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There is no question that this young man demonstrated undeniable self-discipline but the fact is summitting Everest these days is a joke, by normative climbing standards. Today you plop down 40 to 50 grand and an expedition company will provide guides and Sherpas who will summit first, lay down ropes and ladders, haul all the gear to upper camps and do everything but carry a client up the mountain on their backs.
There is no question that this young man demonstrated undeniable self-discipline but the fact is summitting Everest these days is a joke, by normative climbing standards. Today you plop down 40 to 50 grand and an expedition company will provide guides and Sherpas who will summit first, lay down ropes and ladders, haul all the gear to upper camps and do everything but carry a client up the mountain on their backs.
Krakeur's book "Into Thin Air" has an account of a female reporter that was literally, at least part of the way, carried up Everest on the back of a sherpa. Everest is not a technical climb, ropes are used just so you don't loose your way, and ladders are strung up for the actual climbing that one needs to do.
Then again, the book also details very clearly how easy it is to die on that mountain. Mostly due to altitude sickness or sudden storms.
Actually, you are both wrong. While most persons consider peaks such as K2 and even Denali, "technical climbs," Everest has the major challenge of being the worlds highest peak. As such, it is difficult to climb, due to lack of oxygen, which totally destroys person. As so far as Sherpa's fixing lines, etc. Its been done for years, even in the days of Sir Edmund Hillary.
Not too mention, have either of you climbed the mountain? If not, sounds as if you are just bitter you can not, could not, and would not. You are putting down someone, by diminishing their accomplishments. I don't have the balls, the money, or the wherewithall to climb THAT mountain; although I've been up many others. At least I can admit it.
Actually, you are both wrong. While most persons consider peaks such as K2 and even Denali, "technical climbs," Everest has the major challenge of being the worlds highest peak. As such, it is difficult to climb, due to lack of oxygen, which totally destroys person. As so far as Sherpa's fixing lines, etc. Its been done for years, even in the days of Sir Edmund Hillary.
Not too mention, have either of you climbed the mountain? If not, sounds as if you are just bitter you can not, could not, and would not. You are putting down someone, by diminishing their accomplishments. I don't have the balls, the money, or the wherewithall to climb THAT mountain; although I've been up many others. At least I can admit it.
Hey Newbie, how exactly are we "both wrong"? Did we get any facts wrong?
Does it not cost tens of thousands of dollars to start an Everest expidition?
Are my accounts of the Krakear book incorrect?
Do the Sherpa guides not string up ropes and ladders prior to the accent?
You want to argue that it is a major accomplishment, and I agree, that's fine, what comes after is opinion...but don't come on here and say our facts are wrong.
I was being nice here and didn't even mention originally your newb-like act of posted this in the wrong forum.
Krakeur's book "Into Thin Air" has an account of a female reporter that was literally, at least part of the way, carried up Everest on the back of a sherpa. Everest is not a technical climb, ropes are used just so you don't loose your way, and ladders are strung up for the actual climbing that one needs to do.
Then again, the book also details very clearly how easy it is to die on that mountain. Mostly due to altitude sickness or sudden storms.
I've recently watched the Discovery Channels Everest "realty" show "Beyond the Limit" that amply demonstrates Krakauer's criticism of the modern day "Everest" expedition with Sherpas having to summit first and professional guides literally hand holding and carrying their "clients" up and down the mountain.
Yes, you did post incorrect information. One, the female reporter was NOT carried by anyone. She was short roped by a Sherpa, but wasn't carried by anyone. So, that fact you posted was wrong.
Krauker? Is his book even worth anything? Lots of criticism of his book. By many people who were there that day. Read "The Climb," and other people's thoughts, etc. The contradicte alot of what he has to say.
Does it cost thousands of dollars to climb Everest? Well, yes, DUH. Its ALWAYS cost thousands of dollars, pounds, francs, etc. Every expedition to climb Everest has been expensive; from the first to the last. So why does it matter now how much it costs? Most of the costs are because of expensive permits, equipment, etc.
Again, Sherpa's, fixing ropes, ladders, etc. Sherpa's have been fixing lines and ladders have been used to climb that mountain, since Sir Edmund Hilary climbed it. In fact, a sherpa was the first one on top of the mountain.
