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Panama City Homeowner: I know the particulars of this situation and I would like to share. The contractor was paid all of the contract price with only $8,000 retained for the damages that other contractors want $20,000 to correct. The swimming pool and enclosure were completely separate and were contracted by the homeowners to other companies and that ticked the builder off as he wanted the commission.
Bringing breakfast to the crew is an act of kindness not an attempt to "pick up a contractor"
The extras offered as advertising promos and throw ins were small token items.
The homeowners saved the contractor's butt by discovering big things like the conduit was not set under the slab for three floor outlets. Homeowners brought it to the attention of the contractor just in time before the concrete was poured. That produced a token gift as a thank you. Also the homeowners discovered that the framers were building with a preliminary set of plans and windows had been resized for code. That also produced a thank you. This was the nicest house that the contractor had built and it was the first in a new neighborhood that he wanted to build. He was given permission by the homeowners to have a rendering done for advertising. He made a made a small cosmetic change to the framing around the garage doors. No big deal... And he provided it with the agreement that it was at no additional cost. This was when things were good and lthe crew had fresh baked muffins and pastries delivered.
Payadvances, the contractor rubbed the little token gifts that he called "favors" in their face and said that he now needed a favor from them. Talk about a gilt trip!! They paid him early all but on the last payment which was paid on the day of the final inspection with only 8,000 withheld until repairs were completed. He refused to complete the repairs and collect his 8,000.. The attorneys wrote that agreement on retaining the 8,000 for repair work.
There was never any invoice, bill or notice requesting payment. Following the contractor being refused his demands for a pay advance of the final payment he went into a violent rage resulting in criminal charges being filed and only after that did the the subject of "change orders" come up. He never sent a bill or invoice just a notice from a lawyer. To this day, full disclosure is not available.
The contractors that were so quick to jump to the conclusion that he was not paid this is a recap for you. The only amount that the contractor is out is the 8,000 retainage that he could collect at any time when the repairs are made. The pool and enclosure had nothing to do with him but were an irritant as the homeowners contracted out work that he had wanted. The homeowner just wants to use this story to save others from making the same mistakes. I am sure glad to know that other states have their share of dirty contractors. At least this contractor is likeable. I was beginning to think that Florida a good place to escape from but now I realize that creepy contractors are lurking everywhere.
I live in Panama City and I know about this situation. It is not really that difficult to explain what happened. The family had a few bucks saved and contracted to pay him in cash. The contractor provided some small extras in good faith and never planned to charge the homeowers for them until the contractor had some money problems and depended on these homeowners to advance him money as they always had in the past. He owed alot of money to alot of people and the other jobs were financed through a bank and therefore no advances were possible. The contractor and the female homeowner had gotten along good and then had a fallling out over another request for a pay advance. he got violent and criminal charges were filed. He said that he was being railroaded and then as payback lashed out by filiing a lien. All he claims that the homeowners owe him for is the $9,000 that they held out for repairs.
The homeowners now have repair estimates claiming repairs will cost about double that. He was also ticked off that that he came down on price to meet their budget then they hired another company to put in a swimming pool and enclosure. He wanted to bid on the job but wasn't given the chance. So, he lost the commission on that and the pool was seen as a slap in the face when the homeowners had money to put in a pool but cut him off from pay advances. He does have a criminal record but, so do most of the other contractors in the State of Florida. So, to the answer to your question. It is revenge not deception. The extras I believe were offered in good faith, then he got mad so he's tacked on another 25,000 but doesn't have anything in writing and knows there is a slim chance that a judge will find in his favor.
Im stuck between thanking you for clearing things up and my renewed suspicions of the last 2 posters.
Isn't it odd that both the last 2 posts defending the homeowner are both brand new with only one post? I suspect fraud and wonder if a moderater might check the IP address of the poster/s. I believe both the last 2 posts are of the same person. The chances of 2 people living close enough together in the same housing tract and knowing each others financial business is so very small. Especially since the OP said her home was the first one built in that tract meaning she has no neighbors.
No way man. Way too many coincidences. I smell fraud.
Besides, none of the numbers add up. The OP claimed she did not make the final payment of $30,000 I think it was and here some stranger comes on and says no way it was only $8,000.
I smell fraud. Corruption Buster???? Gimme a break.
