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From a contractors standpoint, there are two things that have already been mentioned that would deter me from bidding this job. First, never let the contractor know that you are getting multiple estimates. When a customer tells me this, I am polite enough to let that customer know I will not be bidding the job. To me, the customer is price shopping and there will always be someone cheaper. It is not worth the time it takes to bid a job when there are multiple contractors bidding. If anything, let the contractor know you have two other bids to get. This response tells me you are serious but savvy. Multiple bids tells me you are cheap and it is not worth my time.
Secondly, if I am talking to a customer that has any kind of construction knowledge, I will usually not bid the job. I have taken on too many jobs where the homeowner insists on things being done a certain way because that is how it was done in their day. Codes change constantly and this type of homeowner becomes a real pain before the job is complete.
Contractors size up homeowners just as much as homeowners size us up. In my company, if I approach a homeowner that is pushy, demanding, mentioning price, or complaining about other contractors within the first five minutes of the conversation, I will not bid the job. However, I am at least professional enough to let the homeowner know not to expect a bid from me. Hope this helps out a little in your quest for a contractor.
I love your approach. Great post!! And I don't often say those words. You are most certainly intelligent which is in short supply these days. I wish you were part of my team.
I apologize if my post appeared arrogant to you. If you knew me, you would know that I am not at all arrogant. I agree with you that the homeowner should look for the best possible price with the greatest results. I was not implying that a homeowner should not get other estimates.
However, telling a contractor that you have ten other contractors bidding the job will deter many of us from bidding the job. No matter how low our price, there will always be someone cheaper. There is a lot of effort that is put forth in bidding a job. It is just not advantageous to put a bid together for a homeowner that is only interested in price. When we have solid jobs sitting in front of us, a bidding war is not our top priority.
I apologize if my post appeared arrogant to you. If you knew me, you would know that I am not at all arrogant. I agree with you that the homeowner should look for the best possible price with the greatest results. I was not implying that a homeowner should not get other estimates.
However, telling a contractor that you have ten other contractors bidding the job will deter many of us from bidding the job. No matter how low our price, there will always be someone cheaper. There is a lot of effort that is put forth in bidding a job. It is just not advantageous to put a bid together for a homeowner that is only interested in price. When we have solid jobs sitting in front of us, a bidding war is not our top priority.
That sounds better than what you posted earlier, which sounded like you don't like dealing with any competition.
construction knowledge is a double edged sword. you may not like me, b/c I might ask questions about certian things, or insist on something being done a certian way. However, I also understand better what is unexpected and be more inclined to ask you to replace plumbing lines, do more electrical work etc, which adds more to the job, gets you paid for the "more" and lets you sleep well at night knowing you're not patching a problem waiting to happen b/c the customer is ignorant or too focused on the bottom line.
That sounds better than what you posted earlier, which sounded like you don't like dealing with any competition.
construction knowledge is a double edged sword. you may not like me, b/c I might ask questions about certian things, or insist on something being done a certian way. However, I also understand better what is unexpected and be more inclined to ask you to replace plumbing lines, do more electrical work etc, which adds more to the job, gets you paid for the "more" and lets you sleep well at night knowing you're not patching a problem waiting to happen b/c the customer is ignorant or too focused on the bottom line.
I do not like dealing with competition.
I took them out ASPA.
Really, there is no new people coming in.
Just to expensive to get in the drilling business in Michigan.
As a former contractor for 40 years I absolutely hated giving estimates to residential clients.
First off no matter how may people recommend you 90% of the customers will settle for the cheapest estimate. Price is the most important thing to most customers and with the cheapest price always comes the worst customer satisfaction.
I know nobody wants to hear this but to get the best and most accurate estimate you must get five written estimates spelling out exactly what you are getting for your money.
Provide exact specifications to all the bidders so they are all bidding the same job.
Don't tell the bidders that you are getting more than three bids.
You throw out the highest and the lowest estimate and the most fair price will be among the three remaining bidders.
Give no upfront money to a contractor unless he has to order special made equipment.
If a contractor has poor credit do you really want him working for you?
When his material arrives pay him right away for his materials which will include a markup.
Pay him 1/2 when the job is 50% completed and when he is finished pay him 90%.
When the job has passed inspection and you are satisfied pay him the remaining 10% usually within 30 days.
If the contractor will not accept those terms find another contractor.
Not all contractors are crooks but they do want to be paid timely just as you want the work completed timely.
As a former contractor for 40 years I absolutely hated giving estimates to residential clients.
First off no matter how may people recommend you 90% of the customers will settle for the cheapest estimate. Price is the most important thing to most customers and with the cheapest price always comes the worst customer satisfaction.
I know nobody wants to hear this but to get the best and most accurate estimate you must get five written estimates spelling out exactly what you are getting for your money.
Provide exact specifications to all the bidders so they are all bidding the same job.
Don't tell the bidders that you are getting more than three bids.
You throw out the highest and the lowest estimate and the most fair price will be among the three remaining bidders.
Give no upfront money to a contractor unless he has to order special made equipment.
If a contractor has poor credit do you really want him working for you?
When his material arrives pay him right away for his materials which will include a markup.
Pay him 1/2 when the job is 50% completed and when he is finished pay him 90%.
