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Old 06-24-2017, 03:04 AM
 
106,579 posts, read 108,713,667 times
Reputation: 80063

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everything is easy -until it isn't .

i have had to repair so much in damages over the years self inflicted by people , thinking they were able to do things on their own to a sealed system .

biggest culprit , introducing moisture and air when adding Freon or the system was out of freon and sucked in air . do it your selfer's don't know from pulling a vacuum .
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Old 06-24-2017, 09:05 PM
 
Location: Texas
5,717 posts, read 18,909,338 times
Reputation: 11225
I think the biggest danger from a gas fired HVAC system is the heat exchanger. It can burn thru and it literally forces CO2 into the home. Most builders today prefer to put in heat pumps and not gas fired units to limit liability. With a heat pump, the builder doesn't have to worry about making folks sick or in the extreme, killing a family from CO2. Had a bud that built homes here years back that the guys didn't run the exhaust stack right and it almost killed his family. There's lots to go wrong with gas fired units versus heat pumps. You can't assume every tech that's doing the install has a clue, some don't. Even those with a license make mistakes and it can be costly. Otherwise, a good install, yearly maintenance, and a check up by a good tech should eliminate any issues. Biggest problem we have around here where our units run 8-9 months a year cooling, is with relays burning up. It's a simple replacement as long as you know which is which. That's where a good HVAC tech comes in. Some think they charge too much for the service but like a doctor, you're paying for the knowledge and experience.
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Old 06-25-2017, 05:53 AM
 
Location: The Triad
34,088 posts, read 82,920,234 times
Reputation: 43660
Quote:
Originally Posted by TrapperL View Post
I think the biggest danger from a gas fired HVAC system is the heat exchanger.
It can burn thru and it literally forces CO2 into the home.
After how many years in service?
So the 'biggest risk' is a rather remote one. Right?

Quote:
...around here where our units run 8-9 months a year cooling...
Most builders today prefer to put in heat pumps ...
With a minimal need for heating it can make sense to have only one appliance.

Next reason up is the availability of Natural gas aspect of things.
In many places gas isn't even an option.

Before heat pumps became more reliable...
If gas wasn't available the go to choice was fuel oil.
Farther up north that is still the case.
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Old 06-25-2017, 06:41 AM
 
Location: Johns Creek, GA
17,472 posts, read 66,002,677 times
Reputation: 23621
Quote:
Originally Posted by TrapperL View Post
I think the biggest danger from a gas fired HVAC system is the heat exchanger. It can burn thru and it literally forces CO2 into the home. Most builders today prefer to put in heat pumps and not gas fired units to limit liability. With a heat pump, the builder doesn't have to worry about making folks sick or in the extreme, killing a family from CO2. Had a bud that built homes here years back that the guys didn't run the exhaust stack right and it almost killed his family. There's lots to go wrong with gas fired units versus heat pumps. You can't assume every tech that's doing the install has a clue, some don't. Even those with a license make mistakes and it can be costly. Otherwise, a good install, yearly maintenance, and a check up by a good tech should eliminate any issues. Biggest problem we have around here where our units run 8-9 months a year cooling, is with relays burning up. It's a simple replacement as long as you know which is which. That's where a good HVAC tech comes in. Some think they charge too much for the service but like a doctor, you're paying for the knowledge and experience.


CO2 (carbon dioxide) isn't exactly the killing gas.

CO (carbon monoxide) IS! Most older heat exchangers are culprits for releasing CO into a home when using gas-fired heaters because they have rusted through- not "burned through". Most manufacturers today use stainless steel for the heat exchanger; greatly reducing, if not completely eliminating rust.
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Old 06-25-2017, 08:57 PM
 
13,011 posts, read 13,038,222 times
Reputation: 21914
HVAC is relatively simple when compared to a car, but that isn't a fair comparison. After all, cars have HVAC as well, plus a bunch of other things.

HVAC is probably the most complex system in a house. The three primary, non-structural components of a house are HVAC, electrical and plumbing. All three have distribution systems that go throughout the house, specifically ductwork, wiring and pipes/drains. Electrical and plumbing are metered and connected to external utilities, HVAC draws electrical power and generates its own product (heat/cool). Only HVAC has fans, motors, compressors, etc.

