what the West would become as a civilization and how we shaped the world.
Good list. I have a couple of quibbles, just for discussion sake. I think your general point is right and something I struggled with when crafting my list. My perspective was that those critical foundational moments meant that the future moments were possible, hence making them better candidates for being the "most important". However, western civilization as we know it was shaped by the events you listed. I really don't think we can pick a single battle out of all of them and say that is the one that was most important. A list would be a much better approach and could easily contain 10-15 battles that shaped western civilization from its roots until today. Basically put my list and your list together, maybe add a couple in the middle and we have a pretty comprehensive group of western civilization defining battles.
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Yorktown -- The beginning of the end of colonialism, as well as the beginning of self-determination. Even though colonialism really endured until well into the late 20th Century, the American Revolution began the trend that played out in the Americas, eventually spreading to Asia and Africa.
Yorktown is a good choice as a symbolic battle. I have seen a couple of cases made for it not being the most significant though. Here are two alternates I would put up for debate:
1. Battle of Trenton, 1776 AD: This is the first real victory of American forces over the British and came on the heels of a string of disastorous defeats. While the strategic value of the victory was low, the morale boost was huge. The victory helped solidify belief in the cause and resulted in many soldiers re-upping their enlistments. Soldiers that would become absolutely critical in the days ahead.
2. Battle of Saratoga, 1777 AD: Widely regarded as the turning point of the Revolution. An American army under Gates and Arnold soundly defeat and then surround and capture General Burgoyne's entire expedition. The British lose nearly 7,500 men and have their entire campaign and master plan for the season lost and the British virtually abandoned any designs on the northern colonies. The Americans proved they could stand and fight the British as equals and the victory led France to sign the Franco-American Alliance that would bring the colonies recongition and desparately needed money, supplies, troops and ships. No Saratoga, no France and Yorktown may never have happened.
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Trafalgar -- At the highwater mark of Napoleon, kept him from dominating Europe for a generation.
This is the one I would question the most. While Trafalgar was a brilliant victory for the British in proving their naval supremacy it had virtually zero impact on the War of the Third Coalition. Within two months of Trafalgar Napoleon would maul the Austrian and Russian armies at Austerlitz. The result of that battle was the collapse of the Third Coalition and the Holy Roman Empire and the formation of Napoleon's Confederation of the Rhine. While the defeat meant that Napoleon could no longer even attempt to defeat the British on the seas he was able to establish the Continental System and the Napoleonic Wars would rage for another 10 years.
I would put up the Battle of Leipzig as the most important of the Napoleonic Wars. The Sixth Coalition with an army composed of Russia, Prussia, Austria and Sweden defeated Napoleon's Grande Armee just recently reconsituted from his disaster in Russia. The battle resulted in Napoleon losing all of his influence east of the Rhine and would culminate in the Sixth Coalition invading France and forcing Napoleon to abdicate.
Good list. I have a couple of quibbles, just for discussion sake. I think your general point is right and something I struggled with when crafting my list. My perspective was that those critical foundational moments meant that the future moments were possible, hence making them better candidates for being the "most important". However, western civilization as we know it was shaped by the events you listed. I really don't think we can pick a single battle out of all of them and say that is the one that was most important. A list would be a much better approach and could easily contain 10-15 battles that shaped western civilization from its roots until today. Basically put my list and your list together, maybe add a couple in the middle and we have a pretty comprehensive group of western civilization defining battles.
Yorktown is a good choice as a symbolic battle. I have seen a couple of cases made for it not being the most significant though. Here are two alternates I would put up for debate:
1. Battle of Trenton, 1776 AD: This is the first real victory of American forces over the British and came on the heels of a string of disastorous defeats. While the strategic value of the victory was low, the morale boost was huge. The victory helped solidify belief in the cause and resulted in many soldiers re-upping their enlistments. Soldiers that would become absolutely critical in the days ahead.
2. Battle of Saratoga, 1777 AD: Widely regarded as the turning point of the Revolution. An American army under Gates and Arnold soundly defeat and then surround and capture General Burgoyne's entire expedition. The British lose nearly 7,500 men and have their entire campaign and master plan for the season lost and the British virtually abandoned any designs on the northern colonies. The Americans proved they could stand and fight the British as equals and the victory led France to sign the Franco-American Alliance that would bring the colonies recongition and desparately needed money, supplies, troops and ships. No Saratoga, no France and Yorktown may never have happened.
This is the one I would question the most. While Trafalgar was a brilliant victory for the British in proving their naval supremacy it had virtually zero impact on the War of the Third Coalition. Within two months of Trafalgar Napoleon would maul the Austrian and Russian armies at Austerlitz. The result of that battle was the collapse of the Third Coalition and the Holy Roman Empire and the formation of Napoleon's Confederation of the Rhine. While the defeat meant that Napoleon could no longer even attempt to defeat the British on the seas he was able to establish the Continental System and the Napoleonic Wars would rage for another 10 years.
I would put up the Battle of Leipzig as the most important of the Napoleonic Wars. The Sixth Coalition with an army composed of Russia, Prussia, Austria and Sweden defeated Napoleon's Grande Armee just recently reconsituted from his disaster in Russia. The battle resulted in Napoleon losing all of his influence east of the Rhine and would culminate in the Sixth Coalition invading France and forcing Napoleon to abdicate.
NJ - completely agree about Saratoga, IMO, the most important battle of the American Revolution. Yorktown was the end result of Saratoga.
Regarding the Napoleonic Wars, I dont know if any one battle had more influence then the Russian campaign. Russia truly was too big to conquer.
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I have a couple of quibbles, just for discussion sake. I think your general point is right and something I struggled with when crafting my list. My perspective was that those critical foundational moments meant that the future moments were possible, hence making them better candidates for being the "most important". However, western civilization as we know it was shaped by the events you listed. I really don't think we can pick a single battle out of all of them and say that is the one that was most important. A list would be a much better approach and could easily contain 10-15 battles that shaped western civilization from its roots until today. Basically put my list and your list together, maybe add a couple in the middle and we have a pretty comprehensive group of western civilization defining battles.
