Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
We are also looking into getting a pool with our next home and I am curious if spiders are an issue. Someone told me that he has a pool and it attracts all kinds of spiders to the back of his house. Is this true?
We had a pool with the house in Miami we lived in for over 25 years,and I don't recall any particular issues with spiders there. I would suggest that it's easier to keep critters out, and keep the pool cleaner if you enclose it with a pool screen over the pool and patio.
Salt pools are basically chlorine pools. Salt passes through a cell that converts it to chlorine. It is nice if you want to deal with sanitization less, but you will need to clean the cell every few months. Also, you tend to get a rise in PH, so it will likely scale and stain more if metals are present in the source water. Get a chlorine floater, fill it up with tabs, add your occasional Alkalinity increaser (baking soda) and you will be just fine!
There are some truths and some myths in your statement. The sun does not turn chlorine into salt......when the pool needs more salt you have to add more bags. Some generators will produce large amounts of chlorine so it can have the same readings if you desire high chlorine. Saline based body = more gentle on eyes/skin......ummm no. The salt generators typically run on lower dosages of chlorine, they make a couple pints a day vs. bombing the pool with high dosages of liquid chlorine or tablets/shock. If the typical homeowner went out daily and put low dosages of chlorine products in the pool then the pool could survive on low constant dosages like the salt systems provide.
The other consideration under heating the pool is simply using a larger heater. A 210K BTU heater is small for a full size pool so it has to run longer than say a 399K BTU unit. The cost difference is only a couple hundred dollars upfront despite being almost twice the output.
The rest of your info was pretty good!
Salt may be the incorrect name, or the laymans name, but in sunlight chlorine breaks down into a form of salt (sodium, potassium, I do not know) and the machine turns it back into chlorine. You do not need to add salt very often. Once at the beginning of the season about 10 bags for us then maybe three bags in June and a bag or two in august. The salt chlorine/salt chlorine cycle came from the information that came with the machine and various marketing materials and web descriptions of the system. Who knows, maybe they are all wrong.
Here is an example from a mfg website:
"How does it work?Salt, or sodium chloride, dissolves in water separating into sodium (ions) and chloride (ions). By passing a low voltage electrical current between special metal and through the water, the SWCG then converts the chloride into chlorine in a process called electrolysis.
The newly created chlorine creates a chlorine residual, and is available to sanitize the pool. When it is used up, it changes back to chloride, and allowing the process to start over again."
This was not from our mfg. I do not know the name brand off the top of my head. But our Mfg info said the sun turns the chlorine back (apparently to chloride). That seems accurate. If our pool gets overchlorinated, if we leave it open and exposed on a sunny day, the chlorine levels drop quickly. If it is covered or cloudy, the chlorine levels drop slowly. Maybe that is just chance. However the mfg statement combined with real world happenings make is seem accurate, but you never know.
Ummm - yes. It is widely accepted saline (slightly salty water) is much easier on the eyes than hard water with little or no salt in it. You can test this simply. Buy some saline eye wash. It feels refreshing. Now drop some tap water into your eyes, it makes them red and itchy. This is why eye wash products are saline. Another test we do regularly. Have some kids swim in our pool. Now have them go swim in a fresh water pool. They want to come back to our pool because it does not make their eyes hurt like the other pools do. Not sure about skin. That is my observation only. It certainly feels better on your skin than pool or lake water. Other people have commented on that as well.
The chlorine levels recommended for our salt pool are considerably lower than the levels recommended for our previous fresh water pool. Maybe it is possible to keep the levels lower in a regular pool, not sure. We just go by the recommended levels.
As far as I know, all of the decent chlorinators are adjustable. They can produce a lot of chlorine or a little as desired. I turn it up when we are going to have large numbers of people in the pool. They also have a "superchlorinate" function simlar to shocking the pool. Run it on superchlorinate for two days and you have to let sun into it to get the chlorine levels down, or at least that is what we do and it works. We overchlorinated once in the winter when we could not open the cover and it took over a week to get the chlorine levels down.
Last edited by Coldjensens; 08-27-2013 at 05:02 PM..
Here is some more information from Pools.com (I bolded and italicized the language I was referring to) This is typical of the information found on many pool sites and in mfg booklets. You will find similar explanations all over the internet. Some people dispute the claims it does nto change alkalinity. We get some change in alkalinity, but very little. With our chlorine pool, we had to add chemicals weekly. With the salt pool it varies. Some years we add nothing once it is balanced, sometimes we add chemicals every four or six weeks. We test the water weekly, sometimes daily.
[SIZE=2]"One of the first alternative sanitizers introduced to the pool and spa industry was the chlorine generator. Chlorine generators are attractive to pool owners simply because they eliminate the need to store, buy, transport and handle chlorine. They are not an alternative to chlorine, but actually make their own chlorine from regular table salt. The pool water passes through a generator cell that creates the chlorine within the pool water.[/SIZE]
How Does It Work?
