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Obviously I got the date wrong if it was the 1873 Springfield Its hard for me to believe that in battle you could reload a single shot rifle once every six second, including firing it. Maybe in government tests in perfect conditions with no one trying to take your scalp off.
The 1873 was the first breech loader issued as standard by the U.S. Army and was used throughout the majority of the Indian conflicts thereafter including at Little Big Horn. As to the number of shots per minute, you're probably right. In fact another difficulty was that the original copper cartridges frequently expanded and got jammed after firing and necessitated a knife or other tool to extract before the next round could be loaded. This was believed to have played a major role in the debacle at Little Big Horn. After that the government switched to a brass casing which did not expand or jam as much.
Actually, I think the firing of one shot every six seconds would be possible, after all, buckskinners were (and are) capable of firing three rounds per minute with a muzzle-loader. I would suspect in real life, since the cavalry didn't spend every day practicing, it would probably be impossible for a company to do it. Maybe one or two soldiers could.
Another thing that Hollywood doesn't get right is the mortality rate when someone was wounded. You see all the time in westerns, a person will get shot in the hand, arm or leg and declare, "It's just a flesh wound." A flesh wound in the old west, without proper treatment would very likely be fatal due to infection. And besides, a wound in the hand or arm could most likely break a bone and have terrible tissue damage, thereby necessitating the amputation of that appendage.
By the way Noetsi, the Colt SAA revolver is exceedingly accurate, much more accurate than the current guns of fashion, glocks and sigs. The black powder 45 Colt round will exit the Colt 7 1/2" barrelled revolver at about 800-900 feet per second and has about the same power at a modern 357.
The 1873 was the first breech loader issued as standard by the U.S. Army and was used throughout the majority of the Indian conflicts thereafter including at Little Big Horn. As to the number of shots per minute, you're probably right. In fact another difficulty was that the original copper cartridges frequently expanded and got jammed after firing and necessitated a knife or other tool to extract before the next round could be loaded. This was believed to have played a major role in the debacle at Little Big Horn. After that the government switched to a brass casing which did not expand or jam as much.
Good point about the copper cartridges. I believe there were many split cases found at the Little Big Horn battlefield.
The 1873 Springfield was the U.S. battle rifle until the Krag-Jorgenson rifle was adopted in 1892. During the Span-Am war, many of the soldiers were still equiped with the Springfield rifle since the Krag was only available in limited quantities. After that short war, however, the US Army realized that it had to accelerate it's modernization due to the use of the German Mauser rifle by the Spanish.
Hollywood has gotten better over the years at its history, although Westerns themselves have been displaced by science fiction and super hero movies.
As bad as Hollywood has been in distorting history, they have been worse in making films involving Native Americans. May have missed or forgotten a few that were historically accurate, but at this time can only recall a couple that get a not too bad comment. First is a not well known Canadian production, "Black Robe" which is quite accurate at showing 17th century life among the eastern tribes. Second is "Ulzanas Raid", which at first glance may seem like just another western, but it paints a very good picture of the brutality of frontier warfare, and captures some of the moods and motivations of the Apaches, something other films skip. Even this one gets a few things wrong, for example, in the final shootout it has the Apaches making a frontal charge across open ground against soldiers shooting from behind cover. This is something that Apaches never, ever, did, it was not their style of warfare. However, most of the film is pretty accurate.
After that short war, however, the US Army realized that it had to accelerate it's modernization due to the use of the German Mauser rifle by the Spanish.
The Krag had fast action and good cartridge but was slow and clumsy to reload unlike the Mausers and British Lees that could be quickly reloaded with chargers.
Actually, I think the firing of one shot every six seconds would be possible, after all, buckskinners were (and are) capable of firing three rounds per minute with a muzzle-loader. I would suspect in real life, since the cavalry didn't spend every day practicing, it would probably be impossible for a company to do it. Maybe one or two soldiers could.
Another thing that Hollywood doesn't get right is the mortality rate when someone was wounded. You see all the time in westerns, a person will get shot in the hand, arm or leg and declare, "It's just a flesh wound." A flesh wound in the old west, without proper treatment would very likely be fatal due to infection. And besides, a wound in the hand or arm could most likely break a bone and have terrible tissue damage, thereby necessitating the amputation of that appendage.
