Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > History
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 08-15-2015, 12:13 PM
 
Location: Washinton DC
64 posts, read 81,513 times
Reputation: 49

Advertisements

"I have not become His Majesty’s first minister to preside over the dissolution of the British Empire." - Winston Churchill.

Which is exactly what he was forced to do.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 08-15-2015, 02:18 PM
 
Location: NE Mississippi
25,575 posts, read 17,286,360 times
Reputation: 37322
"This is a big f-ing deal".....Joe Biden

(If he runs for President, we'll get to hear that clip a lot)
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-15-2015, 03:05 PM
 
1,906 posts, read 2,038,831 times
Reputation: 4158
"How smooth must be the language of the whites, when they can make right look like wrong, and wrong like right."

- Chief Black Hawk
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-15-2015, 03:33 PM
 
7,578 posts, read 5,326,422 times
Reputation: 9447
To call it an understatement is far, far too kind. In my mind it was pure revisionist bs. My points of contention have been placed in bold.

TO OUR GOOD AND LOYAL SUBJECTS:

After pondering deeply the general trends of the world and the actual conditions obtaining in Our Empire today, We have decided to effect a settlement of the present situation by resorting to an extraordinary measure.

We have ordered Our Government to communicate to the Governments of the United States, Great Britain, China and the Soviet Union that Our Empire accepts the provisions of their Joint Declaration.

To strive for the common prosperity and happiness of all nations as well as the security and well-being of Our subjects is the solemn obligation which has been handed down by Our Imperial Ancestors and which lies close to Our heart.

Indeed, We declared war on America and Britain out of Our sincere desire to ensure Japan's self-preservation and the stabilization of East Asia, it being far from Our thought either to infringe upon the sovereignty of other nations or to embark upon territorial aggrandizement.

But now the war has lasted for nearly four years. Despite the best that has been done by everyone – the gallant fighting of the military and naval forces, the diligence and assiduity of Our servants of the State, and the devoted service of Our one hundred million people – the war situation has developed not necessarily to Japan's advantage, while the general trends of the world have all turned against her interest.

Moreover, the enemy has begun to employ a new and most cruel bomb, the power of which to do damage is, indeed, incalculable, taking the toll of many innocent lives. Should We continue to fight, not only would it result in an ultimate collapse and obliteration of the Japanese nation, but also it would lead to the total extinction of human civilization.

Such being the case, how are We to save the millions of Our subjects, or to atone Ourselves before the hallowed spirits of Our Imperial Ancestors? This is the reason why We have ordered the acceptance of the provisions of the Joint Declaration of the Powers.

We cannot but express the deepest sense of regret to Our Allied nations of East Asia, who have consistently cooperated with the Empire towards the emancipation of East Asia.

The thought of those officers and men as well as others who have fallen in the fields of battle, those who died at their posts of duty, or those who met with untimely death and all their bereaved families, pains Our heart night and day.

The welfare of the wounded and the war-sufferers, and of those who have lost their homes and livelihood, are the objects of Our profound solicitude.

The hardships and sufferings to which Our nation is to be subjected hereafter will be certainly great. We are keenly aware of the inmost feelings of all of you, Our subjects. However, it is according to the dictates of time and fate that We have resolved to pave the way for a grand peace for all the generations to come by enduring the unendurable and suffering what is unsufferable.

Having been able to safeguard and maintain the structure of the Imperial State, We are always with you, Our good and loyal subjects, relying upon your sincerity and integrity.

Beware most strictly of any outbursts of emotion which may engender needless complications, or any fraternal contention and strife which may create confusion, lead you astray and cause you to lose the confidence of the world.

Let the entire nation continue as one family from generation to generation, ever firm in its faith in the imperishability of its sacred land, and mindful of its heavy burden of responsibility, and of the long road before it.

Unite your total strength, to be devoted to construction for the future. Cultivate the ways of rectitude, foster nobility of spirit, and work with resolution – so that you may enhance the innate glory of the Imperial State and keep pace with the progress of the world.

(Hirohito's signature and Privy Seal)
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-15-2015, 10:22 PM
 
17,581 posts, read 13,355,792 times
Reputation: 33015
Quote:
Originally Posted by bus man View Post
Seventy years ago, at the end of World War II, Japan was facing total annihilation. Nearly every one of her major cities had been bombed into ruins; almost all of her warships had been sunk; most of her planes had been shot down; most of her army was trapped on island outposts; and her civilian population was at the brink of starvation. Emperor Hirohito finally bowed to the inevitable and threw in the towel. But how did he inform his subjects that their nation had been beaten? "The war situation has developed not necessarily to Japan's advantage."