[SIZE=2]As pool water passes through the chlorine generator cell, pumped through by your filter pump, the salt in the water is turned into Hypochlorous acid. Hypochlorous acid is the exact same component that is produced when any chlorine is added to pool water, whether you use sticks, tablets, granular or liquid. As the water returns to the pool, it will introduce the newly produced chlorine, preventing algae, bacteria and killing micro-organisms, creating a safe and sanitary swimming environment.[/SIZE]
OK? How does it really work?
[SIZE=2]T[/SIZE][SIZE=2]his mild, pleasant saline water is sanitized through the process of electrolysis, as mentioned above. The electrolytic cell, through the use of a small electric current, breaks down the water into its basic elements, Hydrogen and Oxygen. By adding small quantities of granulated salt (much like household table salt - NaCI), Hypochlorous Acid (common chlorine) is produced. During the process, the Hypochlorous Acid (Chlorine) is ultimately converted back to salt.Thus, the salt does not get "used up". Salt only needs to be "topped off" once or twice a year and only to replace salt lost due to water splash-out, bather drag off or filter backwashing.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]
[/SIZE]
Salt in My Pool?
[SIZE=2]The salt level required to maintain a safe, chlorinated pool is about 2500 to 4000 PPM (parts per million). The human body cannot taste salt until the PPM is around 5000. As a reference point, the ocean is around 40000 ppm. The amount of salt in the pool is usually not noticeable. Once the salt is added to the pool, there is no need to add salt on a yearly basis unless the pool is drained or a significant amount of water is removed. Also, the salt level is low enough so there is no danger of equipment corrosion. Chlorine generator users also report the water is softer, leaving a more refreshed feeling after swimming.
[/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]
[/SIZE]
Is There Any Maintenance Required?
[SIZE=2]Chlorine generators require very little maintenance. We at Poolcenter.com recommend the generator cell be removed and cleaned on a yearly basis, usually at start up. Remove the cell from the pool plumbing and run a plastic brush through the cell. For calcium deposits, a mild solution of muriatic acid and water will do the job, or to be careful, use the Lo-Chlor Green Cell Plus. The power supply unit requires no regular maintenance.[/SIZE]
[LEFT] [/LEFT] Frequently Asked Questions
[LEFT] [/LEFT] What Type of salt do I add?
[SIZE=2]Avoid Rock Salt as it contains too many impurities! Acceptable salts include Food grade salt, Water softener pellets, Solar salt flakes, Water conditioner salt, or Brine blocks.[/SIZE] Make sure that your salt contains no iodine and is as pure as possible. Sure Soft Pool Salt is accepted by all Chlorine Generator manufacturers.
Where do I add the salt?
[SIZE=2]What is most important when adding salt is to brush it around until it is dissolved. This is accelerated by turning your pump on, opening the bottom drain and adding the salt over the drain, rather than walking around the perimeter while adding the salt. It is recommended that you continue to run the pump for 24 hours so the salt can spread evenly throughout the pool. With Granular salt, 60 - 70% will have dissolved before hitting bottom. The remaining salt can simply be brushed into the drain which will then complete dissolution. With all other forms of salt, it will take longer to dissolve but the same process will accelerate the dissolve rate. Simply brush the salt in a pyramid pattern over the drain to increase dissolution.[/SIZE]
How much salt do I add?
[SIZE=2]Enough for 4000 ppm (parts per million) as a starting point. So depending on the initial salt level of your water, you only add the amount needed to establish 4000 ppm. For new pools or freshly filled pools, the salt level will most likely be zero. In this case, 50lbs of salt per 2,000 gallons of water will establish 4000 ppm. For existing pools, the previous usage of chlorine bleach or tablets will have already introduced a level of salt into the water. Have the water tested first then add the appropriate amount to establish 4000 ppm. [/SIZE]You can test the salt level of your pool using salt test strips, or your local pool store may have the ability to test a sample for you.
What happens if I add too much salt?
[SIZE=2]Over-salting will not harm your chlorine generating system, but will lead to a salty tasting water. For some, this is not undesirable as it will more closely match our bodies natural salinity level, making it more comfortable to swim in. If it is too excessive (over 6000 ppm), you can sustain corrosion damage to metallic equipment such as stainless steel handrails, ladders and filters, light rings, or copper heat exchangers. To reduce the salt level, dilution is the solution. Drain some water and refill with fresh water.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]
[/SIZE]
How often will I need to add salt?
[SIZE=2]After the initial dosage of salt, you will only need to add salt when necessary. The most common ways salt is lost is through leaks, rainwater overflow, filter backwashing, and bather splash-out/carryout. Normal water evaporation does not lose salt, it increases the concentration. The make up water added to bring the water level back to normal will then reduce the salt concentration back to 4000 ppm. Most chlorine generator units have low salt indicators, with Digital Units going further to provide the user with the proper salt amount needed to reestablish 4000 ppm.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]
[/SIZE]
Do I eliminate the need to add chemicals?
