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Old 02-21-2008, 04:06 PM
 
Location: Journey's End
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Apparently 1/3 of the world (more than 1.3b) is religiously Muslim. And it appears from the little I know that Islamic is a culture and not an ethnicity. Conversion to Muslim was and remains very widespread.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Terrapin2212 View Post
So the Bosnian Muslims are also a Slavic ethnicity and not an Islamic one? I usually associate Islamic ethnicities as Arabics, Persians, Turks, Pakistnais, etc.
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Old 02-21-2008, 04:30 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Terrapin2212 View Post
So the Bosnian Muslims are also a Slavic ethnicity and not an Islamic one? I usually associate Islamic ethnicities as Arabics, Persians, Turks, Pakistnais, etc.
The Phillipines are also Islamic...Pakistan and parts of China..
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Old 02-21-2008, 04:47 PM
 
Location: South Bay Native
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Terrapin2212 View Post
So the Bosnian Muslims are also a Slavic ethnicity and not an Islamic one? I usually associate Islamic ethnicities as Arabics, Persians, Turks, Pakistnais, etc.
You seem to have the concepts of ethnicity and faith mixed up. Muslims come in all colors and walks of life, as do Christians, or Buddhists, etc.
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Old 02-21-2008, 04:49 PM
 
Location: Journey's End
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All good, now we've answered the question about Islam/Muslim:

Back to the OP, please.
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Old 02-21-2008, 06:52 PM
 
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The balkans is made up of lots of different groups that either immigrated there hundreds of years ago from the steppes or were always there

During the medieval times, these various groups fought with each other

Whatever beef they have now goes all the way back past the crusades

They are all cousins though

Marshall Tito actually unified them for a bit, but that all fell apart
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Old 02-21-2008, 07:56 PM
 
1,763 posts, read 5,578,073 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Terrapin2212 View Post
So the Bosnian Muslims are also a Slavic ethnicity and not an Islamic one? I usually associate Islamic ethnicities as Arabics, Persians, Turks, Pakistnais, etc.
I believe they are, although there is probably some Turkish blood mixed in. But you could say that about many of the populations across the Balkans.

This area of Europe bore the brunt of the Turkish invasions over the centuries. The Turks left behind everything from bathhouses to minarets, some of which can still be found in Budapest and also the southern Hungarian city of Pecs [among other places?]. The people of the region don't see this history as an Islamic invasion or a Muslim one - it was strictly a Turkish affair. The Turks made it as far west as Budapest, but never further. The Balkans paid dearly for this, while the Austrians got off scott-free [although I think they did contribute militarily].

Last edited by Merlander; 02-21-2008 at 08:05 PM..
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Old 02-21-2008, 08:04 PM
 
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Originally Posted by NJ Chutzpah View Post
The balkans is made up of lots of different groups that either immigrated there hundreds of years ago from the steppes or were always there
This is also a very true statement. I believe the Slavic tribes had been there quite a while. Magyar tribes moved to the area in the 9th century, some say even earlier. Their raids west brought home lots of European booty, pun intended. The Mongol and Turkish invasions left their genetic markers behind. The Hungarian kings also attracted artisans and knights from across the continent, all of whom settled in the area. There is truly an astounding diversity across this whole area of Central Europe.
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Old 02-22-2008, 12:32 AM
 
2,141 posts, read 7,390,061 times
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Originally Posted by Tim Rankin View Post
What is Kosovo? - Essentially 90% Albanian. Delusioned, romantic Serbs claim it's their homeland.

What is Croatia? - Home of Roman Catholic Slavs, speak Serbo-Croatian, don't like Serbs.

What is Serbia? - Land of the Serbs.

Who are the KLA? - Kosovo Albanians fighting for their independence.

Who are the Serbs? - Orthodox Slavs, speak Serbo-Croatian. Dislike anyone they can't rule over, are a patron-state of Russia.

Who are the Bosnians? - Historically persecuted, Muslim Slavs.
There are Bosnia Serbs. My grandfather was one. He's long gone but during his lifetime, he was forced to convert to Islam and change his last name to Moslem, literally. Upon coming to the U.S., he changed it back to his birth given surname at Ellis Island. Serbs live throughout the former Yugoslavia. Under Tito, most people got along well. I know many Serb Christians that married Bosnian Muslims. Things got very nationalistic again after Tito's death. He was a Croat and was loved by many, including Serbs.

The underlying resentment that some Serbs have towards Croatia is because Croatia sided with the Germans in WWII. Thousands of Serbs were Holocaust victims, along with Jews and Gypsies. The Orthodox Church is a Catholic church. The religions are very, very similar. Croats and Serbs share a language and bascially, religion.

Kosovo is important to Serbs. It's not a romantic notion. Serbs have been fighting battles against Moslem Turks for centuries. Kosovo officially became a state within Serbia in 1913. Arizona became a US state in 1912. Perhaps many Americans would look at this differently if Arizona became a sovereign nation once the minority population swells and becomes the majority and then wants to succeed from the United States and become their own nation and then other far away countries back it...much like we just did to the Serbs?
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Old 02-22-2008, 01:04 PM
 
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Originally Posted by lisak64 View Post
There are Bosnia Serbs. My grandfather was one. He's long gone but during his lifetime, he was forced to convert to Islam and change his last name to Moslem, literally. Upon coming to the U.S., he changed it back to his birth given surname at Ellis Island. Serbs live throughout the former Yugoslavia. Under Tito, most people got along well. I know many Serb Christians that married Bosnian Muslims. Things got very nationalistic again after Tito's death. He was a Croat and was loved by many, including Serbs.

The underlying resentment that some Serbs have towards Croatia is because Croatia sided with the Germans in WWII. Thousands of Serbs were Holocaust victims, along with Jews and Gypsies. The Orthodox Church is a Catholic church. The religions are very, very similar. Croats and Serbs share a language and bascially, religion.

Kosovo is important to Serbs. It's not a romantic notion. Serbs have been fighting battles against Moslem Turks for centuries. Kosovo officially became a state within Serbia in 1913. Arizona became a US state in 1912. Perhaps many Americans would look at this differently if Arizona became a sovereign nation once the minority population swells and becomes the majority and then wants to succeed from the United States and become their own nation and then other far away countries back it...much like we just did to the Serbs?
Lisa - Everything you say is basically true. The one thing I disagree with you on though, is the romantic notion part. As some point, one has to accept that Kosovo is no longer a Serbian "land."

In the same way that Serbians love Kosovo, Hungarians love Transylvania. And there are even more Hungarians there percentage-wise, then Serbs in Kosovo. Under Ceausescu, whole Hungarian villages & cemetaries were razed to the ground and replaced by ugly cinderblock apartments housing forcibly-relocated Romanians, to increase the Romanian population. But the difference is, Hungarians grudgingly accept the new reality, and ask only that their minority be treated with respect, and be allowed to speak their native tongue, etc. There are Hungarians who have the same romantic notions about Transylvania as many Serbs have about Kosovo.

IMO though, there has been enough bloodshed in the Balkans - it's time for Serbia to let Kosovo go.
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Old 02-22-2008, 01:41 PM
 
Location: in my imagination
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ok do I have this right?Croatia,Bosnia and Serbia ARE 3 DIFFERENT TERRITORIES that use to be Yugoslavia.

Bosnia is mainly Muslim.
Serbia is Christian
Croatia is Christian

The Bosnians fought the Serbs right?Who was the Croats siding with in the war in the 90's?Or was it 3 sides fighting each other?

And then 2 Christian Serbs and Croats still hate each other over WW2 anyway?


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