If this doesn't rank as the single greatest understatement in all of recorded history, I don't know what does.
And, 70 years later, Japanese Prime Minister Shinzo Abe on Friday expressed "profound grief" for the millions killed in World War II and remorse for his country's participation, but said that future Japanese generations shouldn't need to keep apologizing.

Japan never acknowledged their starting the war

Last edited by mike1003; 08-15-2015 at 10:40 PM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-15-2015, 10:37 PM
 
17,581 posts, read 13,355,792 times
Reputation: 33015
"I figured it would be a real big bang. It sure was. It was surprising," said Tibbets. "I never could have estimated that it would look like it looked."

In one of my meetings with General Paul Tibbets, Commander of the 509th Composite Group and Pilot of The Enola Gay, I asked him if he ever regretted dropping the bomb? He said he never lost a nights sleep because he did his job, the war was ended and more lives were saved because an invasion of The Japanese Homeland would have resulted in hundreds of thousands, possibly millions, more deaths (Americans and Japanese.)
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-16-2015, 12:02 AM
 
Location: Maryland about 20 miles NW of DC
6,104 posts, read 5,990,747 times
Reputation: 2479
Quote:
Originally Posted by MasseyBrown View Post
"I have not become His Majesty’s first minister to preside over the dissolution of the British Empire." - Winston Churchill.

Which is exactly what he was forced to do.
Winston Churchill did not have to swallow the loss of the Indian Raj and the loss of King George VI title of Emperor of India fist given to Queen Victoria. Churchill was voted out of office in 1945 so that act fell on Prime Minister Clement Atlee who saw the freedom of India, Pakistan, Burma and Ceylon (Sri Lanka). Churchill regained power in 1951 but lost it in 1953. So he was not Prime Minister when the next was of decolonization saw the independence of Britain's Asian (except Hong Kong) ,African and major West Indian holdings like Jamaica, Trinidad & Tabago, The Bahamas and Guyana.

With the end of Empire the Royal Navy was largely liqudated and the RAF and Army similarly liquidated . By 1968 with the exception of a small force in Hong Kong There were no British military or Naval squadrons East of the Suez. By the way Egypt took the Suez canal away from Britain and France in 1956. Churchill who served two tours as First Lord of the Admiralty didn't have to preside over the scraping of Britain's capital ships and the reduction in the fleet from nearly 1000 ships to less than 50.

Most of the partings of her former possessions was amicable and with few exceptions all the new nations chose to join The British Commonwealth presided over by the Queen. Commonwealth Nations have preferential trade immigration and defense relations with Britain and 19 of her former possessions including some big one like Jamaca, Canada, Australia and New Zealand didn't completely cut their ties to Britain for they all recognize te Queen as their Head of State. Which is why Canadian money has a picture of the Queen on it.

Just think if the Jack and Stripes still flew over our nation we would now be a member (probably the richest and most powerful) in a club of English speaking parliamentary democratic nations numbering 67 countries with nearly 3 billion citizens. .
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-16-2015, 12:26 AM
 
Location: Maryland about 20 miles NW of DC
6,104 posts, read 5,990,747 times
Reputation: 2479
Some of my favorite misstatements :

"They will never bomb this place (Berlin) ." Reich's Marshal Herman Goering just days before the British Bomber Command bombed Berlin in 1940 in retaliation for a unintended raid on London.

"I will not send American boys to do what Asian boys should do (defending South Vietnam, "Lyndon Johnson in 1964 before he sent hundreds of thousands of American troops to fight in and defend South Vietnam.

"Space travel is utter blige" Professor Richard van der Witt Wooley (British Astronomer Royal, in the summer of 1957. On October 4th 1957 Sputnik 1 flew through utter blige followed on April 12 1961 by Red Air Force Major Yuri Gagarin. .

"Anyone talking about nuclear energy is talking rubbish" Professor Ernest Rutherford (1929) one of the fathers of nuclear physics who proved the existence of the atomic nucleus. He lived to see the first use of nuclear weapons and nuclear reactors.
Britain's prime nuclear physics laboratory is named The Rutherford-Appleton Laboratory.

Last edited by mwruckman; 08-16-2015 at 01:02 AM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-16-2015, 12:54 AM
 
Location: Maryland about 20 miles NW of DC
6,104 posts, read 5,990,747 times
Reputation: 2479
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheWiseWino View Post
To call it an understatement is far, far too kind. In my mind it was pure revisionist bs. My points of contention have been placed in bold.