[SIZE=2]Chlorine generators do one thing, generate chlorine. However, the purity of this chlorine has less effect on the overall water chemistry balance; therefore, FEWER chemicals are needed re-balance the water. Poolcenter.com recommends periodic (weekly or bi-weekly) testing of stabilizer levels (60 - 80 ppm), Free Chlorine (2 - 4 ppm for pools and 3 - 6 ppm for spas), pH (7.2 - 7.6), and salt levels (2500 - 4000 ppm). Since salt generating chlorine systems do not affect the Total [/SIZE][SIZE=2]Alkalinity or Calcium Hardness, a monthly check is sufficient. In some cases, you might still need to add chlorine for shocking purposes due to extremely heavy bather loads, rainstorms, or accidents, (fertilizer, excessive organic debris or human waste). Shocking the pool will not affect your chlorine generator. [/SIZE]
Will I have to run my equipment more?
[SIZE=2]Your chlorine generator does not rely upon a higher salt level AND extended pump run times in order to generate enough chlorine, provided the cell is properly sized to the pool. Most units allows for multiple configuration set-ups so that you can generate sufficient amounts of chlorine during your current pump circulation time. For regions that have short circulation times, you can increase the output power of the generator to compensate.[/SIZE]
How long will the cell last?
[SIZE=2]The residential cell is rated for approximately 10,000 hours of operation. This typically translates to 3 - 5 years, depending on pool volume, cell size and the sanitizer demands of your pool. Water chemistry balance, salt levels and stabilizer levels are all key factors in ensuring maximum cell life. Proper water chemistry is the key here.[/SIZE] The harder you use the cell, the more you ask of it, the shorter its life span. Annual inspection and cleaning of your salt cell is one of the best things you can do to help delay cell degradation."
I enjoy your posts but trust me your "cut and pasting" responses are taken out of context and it is an incorrect explanation.....
no they are not taken out of context. they might be incorrect buy they are taken directly from the I r pages.. do you understand what out of context means? I assure you you are misusing it here. it is an insulting thin to say-akin to calling me a liar.
virtually all the manufacturer and pool equipment web sites say the the same thing. aybe you are right and all the people who make and sell this stuff are wrong. that happens. look at the assertions made by replacement window makers and sellers (mostly false info) however when you begin spewing accusations of perfidy with nothing at all to back it up, it simply is not very credible.
no they are not taken out of context. they might be incorrect buy they are taken directly from the I r pages.. do you understand what out of context means? I assure you you are misusing it here. it is an insulting thin to say-akin to calling me a liar.
virtually all the manufacturer and pool equipment web sites say the the same thing. aybe you are right and all the people who make and sell this stuff are wrong. that happens. look at the assertions made by replacement window makers and sellers (mostly false info) however when you begin spewing accusations of perfidy with nothing at all to back it up, it simply is not very credible.
"spewing accusations of perfidy"...........really? You might want to get out the old dictionary there before you try to use the "big words!"
Here are a few things that you are clearly mistaken on:
5 chemicals make up pool chemistry including cynauric acid (commonly known as stabilizer). If you have zero stabilizer your pool will burn through salt weekly in the summer. But in the fantasy keyboard land that you live in you know for a fact that salt systems survive on their own byproduct thanks to the sun converting the "hypochlorous acid" back to salt. In your example you would never have to add salt since it regenerates itself and "only needs to be topped off once or twice a year." Clearly not true, run your pool with no stabilizer and you will be adding a 50 lb. bag of salt every 7-10 days! So your theory there just flew right out the window!
In another sample of CJ wisdom the salinity is what makes the water so soft on the eyes/skin. Well if your PH in the water is say 8.2-8.4 your eyes will be "bugging out of your skull like you were just maced" no matter how nice your salt system is working......But in your explanation of eye drops vs. tap water you failed to mention a few considerations (eye drops are not salt water from your pool but rather a product designed to be used in your eyes, tap water has a higher PH level than your eye which is what causes the irritation......somewhat non sequitur statements you made when using the analogy between saline drops and salt water from the pool)......Guess we better cancel your Honorary Optometry Degree!
As I said a few posts ago, I enjoy your posts but on this subject "your internet expertise with cutting and pasting" is misleading in some instances and clearly wrong in others.
Just to self qualify: I have 25 years experience with salt systems from dozens of manufacturers. I know how they work, I know why they don't work in certain circumstances and regardless of what you cut and paste I have real world, blue water experience with them.
Thanks everybody for sharing your input on the pools. We are still waiting on the quotes for the pools. We've asked for fiberglass and concrete. Sure wish to get the quotes sooner; then again maybe once I hear how much it is we will need to rethink a few things
Robyn, I remember you from Jax forum. We've built a house in Las Calinas but still planning out our move to St. Augustine. For now we are still in NY and renting out our house. Earlier this month we were thinking of possibly getting another house in the same community (basically having one investment property and then having our "dream" house) but the prices jumped significantly and the premiums on the lots sky rocketed :-/ So we will do some add-ons to the house we already have and that will be it.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