By the way Noetsi, the Colt SAA revolver is exceedingly accurate, much more accurate than the current guns of fashion, glocks and sigs. The black powder 45 Colt round will exit the Colt 7 1/2" barrelled revolver at about 800-900 feet per second and has about the same power at a modern 357.
Thats interesting, I had heard in a variety of sources and tv programs that it was not very accurate particularly as the range increased. Maybe those many programs where the hero shoots the gun out of a characters hand without hurting him are accurate after all.
The caliber of the guns, were pretty large. Modern guns have smaller bullets or use less powder (or so I have heard).
One think I have often wondered is whether the professional gunfighters/assasins beloved of film actually existed. I have my doubts.
Two minor points. The sharps rifle (and I believe the Spenser and Henry repeating rifle) issued to certain units by the army in the civil war were breach loading. So the 1873 Springfield was not the first breach loader issued, although the early breach loaders were given to only a small preportion of the US troops.
US forces in Cuba were badly outguned by the Mauser used by the Spanish, which led to the later adaption of another Springfield rifle which fired faster and more reliably than previous US weapons.
As bad as Hollywood has been in distorting history, they have been worse in making films involving Native Americans. May have missed or forgotten a few that were historically accurate, but at this time can only recall a couple that get a not too bad comment. First is a not well known Canadian production, "Black Robe" which is quite accurate at showing 17th century life among the eastern tribes. Second is "Ulzanas Raid", which at first glance may seem like just another western, but it paints a very good picture of the brutality of frontier warfare, and captures some of the moods and motivations of the Apaches, something other films skip. Even this one gets a few things wrong, for example, in the final shootout it has the Apaches making a frontal charge across open ground against soldiers shooting from behind cover. This is something that Apaches never, ever, did, it was not their style of warfare. However, most of the film is pretty accurate.
Until the sixties Hollywood paid limited attention to history period. I dont think they got Native American reality any worse than anything else.
The Last of the Mohicans seems reasonably accurate to me of the Hurons in the 18th century. There was a film about Genonimo, perhaps made for television with the same character who played Magua as Geronimo that also seemed accurate to me (although I am certainly no expert on the apachees). Cheyenne Autum may have been as well, although the incident itself was I assume not a historical event.
As far as I know there were few profession "gunslingers". John Wesley Hardin, Wild Bill Hickok (the only documented face-to-face gun fight that I know of), Elfego Baca, perhaps Bat Masterson, Bill Tilghman...that's about all I know of. I'm sure there were a few more, but the Hollywood image of gun-totin' cowboys is just a figment of imagination. Most cowboys, if they had a six shooter, kept it in their saddlebags. Their job was working cattle, not shooting bad guys.
One shootout that looks more authentic than most is the finale of "Open Range" Costner fanning his six gun in Hollywood fashion, and the shotgun blowing out a piece of wall and then slamming the bad gun up against another building are both silly, but overall, the depiction of run-and-gun, shooting under horses and finally the entire town chasing down the surviving bad guys is probably fairly true as to how a gunfight in a town with two factions would have happened.
I dont know about artillery in the West, but by 1869 calvary had replaced their repeating spensers with single shot Springfields. Only their colts could fire more than one shot.
Were there any cases when calvary in the field used artillery? Wounded Knee, but that was very late in the day in terms of Western operations (they actually used french produced artillery pieces in part there I believe).
Col. Steptoe had a piece or two (I forget one or two) during his aborted trip from Ft. Walla Walla to Ft. Colville. He didn't make it there when attacked by a larger force of Spokanes, Nez Perce, Kootenai and (I think) Yakamas. He ended up abandoning the pieces as they slowed him down during his, ahem, retreat.
The Last of the Mohicans seems reasonably accurate to me of the Hurons in the 18th century.
My apologies to James Fenimore Cooper and Hollywood film makers, but this novel and film does not quite get it right. The Hurons are depicted as a large powerful tribe and a major power in the East. In reality, they had been crushed and scattered a century earlier by the Iroquois Confederacy during the terrible Beaver Wars. By 1757 they had pretty much settled in the Ohio Valley area where they became known as the Wyandot. While they did send warriors to fight in the French and Revolutionary wars, they were not the huge evil force that fiction has painted them to be. Any historical reference to the Wyandots means Hurons, they are the same people.
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Its hard for me to believe that in battle you could reload a single shot rifle once every six second, including firing it. Maybe in government tests in perfect conditions with no one trying to take your scalp off.
