Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > History
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 11-26-2017, 08:59 AM
 
13,395 posts, read 13,503,206 times
Reputation: 35712

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by Listener2307 View Post
WHAT!!?? Are you serious?
You honestly believe what you said? That I can learn everything I need to know about a given subject in 30 seconds on the Internet? No. You cannot believe that. You are attempting sarcasm.

The value of monuments and statues is exactly as jbgusa says - as inspiration. History should be learned in order for us to make intelligent decisions about our future. A statue of a famous person inspires some and infuriates others. And that is as it should be.

Theodore Roosevelt is a good example. I have no respect for the man. Others find him to be an inspiration. I say we should leave the statues up; maybe a few more people will someday realize how crazy the man was. But let us not forget him.
We are talking about a statue on a public street with a little plaque. How much are you going to learn from a little plaque? Google will have more info than what is on that plaque.

Your example is silly. Theodore Roosevelt was a president. His history and legacy will be preserved in many resources outside of a statue. There are multiple historical sites and a new Presidential Library. A random statue is useless.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 11-26-2017, 09:18 AM
 
Location: Pennsylvania
5,725 posts, read 11,715,057 times
Reputation: 9829
A statue without any attached context, or worse, with a biased context, isn't teaching anyone history. Arguments that removing statues = denying history are specious.

I'm floored, however, that anyone would think that learning about the Civil Rights era through a museum exhibit which presumably would include all kinds of context would not be a positive for black adolescents.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-26-2017, 09:39 AM
 
9,694 posts, read 7,389,775 times
Reputation: 9931
Quote:
Originally Posted by charlygal View Post
What is the need for street monuments? What is being lost by removing a statue?
because you can read about it on you daily travels, reminded of what happen here, on this spot in year ...

and then you can further your research

remember before internet, not everybody ran to a library. most never had a library card or ever step inside one.

we have a monument called. Ellicott Stone. How before internet would anybody know anything about that, or the civil rights monuments that are everywhere in Montgomery and Selma al.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-26-2017, 10:03 AM
 
13,395 posts, read 13,503,206 times
Reputation: 35712
Quote:
Originally Posted by brownbagg View Post
because you can read about it on you daily travels, reminded of what happen here, on this spot in year ...

and then you can further your research

remember before internet, not everybody ran to a library. most never had a library card or ever step inside one.

we have a monument called. Ellicott Stone. How before internet would anybody know anything about that, or the civil rights monuments that are everywhere in Montgomery and Selma al.
We live in the internet age now. People are in their cars or face stuck in a device. A few years back, parents were lauding the new Pokemon game. Why? Many said it was the first time they could get their kids to actually go outside. In today's world, how many people are casually strolling along looking at public statues?

There are more than enough ways to learn about negative historical figures.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-26-2017, 10:10 AM
 
Location: New York Area
35,061 posts, read 16,995,362 times
Reputation: 30204
Quote:
Originally Posted by Listener2307 View Post
WHAT!!?? Are you serious?
You honestly believe what you said? That I can learn everything I need to know about a given subject in 30 seconds on the Internet? No. You cannot believe that. You are attempting sarcasm.

The value of monuments and statues is exactly as jbgusa says - as inspiration. History should be learned in order for us to make intelligent decisions about our future. A statue of a famous person inspires some and infuriates others. And that is as it should be.

Theodore Roosevelt is a good example. I have no respect for the man. Others find him to be an inspiration. I say we should leave the statues up; maybe a few more people will someday realize how crazy the man was. But let us not forget him.
Thanks for your praise, even if we disagree on TR. I think he was one of our greats. His namesake, FDR, not so much.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-26-2017, 01:22 PM
 
Location: NE Mississippi
25,569 posts, read 17,275,200 times
Reputation: 37300
Quote:
Originally Posted by charlygal View Post
We are talking about a statue on a public street with a little plaque. How much are you going to learn from a little plaque? Google will have more info than what is on that plaque.

Your example is silly. Theodore Roosevelt was a president. His history and legacy will be preserved in many resources outside of a statue. There are multiple historical sites and a new Presidential Library. A random statue is useless.
So what is your position?
A) Plaques and statues are of no value, so they should be removed.
or
B) Plaques and statues are of no value, so they should be left as they are.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-26-2017, 07:45 PM
 
9,613 posts, read 6,944,788 times
Reputation: 6842
Quote:
Originally Posted by maf763 View Post
Then why hasn't an atomic/nuclear bomb been deployed in battle since 1945?
Because we’re not the only ones with them anymore.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-26-2017, 07:48 PM
 
9,613 posts, read 6,944,788 times
Reputation: 6842
Quote:
Originally Posted by charlygal View Post
History has already been documented in books, literature, movies, and museums. There is no way the Confederacy will ever be forgotten. What is the need for street monuments? What is being lost by removing a statue?
Why not level the Roman Coliseum or the Pyramids? There’s plenty of books written about them, they won’t be forgotten. That’s prime land that could be redeveloped into condos or something.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-27-2017, 02:12 AM
 
Location: 'greater' Buffalo, NY
5,480 posts, read 3,919,685 times
Reputation: 7483
Quote:
Originally Posted by harry chickpea View Post
Until you have a universal language, you will have divisions.
And when you have a universal language, you will have divisions. Strange implication on your part.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-27-2017, 06:26 AM
 
4,345 posts, read 2,792,682 times
Reputation: 5821
Quote:
Originally Posted by Coldjensens View Post
what if no one knew Black people in America were ever slaves or were ever treated differently or thought to be substandard to white people?

What if no one ever heard all the nasty historic comments or slams on Jewish people?

What if no one knew women were considered the lesser sex or subservient to men?

what if no one knew their ancestors were abused, killed, conquered, genocides by someone else's ancestors?

what if no one knew X land used to belong to "my" people?

What if no one knew their ancestors were considered greater than someone else's ancestors?

What if no one knew Muslims and Christians fought and hated each other?

I am aware of the old saying those who are ignorant of history are doomed to repeat it, but I have doubts of the veracity or at least certainty of that saying. It seems like a lot of the social problems we face (hatred, prejudice) could be avoided if no one knew any history at all.


Could you have faith without history? I think you can. the truths of god are self evident so when you hear them, you will know they are true, you do not need the history behind them to believe.
Most people don't know those. Instead of not knowing history, we could re-write it or just teach the parts we wanted people to know.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > History

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 11:52 PM.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top