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Old 05-13-2009, 09:55 AM
 
Location: Planet earth
434 posts, read 933,531 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mathguy View Post
I have read several accounts around Staligrad where captured personnel on both sides were either immediately shot or interrogated and then shot...no prison camp.
Nearly 90,000 German soldiers were captured in Stalingrad and ended in camp

Less than 5,000 made back live to Germany years later
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Old 05-14-2009, 07:18 AM
 
78,347 posts, read 60,539,645 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jinglebell View Post
Nearly 90,000 German soldiers were captured in Stalingrad and ended in camp

Less than 5,000 made back live to Germany years later
Yep. I'm just pointing out that the stats can be skewed when you have guys that are captured but never make it to a camp. They just get recorded as KIA or MIA etc.

If I have a general no capture policy and shoot 90% but 1/2 the guys survive the camps....it's still a 95% death rate and not 50%.
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Old 05-14-2009, 10:07 AM
 
14,993 posts, read 23,881,675 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Walmsley View Post
This is an interesting question because so little is mentioned about the fate of Russian prisoners as opposed to German prisoners of war. According to historian Antony Beevor, only 1.8 million Russian prisoners out of over 4.5 million taken by the Wehrmacht returned alive. Red army losses were nearly 9 million dead and 18 million wounded. Russian military and civilian losses were well over 26 million, so it's readily apparent who bore the brunt of WWII.
Antony Beever really has the two definitive books about the subject "Stalingrad" and "The Fall of Berlin". Really shows the brutality of the Russian Front. Both sides treated their respective sides POW's about as bad as the Japanese treated our POW's (although the Germans treated English and American POW's relatively well). For Germany - all the russian POW's would have ended up in the ovens, no doubt, but they were to busy "processing" the jews. For Russia - well as was stated the few surviving German POW's weren't released until the early and mid 50's. Both sides treatement of civilians was attrocious. "The Fall of Berlin" details the multiple raping of almost all of Berlin's females between the age of 10 and 50 by russian forces.
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Old 05-18-2009, 06:43 AM
 
1,257 posts, read 3,432,694 times
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Beria also killed most of the soviets that Stalin sent to Spain to help the "Popular Front" against Franco.
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Old 05-18-2009, 08:15 PM
 
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Bascially the germans thouhgt of the russian and east european as nothing but labor and inferior. Alot were worked and starved to death.That is why the geramns fear them as they got to the agtes of berlin;they feared revenge.When they met the first line russian trops they were relieved until the second line troops cam eafter them who were thugs mainly and took that revenge.
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Old 05-19-2009, 08:38 AM
 
593 posts, read 1,377,896 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by texdav View Post
Bascially the germans thouhgt of the russian and east european as nothing but labor and inferior. Alot were worked and starved to death.That is why the geramns fear them as they got to the agtes of berlin;they feared revenge.When they met the first line russian trops they were relieved until the second line troops cam eafter them who were thugs mainly and took that revenge.

Yeah, Subhumans. This idea of course was Hitler's justification for Leibensraum or eastward expansion into polish, slavik, and russian lands so Germans would have a place reserved for future generations to live.

Um, I'm late to the show but what happened earlier? Don't understand what racist statement was made by Jinglebell? Was it Japs?

If we can't use historical terminology to describe people of a certain timeperiod then it often times makes it difficult to discuss History from every angle. I don't use that as a descriptive term today but I know that my parents and grandparents used it. Does that make them racist? Or just products of their own time, society, and culture?
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Old 05-19-2009, 09:24 AM
 
2,377 posts, read 5,400,935 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ATX Homeboy View Post
Yeah, Subhumans. This idea of course was Hitler's justification for Leibensraum or eastward expansion into polish, slavik, and russian lands so Germans would have a place reserved for future generations to live.

Um, I'm late to the show but what happened earlier? Don't understand what racist statement was made by Jinglebell? Was it Japs?

If we can't use historical terminology to describe people of a certain timeperiod then it often times makes it difficult to discuss History from every angle. I don't use that as a descriptive term today but I know that my parents and grandparents used it. Does that make them racist? Or just products of their own time, society, and culture?
Moderator's actions are not discussed in the Forum.
Having said that, I think it is entirely possible to discuss history without using terms that are offensive. Just because these names were used in the past, does not make them less hurtful and insulting to the people they refer to.
I understand what you mean about your parents and grandparents using those terms, so did mine, and in truth, they were racist, but also the way things were in their time. Thankfully we have moved past that

Last edited by Thyra; 05-19-2009 at 10:11 AM..
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Old 05-19-2009, 09:30 AM
 
593 posts, read 1,377,896 times
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[quote=Trudy Rose;8880543]Moderator's actions are not discussed in the Forum.


Thanks for the clarification regarding Moderator's actions.
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Old 06-05-2009, 07:07 AM
 
1 posts, read 6,665 times
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German POWs of the Fourth Army being paraded through Moscow 1944, with large columns in the background.

Most Germans taken at Stalingrad in 1943 died in captivity. Those captured 1944-45, 30-85% returned to Germany by 1955, depending on whom you believe!

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/6f/1944_july_17_moscow_german_pow.jpg (broken link)
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Old 10-04-2009, 08:35 AM
 
Location: Nashua
571 posts, read 1,317,873 times
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What has not been mentioned is that a lot of Soviet Army men captured by the Germans were put to work in agriculture - on farms raising food. These men reported that they were well treated and were not anxious to return home when the war ended. It is also reported that many jumped from the trains taking them back to Russia.
I used to work with a guy who was from Latvia and a young teenager during WW2. He wound up driving trucks for the German Army. When the war ended he headed back to his Uncle's farm where he was raised. The Soviets stopped him and asked where he was going and he told them. They replied "What do you mean your Uncle's farm? Everything belongs to the Soviet people now!" and my friend Otto Ditmars then fled to the U.S. sector eventually settling down in Long Island N.Y.
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