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Old 05-11-2009, 07:25 PM
 
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I was thinking about all the Soviet POW's that were captured by Germany especially during Operation Barbarossa where Germany captured whole armies at a time and so i thought there were close to 2 to 3 million prisoner's alone in that 6 month operation much less the entire war.

Did most die in the German camps?

Also at the end of the war as the Soviet armies came across those camps that possibly still had some survivors were they liberated and returned to mother Russia or did Stalin treat them as traitors and have them shot?
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Old 05-11-2009, 11:01 PM
 
Location: Parts Unknown, Northern California
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Yes, the majority died in captivity, the same fate that fell upon most Germans who were captured by the Red Army. Both sides used the same formula, a combination of overworking them as slave laborers, and neglect of their basic food and medical needs. Of five and half million Soviets taken prisoner, an estimated 3.3 million perished in captivity.

The NKVD, headed by Lavrenty Beria during the war, was given the function of keeping the Red Army soldiers in line. They ran military counter intelligence, military security and handled deserters and spies. In 1944 and '45, as the Red Army's offensive liberated POW camps, the NKVD had troop battalions which took charge of those newly freed and herded them into their own collective camps to conduct security interegations, sorting those classed as traitors from those simply being repatriated. All sorts of behavior, some actually treason and some the sort which couldn't be helped, came under Beria's definition of "traitor", so for many thousands, liberation from Nazi captivity meant execution or a prolonged stay as a slave in Siberian captivity.
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Old 05-12-2009, 02:13 AM
 
Location: Aloverton
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I think the last of the Stalingrad prisoners were finally repatriated in 1955. In general, I think a lot of the German prisoners died by being sent to do the worst Gulag-style work. Some, I am sure, hinted a willingness to live in the DDR, and were 're-educated'.
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Old 05-12-2009, 07:28 AM
 
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This is an interesting question because so little is mentioned about the fate of Russian prisoners as opposed to German prisoners of war. According to historian Antony Beevor, only 1.8 million Russian prisoners out of over 4.5 million taken by the Wehrmacht returned alive. Red army losses were nearly 9 million dead and 18 million wounded. Russian military and civilian losses were well over 26 million, so it's readily apparent who bore the brunt of WWII.

One of the darkest chapters in WWII was when Allied forces were obliged, under the terms of the Yalta Agreement, to repatriate many Russian prisoners back to Russia. Stalin made little distinction between those who fought and were captured and those who had deserted. In his mind all were traitors. Most notably was the return of General Andrei Vlasov's army of some 50,000 men to Russian hands. Vlasov and his men had fought the Russians on the German side, although he hated fascism as much as communism. Not much is known about the fate of Vlasov's army, except that, presumably, they were sent to gulags and worked to death. Vlasov was hanged.

Much more seems to have been written about German prisoners of war, especially those of the Sixth army taken at Stalingrad. Many thousands were taken to at least 20 camps scattered around the Soviet Union from the Arctic to as far as the Pamir mountains in present-day Tajikistan. In his book, Enemy at the Gates, William Craig cites the appalling conditions of German prisoners shipped by boxcar. Starvation and disease were so rife that often half the occupants would be dead on arrival. Cannibalism was commonplace. Antony Beevor cites the startling fact that German prisoners were sometimes used to guard their former comrades. For some reason, those from Saxony seemed to be the most brutal. One German prisoner wrote "No Russian ever treated me with such brutality."

As ugly as war is, there were cases of sympathetic treatment, especially by Russian women toward German prisoners. As the German captives were marched out of Stalingrad. there were notable incidents of humane acts of kindness toward those who had been their tormentors only weeks earlier.
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Old 05-12-2009, 09:03 AM
 
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Thanks for the very informative and datailed answers guys as that's exactly what i was looking for as i appreciate it.

6/3
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Old 05-12-2009, 12:53 PM
 
Location: When the people find that they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of the republic
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Walmsley View Post

One of the darkest chapters in WWII was when Allied forces were obliged, under the terms of the Yalta Agreement, to repatriate many Russian prisoners back to Russia. Stalin made little distinction between those who fought and were captured and those who had deserted. In his mind all were traitors. Most notably was the return of General Andrei Vlasov's army of some 50,000 men to Russian hands. Vlasov and his men had fought the Russians on the German side, although he hated fascism as much as communism. Not much is known about the fate of Vlasov's army, except that, presumably, they were sent to gulags and worked to death. Vlasov was hanged.
Aleksander Solzhenitsyn in his famous "The Gulag Arhipelago" writes about an uprising in one of the Siberian camps of so called "Vlasovtzev" after thr WWII. The biggest problem for Soviet WWII POW's was the following - Stalin and Soviet Union did not sign the Geneva Convention so POW's did not have any rights under Geneva Convention (compare to US or British POW's being visited by Red Cross in german camps)
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Old 05-12-2009, 02:47 PM
 
Location: Planet earth
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I have read plenty about the subject

Grandstander and John W both wrote very well here

I would like to add one more fact and one my conclusion

Fact one, the percentage of POW survival is the lowest for Russians in German's hands. I once came across the exact statistics for both nations.

(Moderator cut/Racist)

Hope you agree with me

Last edited by Thyra; 05-12-2009 at 03:55 PM..
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Old 05-12-2009, 03:35 PM
 
Location: Aloverton
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Originally Posted by jinglebell View Post
One my conclusion, the most brutality in the war were demonstrated by Germans and Japs. If you dig deep down in both people, they all share one big thing in common till todlay : machine-like mentality, psychology and behavior etc.

Hope you agree with me
On the contrary. I think you just said one of the most bigoted things I've ever read on this board, including use of a racial slur, and I'm disgusted.
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Old 05-12-2009, 03:54 PM
 
Location: Aloverton
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Originally Posted by jinglebell View Post
I am talking about history, reality too

Regardless you like or not

Many behavioral psychologists and sociologists look deep into human and try to understand human behaviors including brutality. There are interesting results. Go read first!

I am not a racist or spread racial slur. Sometimes, reality is not pleasant but true.

Before you attack me, make sure you start to like children first!

Anyone who dislike children is a real disgust!
This sounds irrational, even incoherent. But I didn't attack you; I took your statements to task. Learn the difference. I just said "I think you just said one of the most bigoted things I've ever read on this board, including use of a racial slur, and I'm disgusted."

I was right. Your comments were quite bigoted, and I'm glad I called them exactly that. That they were semiliterate as well, I hadn't thought it necessary to mention, but it now seems germane.
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Old 05-12-2009, 04:33 PM
 
Location: Planet earth
434 posts, read 873,267 times
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Both Germany and Japan committed atrocities during the war

It is a fact that we can't talk about on the forum?

There are numerous scholars who compared the two nations and identify some similarities in the two, we can't talk about it either?

I have plenty of respect for the two nations in other aspects. For one, they both make the best teamwork and engineers!

I have plenty of dislike of my own group of people too!
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