Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Hi, I have been shopping kitchen cabinets not for their style but more for their quality and innovative ideas in organization. I have landed upon Siematic and frankly am scared. I love everything about the product. They even do traditional doors now instead of just minimalist European. But I am probably going to pay through the nose for their designers, right? Is there any way to get good design help outside the store? Can Siematic be bought direct or discounted? Thanks!
Hi, I have been shopping kitchen cabinets not for their style but more for their quality and innovative ideas in organization. I have landed upon Siematic and frankly am scared. I love everything about the product. They even do traditional doors now instead of just minimalist European. But I am probably going to pay through the nose for their designers, right? Is there any way to get good design help outside the store? Can Siematic be bought direct or discounted? Thanks!
While I will not argue quality I will argue looks. Siematic is the 2nd most ugliest cabinet manufactured in the world. Quality is just about the best there is though, fine German engineering. But unless you have cash to burn in the fireplace to keep warm why buy something so ugly just to show off. If you really really really really like that strange euro style then go for it. I also will advise you that if you ever go to resell your home, potential buyers will just point and laugh and ask their Realtor to move on.
Honestly this is not my opinion, it's a fact. Despite what Interior Designers, Kitchen Designers and design magazines may tell you, this style is NOT popular in the west. But if it's what YOU really like.......................
No you will not pay through the nose for their designers, you will only pay through the nose for the product. This foreign product not only hurts the USA economy but because it is so very expensive you will not find it in any discount outlets here. Staff Kitchen Designers do not charge you for a basic design. Only when your design gets complicated with multiple trips and changes are you charged a very small deposit, not a fee. This deposit is credited back to you when/if you buy. This is to protect the store from the consumer from mooching and stealing ideas for free. Oh no people don't do that do they? Don't get me started on that................
If you choose to hire a freelance Kitchen Designer CKD or CMKBD then they charge anywhere from $100/hr to the more preferable to you....... a percentage of the job. So a normal $20,000 kitchen which will cost you $60,000 with Siematic would cost you maybe $2 to 3,000 for a professional KD to work with you one on one.
Remember this: Kitchen Designers are not contractors. but their job includes guiding you through the entire process right to the end. and holding your hand when you need it. For a higher end kitchen it is truly the only way. For an independent KD go to the NKBA website and click on find a Designer in your zip code. Interview a few of them and choose one based on you clicking with their personality, not based on price.
i am confused by your post DESERTSUN41
i didnt know what cabinets you were talking about, but just looked them up and they are beautiful. i see they have traditional as well as modern styles. where are they ugly??
i have seen some ugly cabinets and these arent it. and you state it is a "fact" when you know that looks are competly relative! and to say that this style is not popular in the west? the whole WEST of the earth? i mean what in the world?? sorry i just dont agree and hate even more the fact that you would put down something many people like.
If not Siematic, then who? Do you know of another company that can open large pantry doors parallel to themselves? Or task channels hidden in places you'd never guess? I'm really going for innovative interiors or accessories I guess. Not the style or appearance. I'd welcome any suggestions on American made products that can compete on an engineering level. And BTW, findinghope saw what I am speaking of with their new line of "western" looking styles. They are actually quite traditional looking. Not quite wormhole/farmhouse but definitely not severe either.
I don't have any experience with these people, but they have some pretty cool stuff on their website. I don't know if that is the kind of stuff you are looking for.
If you really want all the goofy little "pegs and hooks" and stuff SieMatic specializes in...
...you do well to consider what DesertSun states: only a TINY percentage of US market home buyers like / appreciate that kind of stuff.
Honest. I have shown people million dollar + homes that probably had $100,000 worth of Germany cabinetry (Poggenpohl is another maker that does similar stuff) and probably 8 out of 10 were asking if the sellers could rip it all out and put in stuff from Home Depot. Really, and these were pretty sophisticated shoppers...
In the US most folks associate anything "engineered" with IKEA, never mind the the BUILD QUALITY of the stuff from SeiMatic or Poggenpohl is closer to what you'd expect of some military / aerospace contractor than a kitchen furnishings...
You can get about 75% of the functionality by relying on any of the companies like Knape & volt, rev-a-shelf, Omega National, blum or similar. Every town has lots of differenc kitchen designers that will be more than happy to work with you to get something that hits the right price point, has appropriate appeal and will function as wish.
If you think you are going to find someone to discount imported German cabinets I would hang out with the folks in the Russian mob. Literally it is easier to get diamonds from outside the normal distribution channels than deal with some high end European companies...
...you do well to consider what DesertSun states: only a TINY percentage of US market home buyers like / appreciate that kind of stuff.
Honest. I have shown people million dollar + homes that probably had $100,000 worth of Germany cabinetry (Poggenpohl is another maker that does similar stuff) and probably 8 out of 10 were asking if the sellers could rip it all out and put in stuff from Home Depot. Really, and these were pretty sophisticated shoppers...
In the US most folks associate anything "engineered" with IKEA, never mind the the BUILD QUALITY of the stuff from SeiMatic or Poggenpohl is closer to what you'd expect of some military / aerospace contractor than a kitchen furnishings...