It isn't rocket science, particularly at the residential level, but it is a specialty item.
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Old 06-26-2017, 03:18 AM
 
106,579 posts, read 108,713,667 times
Reputation: 80063
i was a pro drummer back in the 1970's. d-jays were coming on the scene and i saw the hand writing on the wall . i would eventually be obsoleted so i had to find another career .

i ran through every thing i thought i might do that stood a chance of not being obsoleted . i came up with nothing .

then one day i see a commercial for a new school . apex technical school and they did hvac .

i said to myself , self i says , i don't know a thing about this stuff but i know people will rebuild car engines or build their own homes but i don't know anyone who would go in to a sealed system of an ac unit .

so i borrowed more money than i ever thought i would owe and gave it a shot .

well i lied about experience to get my first job as no one wanted you out of school . hated the business as you were either on a hot roof or in a machine room somewhere dying from the heat . everything was dirty and heavy .

so eventually i learned the control end and learned to troubleshoot the complex mall climate control systems .

eventually i decided to sell commercial ac systems and ended up working for a company who sold ac and refrigeration gear but was also an allen bradley motor control distributor .

i learned the allen bradley end and slid over to factory automation equipment and designing control panels and became a motor control specialists .

40 years later i retired from a pretty good career . today i work one day a week in retirement teaching motor controls and variable frequency drives at a distributor .

havac provided the basis to go off in so many lucrative directions because the public stays away .

making money is all about doing the things others can't or won't do for themselves
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Old 06-26-2017, 02:09 PM
 
17,563 posts, read 15,226,764 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mathjak107 View Post
making money is all about doing the things others can't or won't do for themselves

General public shouldn't be mucking around with sealed systems.. I went to school for Electronics.. Technically Industrial Electronics.. PLCs, motor controls, etc.. But got enough of a background that it's no problem repairing a TV, dryer, fridge, etc.. But I won't mess around with a sealed system.



thing is.. 90% of HVAC failures (or fridges) have nothing to do with the sealed system. The go-tos on a home AC unit are the cap and the contactor while with a home fridge it generally winds up being evap fan motors or thermostats.
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Old 06-26-2017, 02:20 PM
 
106,579 posts, read 108,713,667 times
Reputation: 80063
low on refrigerant is common too in home ac units . the units eventually seep it out through eventual porous spots in joints and coils and sealing rings . access valves are common points too on bigger systems
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Old 02-28-2019, 12:33 AM
 
Location: California
6 posts, read 4,605 times
Reputation: 10
HAVC mainly includes the following parts:

1. Air conditioning system (control of air temperature and humidity)

2. New air supply system (maintaining positive indoor pressure and conveying fresh air)

3. Smoke exhaust system (exhaust gas after gas extinguishing, protective equipment)

4. Air conditioning room

5. External network of air conditioning

6. Air conditioning terminal: air conditioning air tray setting
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Old 03-03-2019, 08:02 AM
 
12,016 posts, read 12,746,342 times
Reputation: 13420
Quote:
Originally Posted by TrapperL View Post
I think the biggest danger from a gas fired HVAC system is the heat exchanger. It can burn thru and it literally forces CO2 into the home. Most builders today prefer to put in heat pumps and not gas fired units to limit liability. With a heat pump, the builder doesn't have to worry about making folks sick or in the extreme, killing a family from CO2. Had a bud that built homes here years back that the guys didn't run the exhaust stack right and it almost killed his family. There's lots to go wrong with gas fired units versus heat pumps. You can't assume every tech that's doing the install has a clue, some don't. Even those with a license make mistakes and it can be costly. Otherwise, a good install, yearly maintenance, and a check up by a good tech should eliminate any issues. Biggest problem we have around here where our units run 8-9 months a year cooling, is with relays burning up. It's a simple replacement as long as you know which is which. That's where a good HVAC tech comes in. Some think they charge too much for the service but like a doctor, you're paying for the knowledge and experience.
You should always have a CO2 monitor if your house burns fuel. If like me you are in south Florida and have only electric appliances and no garage and no fireplace you will never need a CO2 because you are not burning fuel in the house. I remember seeing a report on the news many years ago about the dangers and bought one for my father's house and sister's house up north. I don't think they ended up using them and you can't force someone. Most people don't wake up to a danger unless they see it happening in their own environment. People assume it will not happen to them because it has not happened to anyone they know.

As far as car AC's go an AC mechanic explained it to me when I called to see if I needed more freeon as I call it or AC coolant. He told me the AC is a closed system. You should never need more coolant unless you have a leak and if you have a leak you need to have it fixed because adding more won't fix it. I realized my problem was turning on my car AC too soon while the car was still hot not letting the AC work right.

As far as ACs themselves or central AC and heating system they are a mystery to me. I also have a window AC in my master when I don't need to cool the whole house and that's a mystery too, sometimes it will leak water into the room in drips but right now it's working fine. at 2 different times it made this terrible loud noise like something inside was grinding and then an hour later it war working fine.
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