This thread is too funny/entertaining... what's this stupid poll going to tell the original poster anyways? I especially like the two "new" posters chiming in with her two cents (lol). Is she going to present this poll as evidence in claims court?
PC Homeowner is my new account as I lost my password and couldn't log in. I tried to provide the information that was requested. Thank you for the helpful responses. Even those from the contractors who seem to have alot of time on their hands that allowed them to make such long and negative posts. Even my contractor doesn't have that kind of time on his hands and I'm quite sure that he would never be so nasty to a stranger just looking for help.
ATTENTION HOMEOWNERS, PLEASE LEARN FROM MY MISTAKES!
1. Always do a background check. There are states that will license ex-cons and convicted felons!
2. Get every thing in writing. A little "favor" now could turn into a big dispute later!
3. Keep your distance. Serving food or trying to be friendly may be mistaken for something else!
4. Don't call the references that the contractor gives you, as they are guaranteed to be glowing.
Instead get the names off past permits from your building dept. It is public record. Call them!
5. Refuse all beggings and pleadings for pay advances no matter what he threatens to do. You should request proof of the contractor's financial stability before signing the contracts!
6. Don't hire other contractors for additional projects until your current contractor is out of the picture so that there won't be any resentment over giving work to another company!
7. Don't be fooled by someone who tries too hard to win you over. They may be up to something!
8. Don't use pubic forums to ask for help as there is always going to be hate mongers on line!
9. Don't assume that all contractors are bad just because you had a bad experience I contracted with several contractors and suppliers and this was my only bad apple!
10. The biggest thing that I have learned from your responses is that Florida isn't the only state that has horrible contractors. They are obviously in Michigan and Texas as well. I can tell by the posts by Mr. Driller and Mr. Desertsun that they have scammed more than their share of homeowners. I hope that my post will help protect homeowners from the likes of them.
This is Panamacityhomeowner signing off permanently. It is a waste of my time to read nasy posts from contractors when I have the warm gulf of mexico just 5 minutes away. I'm off to the beach!!
PC Homeowner is my new account as I lost my password and couldn't log in. I tried to provide the information that was requested. Thank you for the helpful responses. Even those from the contractors who seem to have alot of time on their hands that allowed them to make such long and negative posts. Even my contractor doesn't have that kind of time on his hands and I'm quite sure that he would never be so nasty to a stranger just looking for help.
ATTENTION HOMEOWNERS, PLEASE LEARN FROM MY MISTAKES!
1. Always do a background check. There are states that will license ex-cons and convicted felons!
2. Get every thing in writing. A little "favor" now could turn into a big dispute later!
3. Keep your distance. Serving food or trying to be friendly may be mistaken for something else!
4. Don't call the references that the contractor gives you, as they are guaranteed to be glowing.
Instead get the names off past permits from your building dept. It is public record. Call them!
5. Refuse all beggings and pleadings for pay advances no matter what he threatens to do. You should request proof of the contractor's financial stability before signing the contracts!
6. Don't hire other contractors for additional projects until your current contractor is out of the picture so that there won't be any resentment over giving work to another company!
7. Don't be fooled by someone who tries too hard to win you over. They may be up to something!
8. Don't use pubic forums to ask for help as there is always going to be hate mongers on line!
9. Don't assume that all contractors are bad just because you had a bad experience I contracted with several contractors and suppliers and this was my only bad apple!
10. The biggest thing that I have learned from your responses is that Florida isn't the only state that has horrible contractors. They are obviously in Michigan and Texas as well. I can tell by the posts by Mr. Driller and Mr. Desertsun that they have scammed more than their share of homeowners. I hope that my post will help protect homeowners from the likes of them.
This is Panamacityhomeowner signing off permanently. It is a waste of my time to read nasy posts from contractors when I have the warm gulf of mexico just 5 minutes away. I'm off to the beach!!
All your points are dead on correct on how to choose a good contractor.
But all your credibility is long gone already. I guessed right. You were the same person indeed signing on as the OP. You said so many lies that you forgot them all. From $30,000 to $8,000 while claiming to be the neighbor in one and admitting you just signed on as the OP with a new name in another. I believe that is against the TOU here.
Have fun on the beach with the money you stole from Jeff.