You can get about 75% of the functionality by relying on any of the companies like Knape & volt, rev-a-shelf, Omega National, blum or similar. Every town has lots of difference kitchen designers that will be more than happy to work with you to get something that hits the right price point, has appropriate appeal and will function as wish.
If you think you are going to find someone to discount imported German cabinets I would hang out with the folks in the Russian mob. Literally it is easier to get diamonds from outside the normal distribution channels than deal with some high end European companies...
Thanks Chet. Your mention of Poggenpohl was the other company I was referring to but did not mention. Yes Poggenpohl falls into the same class of fine German engineering as Siematic. Both very very very expensive. And rarely liked as you mention.
Someone said Siematic has traditional styles. If that's true I am not aware. I'd like to see it. Without looking I would doubt any European company would make traditional cabinet styles but that don't mean they don't. We make both styles here don't we? Euro style accounts for about 12% of total North American sales. I can't find stats on how much traditional style sells in Europe but I bet it's similar. They hate our style and we hate theirs for the most part.
If I toss around numbers it is based on facts right from trade journals, not my brain. When my opinions and national and international statistics agree with me then I'd call it a fact. To the person wondering what I meant by west, west generally includes North America. Canada and the USA are usually grouped into this. Mexico is not, guess they don't buy cabinets.
And just as I said in my first post about home buyers not wanting it, Chet also agreed by saying buyers wish the sellers would just tear it all out. Arguably that is good reason to suggest that style is simply ugly by popular opinion after discounting facts from trade journals.
But again....if you like it then to hell with what everyone says. Go for it.
Thanks Chet, I looked at Omega and a KD in my area recommended Candlelight as well. Both seem to offer a lot of storage options. Still not as much as Siematic and I still can't find anyone who does the pantry doors that hinge parallel upon opening. But your Blum recommendation proves interesting. I might be able to customize my pantry doors with their products. As a side note, I am building this kitchen for me, not future owners of my house. But I will keep in mind eventual resale value. Desertsun, Take a look at www.spogue.com in my area. This is the showroom where I found Siematic and their more traditional lines. Thanks for all the tips! I'll keep you posted.
I don't have any experience with these people, but they have some pretty cool stuff on their website. I don't know if that is the kind of stuff you are looking for.
It looks like all they do it pull out shelves - am I missing something else? I'm also looking for the 'perfect' kitchen cabinets, but these seem pretty run-of-the-mill.
Beyond "building it for myself" there are other issues to consider...
I once had a kitchen designer tell me "you know why you never see a Ferrari in aqua green? -- they have a reputation to uphold...", so it is sorta the same with kitchen design -- a client has a certain budget and certain style in mind and MOST designers will try and achieve the right look by relying on the firms most well known at that price point.
Could the Ferrari factory paint a Modena any color? Of course (and if the client is the President of Bianchi bicycles they probably will be happy to paint the thing 'pool bottom green'...) but leave to the folks who know and RED is the color they be!
My point is that probably HALF or more of all US cabinet companies have "wood" IN THEIR NAME somehow, they do this because that is what sells AND because that is what they know -- the German companies very well might be capable of producing a very attractive and durable cabinet with a traditional appearance but if they disappoint you it is not like the fans of their core thermofoil finished sleek look cabinets would be at risk.
When it comes to traditional looking drawer fronts and cabinet doors I for one personally am very upset / weirded out when I then see the interior of the drawers / cabinets made in a way that says "ain't nothing traditional going on here". It is for the most part aesthetics, but also I think it suggests a somewhat appropriate level of craftsmanship, and probably is a longer term better idea-- wood does expand / contract with temperature / humidity changes and the more compatible the whole product is the more it will age gracefully and not develop odd / unnatural wear.
Unfortunately not every cabinet maker has the same kinds of accessories / storage options, but I have found a very high percentage of folks do want things like dividers and tray storage and various other measures to give a "place for everything & everything in it's place" look/ feel. In a kitchen project that can afford to give the money and space (at a certain level the specialized stuff itself takes up more room than it makes...) it can work, but I would also caution that every good mechanic or professional chef that I have jade the pleasure of seeing work tends simple to have an appropriate amount of space AND NOT storage / work areas so specialized that they cannot rearrange things on the fly. Getting too specific, where one cabinet / drawer can only hold certain tools / utensils may very well be counter- productive. The time to fit everything onto the correct peg and then mentally remember the exact sequence of steps needed to retrieve that item when needed probably slows you down when working.
I know that one extreme you have "Fibber McGee's closest" where each attempt to open a cabinet causes an avalanche of junk, but at the other extreme, where each tool is outlined to fit in a specific slot and no other the kitchen crosses over being a workplace to some kind of 'museum of technical possibility'. I know that among clients (and friends) that have retired to a sleek high rise condo that is kind of the point -- after three or more decades of racing through family food preparation they sorta want to spend their leisure time going to restaurants, eating carryout and having an entertainment catered, so the "over engineered museum of food preparation possibilities" makes sense, but for most people that actually want a highly functional working kitchen something a bit less like a "puzzle board" is actually moremof an overall time savings...
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
If you really want all the goofy little "pegs and hooks" and stuff SieMatic specializes in...