TO OUR GOOD AND LOYAL SUBJECTS:

After pondering deeply the general trends of the world and the actual conditions obtaining in Our Empire today, We have decided to effect a settlement of the present situation by resorting to an extraordinary measure.

We have ordered Our Government to communicate to the Governments of the United States, Great Britain, China and the Soviet Union that Our Empire accepts the provisions of their Joint Declaration.

To strive for the common prosperity and happiness of all nations as well as the security and well-being of Our subjects is the solemn obligation which has been handed down by Our Imperial Ancestors and which lies close to Our heart.

Indeed, We declared war on America and Britain out of Our sincere desire to ensure Japan's self-preservation and the stabilization of East Asia, it being far from Our thought either to infringe upon the sovereignty of other nations or to embark upon territorial aggrandizement.

But now the war has lasted for nearly four years. Despite the best that has been done by everyone – the gallant fighting of the military and naval forces, the diligence and assiduity of Our servants of the State, and the devoted service of Our one hundred million people – the war situation has developed not necessarily to Japan's advantage, while the general trends of the world have all turned against her interest.

Moreover, the enemy has begun to employ a new and most cruel bomb, the power of which to do damage is, indeed, incalculable, taking the toll of many innocent lives. Should We continue to fight, not only would it result in an ultimate collapse and obliteration of the Japanese nation, but also it would lead to the total extinction of human civilization.

Such being the case, how are We to save the millions of Our subjects, or to atone Ourselves before the hallowed spirits of Our Imperial Ancestors? This is the reason why We have ordered the acceptance of the provisions of the Joint Declaration of the Powers.

We cannot but express the deepest sense of regret to Our Allied nations of East Asia, who have consistently cooperated with the Empire towards the emancipation of East Asia.

The thought of those officers and men as well as others who have fallen in the fields of battle, those who died at their posts of duty, or those who met with untimely death and all their bereaved families, pains Our heart night and day.

The welfare of the wounded and the war-sufferers, and of those who have lost their homes and livelihood, are the objects of Our profound solicitude.

The hardships and sufferings to which Our nation is to be subjected hereafter will be certainly great. We are keenly aware of the inmost feelings of all of you, Our subjects. However, it is according to the dictates of time and fate that We have resolved to pave the way for a grand peace for all the generations to come by enduring the unendurable and suffering what is unsufferable.

Having been able to safeguard and maintain the structure of the Imperial State, We are always with you, Our good and loyal subjects, relying upon your sincerity and integrity.

Beware most strictly of any outbursts of emotion which may engender needless complications, or any fraternal contention and strife which may create confusion, lead you astray and cause you to lose the confidence of the world.

Let the entire nation continue as one family from generation to generation, ever firm in its faith in the imperishability of its sacred land, and mindful of its heavy burden of responsibility, and of the long road before it.

Unite your total strength, to be devoted to construction for the future. Cultivate the ways of rectitude, foster nobility of spirit, and work with resolution – so that you may enhance the innate glory of the Imperial State and keep pace with the progress of the world.

(Hirohito's signature and Privy Seal)
Following Japanese tradition when he died in 1988 Emperor Hirohito assumed the name chosen for his time as Emperor a choice made when he became emperor in the 1920s. Now he is called Emperor Showa or the Showa Emperor. Showa is a Japanese word for tranquility or peace. After the war Japan became one of richest, most peaceful and technologically advanced nations in the World. In the long view of things The Showa Emperor's broadcast to the subjects of Imperial Japan isn't so far off the mark.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-16-2015, 01:12 AM
 
Location: Maryland about 20 miles NW of DC
6,104 posts, read 5,990,747 times
Reputation: 2479
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grandstander View Post
I am disinclined to engage in a debate about the "greatest" this or "most" that since comparative standards do not really exist when the topic is something vague like "understatement."

I will contribute what I think of as one of the great pieces of understatement in American history. General Lee's surrender to General Grant was probably the single most momentous news of the entire Civil War. Grant, the ultimate minimalist, at first forgot entirely to forward the news to Washington, and then when he was reminded, took care of business with:


No "We have met the enemy and they are ours", no "Atlanta is ours and fairly won", no "..present the city of Savannah as a Christmas present"..just matter of fact information in keeping with Grant's no fuss,
taciturn style.
These sound more like words another no nonsense Union Commander Gen. William Tecumseh Sherman.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > History

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 11:49 AM.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top