I hate crooked contractors more then the next person but I think Jeff prevails here. [SIZE=6][/SIZE]
This started out as a simple fraud / deception case with maybe a hint of revenge. We have just learned so much along the way.
This may play out like one of those episodes on General Hospital.
Could Jeff move to Oil City, PA and scam a new resident who only paid $50K for a perfect house but now decide he wants a swimming pool?
I am still unclear about Jeff's felon status or if he finally got more than cookies. Like some of those episodes on the afternoon soaps, you lose track of exactly what happened after Susan knew that Ronald knew that Joe had told Charlotte's mother.
Just for the record, it is a lot harder to get away with this bad contractor business that is being batted around. You can be charged with a criminal offense if you get too far off the reservation. Especially if standard business practices are not followed.
PC Homeowner is my new account as I lost my password and couldn't log in. I tried to provide the information that was requested. Thank you for the helpful responses. Even those from the contractors who seem to have alot of time on their hands that allowed them to make such long and negative posts. Even my contractor doesn't have that kind of time on his hands and I'm quite sure that he would never be so nasty to a stranger just looking for help.
ATTENTION HOMEOWNERS, PLEASE LEARN FROM MY MISTAKES!
1. Always do a background check. There are states that will license ex-cons and convicted felons!
2. Get every thing in writing. A little "favor" now could turn into a big dispute later!
3. Keep your distance. Serving food or trying to be friendly may be mistaken for something else!
4. Don't call the references that the contractor gives you, as they are guaranteed to be glowing.
Instead get the names off past permits from your building dept. It is public record. Call them!
5. Refuse all beggings and pleadings for pay advances no matter what he threatens to do. You should request proof of the contractor's financial stability before signing the contracts!
6. Don't hire other contractors for additional projects until your current contractor is out of the picture so that there won't be any resentment over giving work to another company!
7. Don't be fooled by someone who tries too hard to win you over. They may be up to something!
8. Don't use pubic forums to ask for help as there is always going to be hate mongers on line!
9. Don't assume that all contractors are bad just because you had a bad experience I contracted with several contractors and suppliers and this was my only bad apple!
10. The biggest thing that I have learned from your responses is that Florida isn't the only state that has horrible contractors. They are obviously in Michigan and Texas as well. I can tell by the posts by Mr. Driller and Mr. Desertsun that they have scammed more than their share of homeowners. I hope that my post will help protect homeowners from the likes of them.
This is Panamacityhomeowner signing off permanently. It is a waste of my time to read nasy posts from contractors when I have the warm gulf of mexico just 5 minutes away. I'm off to the beach!!
Mr. Driller has NEVER scammed anyone. I do not have to. I SIGN CONTRACTS!!!!! I am not hiding behind a screen name. If you go to my profile, look on the well rig. You will have my business name and phone number.
Hi Driller. First off you made me giggle when you said whiners will always be back. You are right on. Especially when they say they will never come back. They must come back to see the responses kinda like those who commit arson must come back to watch the results.
Anyway....I trust your an honest contractor. I can tell by the way people talk what kind of person they are.
I wont claim t know your business farther then the time I spend watching what you do. Im just as curious as Joe Smoe homeowner while watching well drillers. But maybe your job does not have as many things that can go wrong so your contracts are small. Correct me if Im wrong. Building a home has thousands and thousands of tiny details that can not even be written. Many are personal taste things rather then something that can be built.
I and Im sure others might love to get an idea of strange details you might have to write to protect yourself from complainers.
Me personally have some items to specify but not as much as a whole house either. Past the color, species of wood, door style, trim types and product line there are few other options to write in other then making a 3D drawing/rendering of what the new kitchen or entertainment center will look like. Still people find something to pick on to avoid paying. Some one might say they didnt know the color was so light or dark. Others say they thought something came with this or that even though the cabinet is in the showroom that they picked. I have had on more then one occasion a person ripped off a piece of crown molding from a kitchen I just put in to bring in and compare with what is in the showroom cause they thought it was different. Then they insisted I come put it back on for them at no charge.
So I and perhaps others might love for you too to share contract problems you might have to handle. I suspect others might like to hear the other side from contractors like you and I. In the long run, with eductated consumers, and more sensitive contractors there will be smoother tranactions.
Other contractors can chime in too....
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Wow this is getting far out.......