When the job has passed inspection and you are satisfied pay him the remaining 10% usually within 30 days.
If the contractor will not accept those terms find another contractor.
Not all contractors are crooks but they do want to be paid timely just as you want the work completed timely.
The first portion of this post is great until you started in on these payment plans that the customer should offer to the contractor... Keep in mind that Contractor Laws are different from state to state. Here in Pennsylvania it is 1/3 down and Special Order Materials can be collected up front. Aside from that, there can be a payment schedule or pay the final balance at the Completion of the job. It is ridiculous for a home owner to make these offers. Depending on the size of the job the payment schedule can vary as do the laws. A kitchen contractor may have a flooring, electrical, plumbing subcontractor to pay so that is a part of these payment schedules
I am currently a contractor, so I will offer a quick rundown of my Kitchen business.
My price starts at $26,000.00 and I Charge upfront for estimates on kitchens, drawings, planning etc... Doing a kitchen is very time consuming with all the selections and options involved, as well as, fuel, phonecalls, running to numerous suppliers (flooring, plumbing, cabinets, countertops, paint, lights, hardware, trim, appliances etc...) for samples, quotes etc...
On a job of this magnitude, I have a starting price because anything under my amount is not worth my time skimping for cheaper products when my name is going on the job and in this area it is hard to install something even remotely decent for under $20k.
I make the offer and submitt the final proposal for the job and I offer the demand of the payment schedule which will be a mutual convienience for both parties. My upfront design fee is deleted from the final balance due.
The points here:
1.Not all contractors are bad
2.Kitchens cannot fully be quoted when you have no idea of what you want.
3. I have saved thousands of dollars by letting potential customers know that I charge for Kitchen planning and proposal services and the Homeowners that do pay the fee are more serious and have a sense of worth to what is really involved...
The first portion of this post is great until you started in on these payment plans that the customer should offer to the contractor... Keep in mind that Contractor Laws are different from state to state. Here in Pennsylvania it is 1/3 down and Special Order Materials can be collected up front. Aside from that, there can be a payment schedule or pay the final balance at the Completion of the job. It is ridiculous for a home owner to make these offers. Depending on the size of the job the payment schedule can vary as do the laws. A kitchen contractor may have a flooring, electrical, plumbing subcontractor to pay so that is a part of these payment schedules
I am currently a contractor, so I will offer a quick rundown of my Kitchen business.
My price starts at $26,000.00 and I Charge upfront for estimates on kitchens, drawings, planning etc... Doing a kitchen is very time consuming with all the selections and options involved, as well as, fuel, phonecalls, running to numerous suppliers (flooring, plumbing, cabinets, countertops, paint, lights, hardware, trim, appliances etc...) for samples, quotes etc...
On a job of this magnitude, I have a starting price because anything under my amount is not worth my time skimping for cheaper products when my name is going on the job and in this area it is hard to install something even remotely decent for under $20k.
I make the offer and submitt the final proposal for the job and I offer the demand of the payment schedule which will be a mutual convienience for both parties. My upfront design fee is deleted from the final balance due.
The points here:
1.Not all contractors are bad
2.Kitchens cannot fully be quoted when you have no idea of what you want.
3. I have saved thousands of dollars by letting potential customers know that I charge for Kitchen planning and proposal services and the Homeowners that do pay the fee are more serious and have a sense of worth to what is really involved...
Todd Stull
Enola, PA
If you are doing design services than I agree that you should be paid for your services when they are completed even if you didn't get the job.
But to pay a contractor 1/3 up front when he is working from some designers plans is ridiculous.
I did say that special ordered equipment should be paid for in advance but to front a contractor for boards, nails and labor is foolish on the part of the customer.
I also think is is great that you get paid for estimates, it keeps the bottom feeders from getting 10+ estimates for a $10,000 job.
I think all contractors should be able to charge a fee for any estimate just like the body shops do.
If you are doing design services than I agree that you should be paid for your services when they are completed even if you didn't get the job.
But to pay a contractor 1/3 up front when he is working from some designers plans is ridiculous.
I did say that special ordered equipment should be paid for in advance but to front a contractor for boards, nails and labor is foolish on the part of the customer.
I also think is is great that you get paid for estimates, it keeps the bottom feeders from getting 10+ estimates for a $10,000 job.
I think all contractors should be able to charge a fee for any estimate just like the body shops do.
In my business a free estimate is on the phone.
If I have to go to the job site to troubleshoot, that is a service call. At least.
Then if we drill the water well, I will take it off the bill.
I love contractors that do not follow through. It works in the favor of companies like mine that have ethics and professionalism. I would never skip an appointment with a potential client, and my estimates are given within 24 hours without exception. Customer service is everything!
You and me both.
I would never purposely not bid a job for a potential customer. I always give a bid if its within the scope of what I can do; if I think there will be trouble, I just give a price that i think will be out of reach for the customer. And if they accept it, the job will be well worth my time.
And as for not bidding a job when you know someone else is also; I think its a bit absurd to purposely lower your chances of getting more work. If estimating takes too long, work on your estimating skills.
If you think your price will keep you from being competitive, work on your sales pitch. Create some value in what you're offering that makes your price worth it to the customer.
Or keep on keeping on while me and sacredgrooves pick up all the customers you turned down.
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