As far the "newb," comment? Do you really believe I care how long you have been posting here? What, your little ego is that fragile? Like you can hurt me or even hurt my feelings? Get off of yourself, come back to reality, and crawl back in your hole.
This was history in the making and this was a history forum.
[quote]Everest has the major challenge of being the worlds highest peak. As such, it is difficult to climb, due to lack of oxygen, which totally destroys person.[/qiuote]
All of which is true, however and I did give this kid credit for enduring such hardships but I also prefaced my remarks my stating that by the standards of such climbers as Reinhold Messner, Hillary, and other traditional climbers, summitting Everest has become somewhat of a joke. Watch the Discovery Channel's series Beyond the Limits and what I am saying will become more than obvious as climbers so inexperienced that their guides have to show them how to use their equipment.
As so far as Sherpa's fixing lines, etc. Its been done for years, even in the days of Sir Edmund Hillary.
Hillary and Tenzing Norgay were the first to summit, not the third or fourth after one or two Sherpas laid in ropes or cut steps to the summit. They and the other team members established their own camps carrying their own supplies to each successively higher camp. Climbers like Messner, who climbed Everest first without oxygen and then solo didn't use Sherpas at all!
Quote:
If not, sounds as if you are just bitter you can not, could not, and would not. You are putting down someone, by diminishing their accomplishments. I don't have the balls, the money, or the wherewithall to climb THAT mountain; although I've been up many others. At least I can admit it.
Oh, puleeze if I am bitter about anything it is how easy it is in this day and age to gain celebrity status for having accomplished so little and more importantly, the obscene obsession to chase the most meaningless of records. So, who will be next, a 9 year old?
Yes, you did post incorrect information. One, the female reporter was NOT carried by anyone. She was short roped by a Sherpa, but wasn't carried by anyone. So, that fact you posted was wrong.
Krauker? Is his book even worth anything? Lots of criticism of his book. By many people who were there that day. Read "The Climb," and other people's thoughts, etc. The contradicte alot of what he has to say.
Does it cost thousands of dollars to climb Everest? Well, yes, DUH. Its ALWAYS cost thousands of dollars, pounds, francs, etc. Every expedition to climb Everest has been expensive; from the first to the last. So why does it matter now how much it costs? Most of the costs are because of expensive permits, equipment, etc.
Again, Sherpa's, fixing ropes, ladders, etc. Sherpa's have been fixing lines and ladders have been used to climb that mountain, since Sir Edmund Hilary climbed it. In fact, a sherpa was the first one on top of the mountain.
This was history in the making and this was a history forum.
And there we go with the makings finally of a good topic....
Yes I did read Boukreev's account (The Climb). It's been several years for each of those books however. His contradictions from Krauker mainly deal with Krauker's account of himself, since Kraukeur made him look like some lazy selfish dolt. He did nothing to dispel the account of the other reporter that was carried up, errr.., short roped. As I remember Kraukeur's description (I have to find the book, around here somewhere....), she was pulled up "like a rag doll" on the short rope and I think that was his actual quote. Carried up/Pulled up, it's a matter of syntax.
Hillary and his Sherpa's did not have the support structure that exists on the mountain today, or the technology of satellite phones and lightweight equipment, or the knowledge of the route, or the support of what are esssentially fixed camps at designated places on the ascent. I think him and his sherpa fixed lines as they went, but I might be wrong. But everything was new. Their was a technical climb near the top - The Hillary Step. Hillary had to traverse that with his sherpa. Now...it's a known factor, easily traversed with a fixed ladder.
The point is, with the proper training, and money, and, probably most importantly luck, it is relatively easy to scale Everest nowadays. The key is LUCK - because a little bad luck will get you killed very quickly on that mountain. The weather can turn very quickly, you can hurt yourself, you can slide down a ledge, alot can go wrong very easily.
I was actually very near Everest, about 50 miles as the crow flies. Never made it to base camp however. But I remember seeing white fog blowing off the peak - that was the jet trail, those winds that move accross the upper atmosphere, blowing snow off the peak. It was an amazing site.
And as for the newb comments - that's a fair warning, we can have a discussion here. But personal attacks (bitter, no balls, etc) will change your "newb" label to "not a member" label. You earned your newb label until you learn how to debate the facts (which you somewhat did in your response).
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